is this slander?

[fairisfair]

the thing about child services is there doesn't have to be a "legal right" to take children from the home only an opinion based on someone who's most likely more biased than I am. If this hotel manager is in fact spreading lies about you, then you should at least CYA because all he has to do is make an anonymous phone call and you'll be defending yourself. Child Services is more "guilty until proven innocent" because they claim they have the childs best interest in mind. Check out the laws, and talk to others who have been through the CPS system.

and for the record, I'm not saying "stop helping the homeless" I'm saying "help them rejoin society" or rather "help them differently" - there's nothing prejudice about that, it simply helps weed out the people who choose to abuse the good nature of others.

what's that line, "give a man a fish and he eats for a day, teach a man to fish and he eats for a lifetime."

You live in a southern climate area - why not have picnic's where you can bring all sorts of food, if you still feel required to feed the homeless, that way you can be in an outdoor, social situation, in full public view - and hey, Picnic's are fun. While at that picnic, might I suggest you maybe bring information for these folks to help them get back on their feet.

--Dave

P.S. simply stating you won't recognize my post, calling me a name, and then telling me to stick to the points at hand is a response. And where in that post were you addressing the original point at hand.

You may well have something to add to the forum, and of course everyone has the right to their personal opinion, whether or not we like yours However, continuing to call out a well respected senior member of the forum, is not in your best interest. Sticking to the point is.

 

[BelizeBreeze]

the thing about child services is there doesn't have to be a "legal right" to take children from the home only an opinion based on someone who's most likely more biased than I am. If this hotel manager is in fact spreading lies about you, then you should at least CYA because all he has to do is make an anonymous phone call and you'll be defending yourself. Child Services is more "guilty until proven innocent" because they claim they have the childs best interest in mind. Check out the laws, and talk to others who have been through the CPS system.

Arizona Revised Statute 8-821 gives Child Protective Services the absolute right to remove a child and place said child into protective custody absent a complaint from a third-party.

 

[David Jonathan]

Arizona Revised Statute 8-821 gives Child Protective Services the absolute right to remove a child and place said child into protective custody absent a complaint from a third-party.

yeah, because filling the foster care system is better then trying to find family counceling ... right? (sarcasm)

::shakes head:: it's sad that laws like this are required, however it's even more sad how much of an abuse of power some of these agencies have.

am I wrong in saying: Even though they don't need a third-party complaint, having one can speed up the process or bring attention to a family that truly doesn't need it.

--Dave

P.S. BelizeBreeze, I apoligize for being an ass - my original point didn't come off as I had intended.

 

[fairisfair]

perhaps it might help everyone here to understand this poster a little better by understanding a little more about the town of Bisbee. It was originally a mining town and in 1975 when Phelps Dodge stopped operations there, the town almost came to it's knees completely. Since that time the town has been reborn due to the influx of artists and "hippies" that have made the town their home. It is a small town feel and those of us that remember the sixties and/or seventies may better understand the attitude of the open door policy that this poster seems to have for those he considers to be his friends and neighbors, we are not talking about Los Angeles or something here. I seriously doubt that this poster has anything to fear from CPS and am hopeful that common sense would rule when it came to posing any threat to his family by his sense of generosity.

 

[BelizeBreeze]

yeah, because filling the foster care system is better then trying to find family counceling ... right? (sarcasm)

::shakes head:: it's sad that laws like this are required, however it's even more sad how much of an abuse of power some of these agencies have.

am I wrong in saying: Even though they don't need a third-party complaint, having one can speed up the process or bring attention to a family that truly doesn't need it.

--Dave

P.S. BelizeBreeze, I apoligize for being an ass - my original point didn't come off as I had intended.

I appreciate the thought David. And I accept. It's hard enough to deal with some of the issues here without letting our own idea of how things SHOULD be interfer. The only issue I have with most posters (aside from blatant ignorance) is the inability to research their position to insure it's valid and when they completely ignore legal theory and fact.

I won't give you my take on right or wrong in this thread. Simply put, the law is in place not for one person, but for all within the group. It sometimes fails, sometimes succeeds. Regardless, it is in place for a very good reason, children cannot speak for themselves.

I think we can all agree on that.

 

[David Jonathan]

Oh, I won't argue that these laws are in fact needed - believe me, the area that I live in, laws like these are used quite a bit due to the recent rise in drug usage and sales.

I'd guess the removal of children from the home when not necessary is extremely low (I won't post any numbers, as I don't know them off hand)

With more knowledge about the town, I can see how a concern like this is "less qualified"

I would see this as a good opportunity for everyone (IE: using e-bay to sell original artworks for artists, at a small fee so they can get back on their feet, etc.)

Let’s see if we can get back on topic, I do apologize for hijacking this thread.

Anyhow, one thing I don't think has been answered 100% clearly is "at what point does this hotel/motel managers comments become slander, libel, or defamation"

--Dave.

 

[BelizeBreeze]

Anyhow, one thing I don't think has been answered 100% clearly is "at what point does this hotel/motel managers comments become slander, lible, or defamation"

--Dave.

One second after a judge says "Guilty" and bangs the gavel in a defamation lawsuit

 

[seniorjudge]

One second after a judge says "Guilty" and bangs the gavel in a defamation lawsuit

I respectfully disagree.

Q: Anyhow, one thing I don't think has been answered 100% clearly is "at what point does this hotel/motel managers comments become slander, lible (sic), or defamation"?

A: One second after the appellate judge says "Affirmed" and bangs the gavel in a defamation lawsuit.

 

[Quaere]

I answered the actual legal question in post #11 of this thread.

 

[rmosher1515]

about the slander..and classism.

so if i have a police report in hand that says this guy stated as fact that i am doing this, would i get a lawyer to bite on this without me having the money to do it, or is it even something i could do on my on? or is it still just not that sure of a win?

david, i had hoped to make it clear without the gruelling details, i/we do lots for eachother. i mean, it's not like i just feed people and that's all..it's not even like i'm on some charity, feelgood mission. it's called life. supporting my community. dealing with crisis both big and small. we feed eachother. we help eachother find work. give rides. house cleaning. babysitting. emotional support. i could go on and on. it's interesting that this is accually directly related to this slander situation.you see, bisbee is being gentrified. this guy with the acussations thinks he is a big player here. he's not well liked, and for good reason. reasons like this tactic he has of making life hard for those he sees as bad for this so-called "progress". again, he has done this before; false police reports, refusing entry to his many buildings downtown based on false accusations of drug use or vandalism or whatever he thinks of, spreading lies on a local internet forum (saying that a freind of mine, who is dieing of cancer and living in his van, was dealing meth to kids in the park), using meth awareness meetings to accuse people serving coffee in the park of smoking meth in the open, etc.. so to me, this is about taking the wind out of his sails as far as what i believe is an ongoing pattern of slander for his personal gain. anyway..

 

[seniorjudge]

Until you could show a truckload of damages and a very rich defendant, I doubt that you could get a lawyer to take your case.

 

[David Jonathan]

okay. So you are in fact helping people beyond just feeding them. I think that's the only point I really wanted to make. Helping beyond the "Easy" route is important. People need Love and Support, not just a quick meal, and as you stated, you're providing that. And for those actions, I applaud you. Not too many people have the courage to actaully help.

I don't know if you could do this, but a question to probably ask is could you get a lot of people together who've all been defamed by this guy, and maybe a "class action" type thing. Rather then having one person with a LOT of damages, have a lot of people with a small amount of damages. I don't know the laws regarding class action suits, or anything of that nature, but it might be a route you could explore.

--Dave.

 

[rmosher1515]

actionable?

so again, what about words being actionable in themselves.

 

[Quaere]

so if i have a police report in hand that says this guy stated as fact that i am doing this,

No. Any report made directly to the police is privileged so it cannot support a defamation claim.

It he made statements that you are engaged in criminal activity, to people other than the police, and it is not true, THAT would be actionable.

 

[rmosher1515]

and

so if statements made are in fact actionable, doesn't that mean damages do not need to be shown?