Bought Car On Ebay

[TRACCCEEE]

What is the name of your state? Georgia
I bought a car on Ebay from a car dealer in Georgia. The car was listed as in "Excellent Overall Condition" and having recently had a "major service". We had the car for 32 hours and drove it a total of 157 miles.....the car had to be towed to the Volvo dealership where we were told that someone had done a valve job to it prior to us owning it and did not put them back correctly and now the car has a cracked head and needs $3000-$4000 work. The used car dealer says "tough luck".....We do not have a warranty but....
32 hours......157 miles......Any suggestions?

 

[seniorjudge]

You bought a used car on eBay and you are now not happy because....

That's where you lost me.

 

[averad]

Car was sold as is and you had no inspection done prior to purchase, seems like the fault is on you.

 

[CraigFL]

Rather than look at it as "fault", you seem to just have "bad luck" . Probably a pre-purchase inspection would not have shown the problem with the valves-- maybe if a compression/leakdown test was done. Maybe the opinion of the Volvo(OEM) dealer was that it was assembled incorrectly because it wasn't assembled/done exactly as the factory workshop manual. This doesn't make it wrong but only "may" be wrong. It may or may not have contributed to the end result of the cracked head.

The real bottom line is that if you buy a used car it's a gamble. A lot of people trade them in when they know something is wrong or maintenance is coming up. You can somewhat reduce your chances of expending lots of money with a used car by buying an extended warranty, otherwise you are self-insured....

 

[David Jonathan]

something like a cracked head doesn't just happen over night - it's something that takes time.

if the valves were installed wrong (no clue how that would work, put valve in head, place valve guide seal, spring, retainer - that's one thing that's pretty standard to all engines) you'll need to find proof of that

MY guess if you want my opinion is that the "recent major service" was a timing belt that broke and bent a valve - bent valve either cracked or at least damaged head - they probably just pulled the head, replaced the valve, and didn't grind or cut the valv seat, or even lapped the valve in - so they just replaced valve and belt and hoped for the best. Ask the guy who inspected the engine if the head is cracked between the valve seats ... 10 to 1 says it is. If he says he hasn't pulled the head, then he can't verify that it is actually cracked.

The dealer probably won't offer up any records of the work done nicely, so you may have to start pullin' their teeth to get this taken care of. The vehicle was sold "not as discribed" ... even with an "As is" sale, I believe* they still have to disclose any damage the vehicle may or may not have.

as for needing 3 - 4k worth of work - that's BS - Find a shop who can replace the head, and give you a guarentee on their work. You don't need a "brand new" head, you can probably find a clean head at a junkyard, and just have that rebuilt - it will be far less expensive. The only thing that MAY cause issues in the future is if that bent valve (if that was the case) tagged the piston and put a crack in it. Usually it will just dent the piston, and shorten it's life - but I've driven on engines like that pleanty of times. I wouldn't personally guarentee anything like that, but I'd sure disclose it to the new owner.

You really need more information before you can attempt to pursue anything with this car.

--Dave.

 

[fairisfair]

something like a cracked head doesn't just happen over night - it's something that takes time.

if the valves were installed wrong (no clue how that would work, put valve in head, place valve guide seal, spring, retainer - that's one thing that's pretty standard to all engines) you'll need to find proof of that

MY guess if you want my opinion is that the "recent major service" was a timing belt that broke and bent a valve - bent valve either cracked or at least damaged head - they probably just pulled the head, replaced the valve, and didn't grind or cut the valv seat, or even lapped the valve in - so they just replaced valve and belt and hoped for the best. Ask the guy who inspected the engine if the head is cracked between the valve seats ... 10 to 1 says it is. If he says he hasn't pulled the head, then he can't verify that it is actually cracked.

The dealer probably won't offer up any records of the work done nicely, so you may have to start pullin' their teeth to get this taken care of. The vehicle was sold "not as discribed" ... even with an "As is" sale, I believe* they still have to disclose any damage the vehicle may or may not have.

as for needing 3 - 4k worth of work - that's BS - Find a shop who can replace the head, and give you a guarentee on their work. You don't need a "brand new" head, you can probably find a clean head at a junkyard, and just have that rebuilt - it will be far less expensive. The only thing that MAY cause issues in the future is if that bent valve (if that was the case) tagged the piston and put a crack in it. Usually it will just dent the piston, and shorten it's life - but I've driven on engines like that pleanty of times. I wouldn't personally guarentee anything like that, but I'd sure disclose it to the new owner.

You really need more information before you can attempt to pursue anything with this car.

--Dave.

Ah, Dave, the mechanic in you is coming out I think the poster was more interested in her possible actions against the seller.

 

[David Jonathan]

yeah ... 2 years of schooling, and 10 years in the field will do that to me.

Anyhow, the basic point behind my post is they need a LOT more information before they can even considder seeking damages.

an example would be ...

radiator hose broke - engine overheated. That too can crack the head, and it'd be no fault of the dealer, because there'd be nothing they should've disclosed. Cheap gas, and running the engine too hard can do that too (especially if this is a turbocharged engine). This could cause "knock" or "Detonation" in the engine which can quickly wreck things. (I lost an engine while at the racetrack because I was cheap and went with the lower grade gasoline to save a couple bucks) Detonation can produce symptoms that LOOK like bad valves, when in fact it was the detonation itself that caused the problem, and without pulling the engine apart, you'd never be able to prove or disprove this.

The problem with detonation is it can be caused by so many things ... bad fuel, plugged fuel filter, bad injector, bad spark plugs, bad spark plug wires, incorrect timing, driving too hard for too long, etc. so proving anyone was at fault for it is next to impossible.

that's why they need to get ALL the facts about the engine, what happened, how it happened, what work was done before, etc.

--Dave.

 

[fairisfair]

except that they won't have a case anyway, unless they purchased some form of warranty, the car was bought as is.

 

[David Jonathan]

Tis true ... they really don't have a case ...

HOWEVER - if they approach the dealer in a KIND fassion, and explain the situation, the dealer may be willing to offer something to make up for the loss, even if it's something as small as offering their "dealer discount" at a good shop.

--Dave.

 

[fairisfair]

Tis true ... they really don't have a case ...

HOWEVER - if they approach the dealer in a KIND fassion, and explain the situation, the dealer may be willing to offer something to make up for the loss, even if it's something as small as offering their "dealer discount" at a good shop.

--Dave.

wow, where are those car dealers??? Not here, that is for sho'!!!!

 

[David Jonathan]

wow, where are those car dealers??? Not here, that is for sho'!!!!

I bought a car locally here "as is" ... the clutch went out ON MY WAY HOME ... I called the dealership, I was extremely friendly, explained the situation, the dealership was very kind, offered to let me use their discount for the parts. although it may not seem like much, but it saved me about $250 - and that was very nice of them.

so not all those dealerships are slime, some will help out, just for the good word of mouth.

--Dave.

 

[David Jonathan]

If this car was bought from a dealership then they are required by law to give a 30 day warranty. Car Dealerships cannot sell cars "As IS"! There are Lemon Laws to protect consumers.

You need to call the local Internal Revenue Dealer Licensing dept. or titles and registrations dept. In the state that the dealership is in, and find out what your options are, as laws do vary from state to state.

Sorry, there is NO 'used car' lemon law in Georgia.

in Georgia, when you buy a car that is "As Is" there is No warrantee at all. If you want to be helpful, at least look up the law, just to make sure you're not sending people on a crazy adventure to nowhere.

--Dave.