Discharged College Tuition. Can't get transcripts

[Desperate4Advic]

What is the name of your state? California

I filed for Chapter 7 bankruptcy and included my tuition to a private instituition. They were suing me for $$$ and tried to get a judgment passed on me. Since it was not a school loan that was Federally protected I was able to file. I went to this school for two semesters, the 1st semester I am paying through student loans and am current on payment and almost done paying off; however, the 2nd semester I withdrew a week after the deadline to be reimbursed due to personal issues. I received W's for the entire semester. Moving on, since filing Chapter 7, I have contacted the school to obtain my student transcript which they are refusing to give to me unless they receive a court order to do so. They are claiming that bankruptcy only halts their collection attempt, but I would need to pay the $$$ in order to get my transcript. What can I do? I am paying for the 1st semester through student loans which has the credits I want, but filed on 5 W's on my transcript. They said they do not give partial transcripts and I would have to pay my $$$ I filed in order to receive it. Is this legal? Or is there anyway around this and what type of court order would I need? Please advise!!!

 

[TigerD]

They are claiming that bankruptcy only halts their collection attempt, but I would need to pay the 13500 in order to get my transcript. What can I do? I am paying for the 1st semester through student loans which has the credits I want, but filed on 5 W's on my transcript. They said they do not give partial transcripts and I would have to pay my 13500 I filed in order to receive it. Is this legal? Or is there anyway around this and what type of court order would I need? Please advise!!!

Yup it's legal. If you want to get their work product, you are going to have to pay the $13,500.

They can't come after you for the balance -- but they can't be forced to do business with you either.

DC

 

[Desperate4Advic]

Thanks for the response, but they have the rights to hold onto my 1st semester credits even though I am basically going to have it paid off in 6months? There is no way to get a partial transcript for what I have paid for because "their internal" rules say so? This is quite depressing..

 

[Silverplum]

Thanks for the response, but they have the rights to hold onto my 1st semester credits even though I am basically going to have it paid off in 6months? There is no way to get a partial transcript for what I have paid for because "their internal" rules say so? This is quite depressing..

When you "basically" pay it off, then they may wish to do further business with you.

I've gotta say: You've got a lot of nerve!

 

[Desperate4Advic]

When you "basically" pay it off, then they may wish to do further business with you.

I've gotta say: You've got a lot of nerve!

First, basically pay off was in reference to the student loan that was taken out through Sallie Mae not in regard to the 13500. So I am not sure how they would consider doing business with me if that was paid off. 2nd, before you have the audacity to say a comment such as "you've got a lot of nerve" you should know the story before speaking. Personal reasons for me withdrawing stemmed from family problems, that forced me to not even continue school and help take care of my mother when my grandfather passed away as well as find scrounge up money to ship his body back to another country, and have a funeral so for you to say I have a lot of nerve, really offends me. It's not like anyone wants to file bankruptcy, I spoke to my bankruptcy lawyer before I even filed and he said I would be able to get my transcripts since I had no income coming in and wanted to resume school,and coming to find out he was incorrect. Just would appreciate some constructive advice and not some immature jargon out of an ignorant person to my personal situation.


On to more relevant matters, does anyone know what type of court order they are saying needs to be issued for them to release my 1st semester transcript?

 

[Ladynred]

Whoa now. If this tuition debt - if NOT a school loan - was discharged in bankruptcy, then they can NOT withhold your transcripts and they can NOT coerce you to pay a debt discharged in bankruptcy !

There is case law regarding bankruptcy discharge and transcripts:

If you file for bankruptcy and receive a discharge of the (money owed), the school can no longer withhold your records (in re Gustafson 111B.R. 282 (9th Cir. BAP 1990).)

You might want to contact your BK lawyer and ask him about this case law. You may have a chance.

 

[Desperate4Advic]

Whoa now. If this tuition debt - if NOT a school loan - was discharged in bankruptcy, then they can NOT withhold your transcripts and they can NOT coerce you to pay a debt discharged in bankruptcy !

There is case law regarding bankruptcy discharge and transcripts:



You might want to contact your BK lawyer and ask him about this case law. You may have a chance.

Do you know where I can find this article online? And yes, it was a straight college tuition not a student loan (I am paying the student loan back right now). The lady at the controller office told me that she doesn't have to release the records to me and they can't give out partial transcripts and that I should contact her via phone to further discuss options for me to obtain my transcripts. Thank you for your help.

Again if you can send me a link or what not, I would greatly appreciate it. Thanks much..

 

[Desperate4Advic]

Yup it's legal. If you want to get their work product, you are going to have to pay the $13,500.

They can't come after you for the balance -- but they can't be forced to do business with you either.

DC

What reference are you using when saying that they can't be forced to give me my transcripts. After reading lady and red's advice, I've read 4 different references on a few cases that say otherwise. So case law would rule in my situation that the school would have to release my transcripts or they will be in violation of "automatic stay". Please confirm if this is correct or you still believe otherwise. Any advice would be most appreciated. Thank you.

 

[TigerD]

What reference are you using when saying that they can't be forced to give me my transcripts. After reading lady and red's advice, I've read 4 different references on a few cases that say otherwise. So case law would rule in my situation that the school would have to release my transcripts or they will be in violation of "automatic stay". Please confirm if this is correct or you still believe otherwise. Any advice would be most appreciated. Thank you.

I believe otherwise. It isn't the first issue LNR and I have disagreed about. Now, remember that I run a collection agency and I am not an attorney -- to the best of my knowledge neither is anyone else that responded.

While LNR and I disagree on a few fine points, her advice is generally excellent and I'd recommending researching her opinion to see if it applies to your case.

I don't believe they are in violation of the automatic stay because they are not coming after you. You went to them. Second, BK removes your obligation for the debt -- but it does not eliminate the debt. Also, you have a bad business record with them. Now you are asking them to do fulfill a promise, that promise being to create, maintain and provide copies records.

As the cite from a a 2002 case below will show, this is a far from settled issue that could go either way. I fall on the not a violation side of the argument-- but you are in California, they are known to pretty weird out there ... so...

In Strumpf, Citizen's Bank placed an administrative hold on the checking account of a
chapter 13 debtor who was in default on a loan. The debtor sought to hold the bank in contempt for violation of the automatic stay, arguing, in part, that the bank's actions constituted an act to compel payment of a pre-petition debt. The Court ultimately concluded that an administrative freeze, or a bank's refusal to pay on demand, was not a violation of the automatic stay. In so holding, the Court noted that a bank account consists of "nothing more or less than a promise to pay, from bank to depositor" and that the bank's withholding of funds was not an act in violation of the automatic stay, but “merely a refusal to perform on its promise.” 516 U.S. at 21.
Similarly, Temple University's withholding of the debtor's transcript is merely a refusal to
perform on a promise to create and deliver a record of the debtor’s academic performance. Such conduct is wholly consistent with the very purpose of the automatic stay: "to maintain the status quo that exists at the time of the debtor's bankruptcy filing." In re APF Co., 2001 Bankr.LEXIS 1298, *11 (Bankr.D.Del.2001) (citing In re Richardson, 135 B.R. 256, 258-59

Thus, consistent with Strumpf, this court holds that Temple University's refusal to perform on its promise is not a violation of the automatic stay.5 In reaching this conclusion, the court is acutely aware of the large number of cases outside of the Third Circuit holding that a college violates §362(a)(6) by refusing to release a debtor’s transcript because he or she defaulted on a student loan. See, e.g., Loyola University v. McClarty, 234 B.R. 386 (E.D.La.1999) (chapter 13) (continuation of pre-petition policy of withholding transcripts from students who have refused to repay loans constitutes a collection device); In re Scroggins, 209 B.R. 727 (Bankr.D.Ari.1997) (chapter 13) (same); In re Merchant, 958 F.2d 738 (6th Cir.1992) (chapter 7) (withholding student transcript violates Section 362(a)(6)); In re Gustafson, 111 B.R. 282 (Bankr. 9th Cir.1990), rev’d. on other grounds 934 F.2d 216 (9th Cir.1991) (chapter 7) (withholding student transcript “could serve no other purpose than to compel repayment” and therefore violates the stay); In re Dembek, 64 B.R. 745 (Bankr.N.D.Ohio.1986) (chapter 7) (the coercive tactic of withholding a student transcript is the “precise ill” that Section 362(a)(6) was designed to remedy); In re Parham, 56 B.R. 531

From:http://www.njb.uscourts.gov/chambers2/lyons/01-62685_Frances_Billingsley.pdf

In fairness to LNR, it seems that most of the opposing decisions seem to be coming from your neck of the woods. So you may have a shot.

DC

PS: But if I was the college, I'd still charge you $13,500 for research and $20 for the document.

 

[Ladynred]

Yes, seeing as how that Gustafson case was in the 9th Circuit, it's at least worth asking an attorney.

The collection effort cannot be a violation of the automatic stay - the automatic stay is only in effect while the bankruptcy is open. Your BK is discharged so collection action on a discharged debt would be a violation of the permanent injunction of the discharge.

 

[Desperate4Advic]

Thank You

Yes, seeing as how that Gustafson case was in the 9th Circuit, it's at least worth asking an attorney.

The collection effort cannot be a violation of the automatic stay - the automatic stay is only in effect while the bankruptcy is open. Your BK is discharged so collection action on a discharged debt would be a violation of the permanent injunction of the discharge.

LADYnRED THANK YOU SOOO MUCH!! I wrote an email to the prviate school holding my transcripts and found other sources and even a writing at these URLS:

http://72.14.253.104/search?q=cache:kTPMP86CAQAJ:pacer.flmb.uscourts.gov/pdf-new/41007796.pdf+bankruptcy+tuition+hold+on+transcripts&hl=en&ct=clnk&cd=2&gl=us

http://www.cullenanddykman.com/advisory/advisorypage.asp?pubid=1044511172000

The school wrote me back apologizing that they were not aware of the case law, and was merely listening to their lawyer, but spoke to them and they agree that if it went to court my case would be favorable and I would win.

They are in the process of sending me my transcripts without a fee of any sort even though I offered to pay $20 a transcript.

It would make sense that they wouldn't be able to hold my transcript since it's disharged in chapter 7 and they would not be able to collect that debt due to this clause:
http://doney.net/bkcode/11usc0362.htm

11 USC § 362(a)(6)
"(6) any act to collect, assess, or recover a claim against the debtor that arose before the commencement of the case under this title;" ...


Thank you again for giving me faith in my case!! You're god sent!!!

 

[moburkes]

Glad that it worked out for you.

 

[timhlk]

I'm in the same situation and same state CA. i dont know if you had teh same situation where they had a lawyer on ur case but with me they had lawyers coming after me so when i filed my petition chapter 7 discharged i sent it to the lawyer not the university so they are refusing to relesae my transcript as they said it was to make the lawyers stop collecting from me and not discharging the amount i owe them. is this correct? if so how can i add that? i filed in 2005. does this even matter that i sent it to their lawyer that represented them and not the school? it says for the tuition amount and their client. can some1 help me out here?

 

[moburkes]

I'm in the same situation and same state CA. i dont know if you had teh same situation where they had a lawyer on ur case but with me they had lawyers coming after me so when i filed my petition chapter 7 discharged i sent it to the lawyer not the university so they are refusing to relesae my transcript as they said it was to make the lawyers stop collecting from me and not discharging the amount i owe them. is this correct? if so how can i add that? i filed in 2005. does this even matter that i sent it to their lawyer that represented them and not the school? it says for the tuition amount and their client. can some1 help me out here?

1. Start your own thread with your question.
2. When you rewrite this, that bolded part should consist of more than 1 sentence, so that it makes sense.