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What is the name of your state? South carolina

I am receiving letters from a collection agency about a credit card debt that is outside the 3 year sol. They cannot call me as I have no home phone, only a cell. Do I throw the letter in the trash or do I send them one of the letters that I have seen on here telling them to stop the letters as the debt is time barred and if they did decide to sue that I would have the affirmative defense of outside the sol?
 


pcgumshoe

Member
I am receiving letters from a collection agency about a credit card debt that is outside the 3 year sol.
Hmmm, since when is there a 3 year statute of limitation? Is this particular to South Carolina? The FCRA allows 7 years!

Do I throw the letter in the trash or do I send them one of the letters that I have seen on here telling them to stop the letters as the debt is time barred and if they did decide to sue that I would have the affirmative defense of outside the sol?
NEVER THROW OUT ANYTHING! I have a file cabinet FULL of letters with notes, phone calls I've made, phone calls I've received. You NEVER know when you might have to review this for your own memory.

If you do NOT want them to call or write, yes write them a letter. They can attempt to collect the debt for 7 years. If seven years has expired then YES it is time barred and they must delete it from your credit report.

Actually, if you call them and tell them the same thing, they must stop contacting you UNLESS they transfer the account or are going to take additional action (such as sue you for the debt/legal fees/ and wage garnishment). There are some other particulars, but, it sounds like you just don't want to be bothered by it. Call them up and make sure you ask, "What is your name?" If they don't give you a last name, ask for an extension or employee number. I strongly suggest writing this down on the letter itself UNLESS you are going to create a folder for this account and communications.
 

Kanchazi

Member
You are right about open accounts being 3 years, but written contracts are 10 years SOL.
I would not be surprised that they will try to sue you on a written contract time. You might have to fight them and have them proove why the debt should fall under the 10 yr. SOL.
 

TigerD

Senior Member
Hmmm, since when is there a 3 year statute of limitation? Is this particular to South Carolina? The FCRA allows 7 years!
You don't know what you are talking about -- most of your postings have factual errors that will harm the people if they choose to try and follow your advice.


If you do NOT want them to call or write, yes write them a letter. They can attempt to collect the debt for 7 years. If seven years has expired then YES it is time barred and they must delete it from your credit report.
Um no. The CA can attempt to collect forever. If you send a cease and desist -- they can't contact you. Big difference. Also, FCRA has nothing to do with the legal SOL as set by state law.

And, accounts are not "deleted" from your credit report after 7 years pulls 180 days, they are simply not reported for most purposes - notable exceptions including, insurance, employment checks and security clearances.

DC
 
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pcgumshoe

Member
You don't know what you are talking about -- most of your postings have factual errors that will harm the people if they choose to try and follow your advice.
Like your advice is pristine! I may have misinterpreted what was said, if what the OP meant was that the Credit Card debt is 10 years old (essentially making it 3 years beyond the SOL) then what was stated is correct. However, if the OP believes that the debt is 3 years past due (beyond the first delinquent) then I wasn't incorrect!

Um no. The CA can attempt to collect forever. If you send a cease and desist -- they can't contact you. Big difference. Also, FCRA has nothing to do with the legal SOL as set by state law.

And, accounts are not "deleted" from your credit report after 7 years puls 180 days, they are simply not reported for most purposes - notable exceptions including, insurance, employment checks and security clearances
I'm sorry, I have to disagree with you again. The original creditor can attempt to collect the debt "THEMSELVES" forever if they haven't assigned the debt to a collector. Regardless, a cease and desists will stop all efforts to contact you and, assuming they don't with in the SOL file to get a lien against you (oddly similar to most of the FCRA!) then no harm, no foul.

Also, accounts must fall of (be deleted) from you credit report (that report which other creditors use to assess your credit worthiness) 7 years after the original delinquency, not when a blood sucker debt collector gets it but 7 years after the first reported LATE payment! FCRA!

If the OP is being reported by the CA 7 years and 180 days later, they are violating the FCRA.
 

TigerD

Senior Member
Like your advice is pristine! I may have misinterpreted what was said, if what the OP meant was that the Credit Card debt is 10 years old (essentially making it 3 years beyond the SOL) then what was stated is correct. However, if the OP believes that the debt is 3 years past due (beyond the first delinquent) then I wasn't incorrect!
You didn't misunderstand -- you are just wrong. Here is the citation. Look it up.
South Carolina Statutes of Limitation
Breach of Contract: 3 years, (SCCLA 15-3-530).
NOTE: A partial payment or acknowledgment in writing tolls the SoL, (SCCLA 15-3-30).
Foreign or Domestic Judgments: 10 years, (SCCLA 15-3-600).

The rest of your post is wrong too. However, I don't think you can comprehend more than one item at a time.

DC
 
I am confused

ok, Now I am confused. I was told in previous posts that the sol in South Carolina for cc debt was 3 years. Is it or isnt it? I was also told that the info was to be deleted from my credit report after 7 years plus 180 days but that they could try to collect forever, but that if it is outside the sol, there really isnt much they could do. Is that info incorrect?
 
what are they?

what I just found online stated that open accounts and promisory notes are subject to 3 year sol. Written contracts and oral agreements are for 10 years. The big question is: are credit cards open accounts or written contracts?
 

boswd

Member
technically credit cards are open accounts but some may try and sue for written. Check your state laws and find out where credit cards contracts fall under. Most states they are open ended contracts.

yes they can try and collect forever, no SOL on attempts just to sue and win. Simply send a cease and desists based on time barred. Doesn't mean that they won't try and sell it to another CA. They can since the debt is still there.

Negatives fall off your credit report 7 years plus 180 days of the first deliqency that led to the charge off.

Since you are using the SOL, you pretty much have to always keep looking over your shoulder and hopes you don't slip up. Another CA or even the current one can still try and sue, in hopes of a default judgment. So you will always have to keep an eye on the mail. You also will always have to keep monitoring all three of your credit reports to make sure that if the debt is sold any new CA doesn't start reporting.

Getting a debt past your state's SOL is one way out, but it doesn't neccesarily mean peace of mind. You will always have to be on top of your mail, all your records and your credit report.
 

Kanchazi

Member
This is Florida law but should help you with written VS. open

The SoL is based on weather it is founded on a written instrument. They need to have proof (like a signed contract) for the 5 year SoL to apply.



Review this case law:

a. "...action is not founded on written instrument where evidence of liability consists partially of written cardholder account and security agreement but writing is incomplete to establish liability -- Accordingly, contract is regarded as oral for statute of limitations purposes." PORTFOLIO RECOVERY ASSOCIATES, LLC, Appellant, v_ PAUL FERNANDES 13 Fla. L. Weekly Supp. 560a 2006

b. “Where resort to oral testimony was compelled to make complete the showing of any legal liability incurred by defendant arising out of letter concerning sale of plaintiff's stock, timeliness of plaintiff's action to recover for breach of contract to sell the shares and remit proceeds to him was governed by Florida's three-year limitation period governing actions on oral contracts, rather than the five-year period governing actions on written contracts."
Klein v. Frank, 534 F.2d 1104. C.A.5 1976.


c. “Contract action is not founded upon written instrument, for purpose of statute of limitations, where written instrument is link in chain of evidence to prove cause of action, but does not on its face establish all elements of plaintiff’s claim.” ARDC Corp. v. Hogan, 656 So.2d 1371 (Fla. App. 4 Dist. 1995), review denied 666 So.2d 143.


d. “Where an agreement as set forth in writing is so indefinite as to necessitate resort to parol evidence to make it complete in applying the statue of limitation it must be treated as an oral contract.” McGill v ****rell, 101 So.2d 199 (Fla. 1924) Id at 201.
 
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Here is my letter

so the 3 year sol applies. Here is the letter I was going to send them

To whom it may concern:

This letter is in response to your letter dated (xxxxxxx) copy enclosed concerning the collection of the above referenced account.
I am well aware of my rights under the Fair Debit Collections Practices Act (FDCPA) and my state laws so I hope to save us both a great deal of time by telling you that I have checked with my State Attorney General and verified the statute of limitations for enforcing this type of debt through the courts in South Carolina has expired. Therefore, if you should decide to persue this matter in court, I intend to inform the court that the Statute of Limitations has expired as an affirmative defense.
This letter is your formal notification that I consider this matter closed and demand that you or anyone affiliated with your company stop contacting me regarding this or any other matter except to advise me that your debt collection efforts are being terminated or that you or the creditor are taking specific actions allowed by the FDCPA or my state laws.
Be advised that I consider any contact not in accordance with the Fair Debit Collections Practices Act a serious violation of the law and will immediately report any violations to my State Attorney General, the Federal Trade Commission and if necessary, take whatever legal action is necessary to protect myself. Be advised that I tape all phone calls and violations of the FTCPA can result in you or your company being fined up to 1,000.00 per incident.
Thank you.

What do you think of this letter?
 

Debt Guy

Senior Member
Sally

This is a convoluted answer. I only know of one state (VA) where a judge has agreed that a bank credit card is an open account.

To understand you must look at the history of the industry and the development of statutes. Long before there were credit cards, there was a thing called an open account. This was a credit account that facilitated the sale of goods and services. A good example would be charging groceries at the local grocery store (long before Safeway). Historically, an open account was pretty informal and documented by a ledger sheet and the customer's signature across the face of the sales receipt or cash register ticket.

A department store charge card is also considered an open account (Dillards, for example). The key is that the credit is extended directly by the merchant for the purpose of facilitating the sale of goods and services. In other words, an open account is best understood as a "charge card". Only two parties are involved -- the merchant and the debtor.

Legislatures wrote the statutes in contemplation of charge cards and bank loans. A bank loan is the classical "written agreement". All this took place before the invention of the "credit card" in the 1950s.

A credit card is different than a charge card. A credit card is money you borrow from the issuer to pay a third party. A credit card involves three parties -- the bank, the service provider and the debtor. Typically, credit cards are documented with formal agreements that technically constitute a "written agreement" very similar to a bank loan.

There is lots of confusion caused by a misunderstanding of a federal statute that talks about "open-ended accounts" and gives credit card as an example. But, an "open account" and an "open-ended account" are not the same thing. The opposite of an open-ended account is a closed-end account. A mortgage or car loan is an example of a closed-end account.

I suspect that you are going to disagree with me on this. Fine, lots of people do. But, my 35 years of banking experience has taught me a thing or two.

By the way, just to correct some errors by previous posters.

1. A few states have a statute of repose. That means the debt literally dies after a certain date. If you state does not have a statute of repose, then the debt lives forever.

2. The passage of the state SOL does not mean that you cannot be sued. SOL is merely an affirmative defense to the lawsuit. I see people all the time sued on SOL debts. Sometimes they blow it off because the debt is SOL. Failure to assert your defense in a timely and correct fashion will result in a judgement. Once the judgment is granted, the consumer loses the SOL as a defense. This is true even in those cases where the consumer "never got notified of the lawsuit" unless the consumer can prove the plaintiff failed to follow state law -- sometimes they can and sometimes they cannot. I've seen a lot of very unhappy folks when they figure out their ignorance of the law has a price.

3. A cease and desist is only binding on a third party collection agency. Original creditors are not subject to FDCPA and thus can ignore the whole thing.

4. A cease and desist is binding on the 3rd party CA only to the degree that you are willing to enforce it. There are no FDCPA cops and you would have to sue the CA for violation. Most consumers could not find the courthouse let alone find their way around the filings, motions, hearings, pre-trial, etc.

5. A C&D on a debt that is within SOL is an invitation to be sued. When you take away the collector's opportunity to rattle your cage by phone, all they have left is to go nuclear.

6. Dispute letters and C&D letters you find on the internet are mostly worthless. The CA is not impressed that you can recite the requirements of the law and threaten to take away their toys if they violate. They see zillions of these things that have been copied off the internet. Personally, I suggest you keep it simple. You don't need more than two short sentences to invoke your rights. Just keep a good paper trail.

7. Gumshoe is trying hard but his/her actual knowledge is way down on the curve --many opinions and misunderstandings but little substance.

Good luck. Let me know how it goes.
 
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Sally

This is a convoluted answer. I only know of one state (VA) where a judge has agreed that a bank credit card is an open account.

To understand you must look at the history of the industry and the development of statutes. Long before there were credit cards, there was a thing called an open account. This was a credit account that facilitated the sale of goods and services. A good example would be charging groceries at the local grocery store (long before Safeway). Historically, an open account was pretty informal and documented by a ledger sheet and the customer's signature across the face of the sales receipt or cash register ticket.

A department store charge card is also considered an open account (Dillards, for example). The key is that the credit is extended directly by the merchant for the purpose of facilitating the sale of goods and services. In other words, an open account is best understood as a "charge card". Only two parties are involved -- the merchant and the debtor.

Legislatures wrote the statutes in contemplation of charge cards and bank loans. A bank loan is the classical "written agreement". All this took place before the invention of the "credit card" in the 1950s.

A credit card is different than a charge card. A credit card is money you borrow from the issuer to pay a third party. A credit card involves three parties -- the bank, the service provider and the debtor. Typically, credit cards are documented with formal agreements that technically constitute a "written agreement" very similar to a bank loan.

There is lots of confusion caused by a misunderstanding of a federal statute that talks about "open-ended accounts" and gives credit card as an example. But, an "open account" and an "open-ended account" are not the same thing. The opposite of an open-ended account is a closed-end account. A mortgage or car loan is an example of a closed-end account.

I suspect that you are going to disagree with me on this. Fine, lots of people do. But, my 35 years of banking experience has taught me a thing or two.

By the way, just to correct some errors by previous posters.

1. A few states have a statute of repose. That means the debt literally dies after a certain date. If you state does not have a statute of repose, then the debt lives forever.

2. The passage of the state SOL does not mean that you cannot be sued. SOL is merely an affirmative defense to the lawsuit. I see people all the time sued on SOL debts. Sometimes they blow it off because the debt is SOL. Failure to assert your defense in a timely and correct fashion will result in a judgement. Once the judgment is granted, the consumer loses the SOL as a defense. This is true even in those cases where the consumer "never got notified of the lawsuit" unless the consumer can prove the plaintiff failed to follow state law -- sometimes they can and sometimes they cannot. I've seen a lot of very unhappy folks when they figure out their ignorance of the law has a price.

3. A cease and desist is only binding on a third party collection agency. Original creditors are not subject to FDCPA and thus can ignore the whole thing.

4. A cease and desist is binding on the 3rd party CA only to the degree that you are willing to enforce it. There are no FDCPA cops and you would have to sue the CA for violation. Most consumers could not find the courthouse let alone find their way around the filings, motions, hearings, pre-trial, etc.

5. A C&D on a debt that is within SOL is an invitation to be sued. When you take away the collector's opportunity to rattle your cage by phone, all they have left is to go nuclear.

6. Dispute letters and C&D letters you find on the internet are mostly worthless. The CA is not impressed that you can recite the requirements of the law and threaten to take away their toys if they violate. They see zillions of these things that have been copied off the internet. Personally, I suggest you keep it simple. You don't need more than two short sentences to invoke your rights. Just keep a good paper trail.

7. Gumshoe is trying hard but his/her actual knowledge is way down on the curve --many opinions and misunderstandings but little substance.

Good luck. Let me know how it goes.
so here it is in a nut shell. I wont go into what happenned to us financially because it is irrelevant but we defaulted on 2 capital one cards, one sears card and a car loan. The Sears card by your definition is outside the SOL. The original creditors for the other three IMMEDIATELY sold us to collection agencies and we have NEVER heard from them directly. I do not have a home phone so people cannot call me, only through mail. while I DO NOT respond to these letters ,I do read them to make sure that noone is taking legal action. Nooone has. It has been 4 years since this all happenned and noone has done a thing except to write me letters with pay coupons in them hoping I will be stupid enough to make a payment and toll the SOL. I would NEVER do that. The debt is on my credit for 7 years whether I pay it or not so**************.Even if they did sue me, they do not wage garnish in South Carolina. I know the SOL is an affirmative defense. I have used it already and WON!!! I just thought I might try sending c&s letters so that these people would stop sending us mail. Since it doesnt hurt anything to open them and toss them, I guess I will do what I have been doing for the last 4 years......Nothing. Thak you for the advice. I still am not sure about the closed-ended account though and do not worry, gumshoe seemed confused about my original post, that may be my fault and I read his advice....wont take it though.
 

FlyingRon

Senior Member
Don't believe for one minute that debt collectors won't call your cell phone. I continually get calls looking for some guy named "Christian" who listed my cell number (I'm not sure if he ever actually had that number assigned to him or not). Cost me a lot of freakin money when the called me several times at 2 in the morning in Australia.
 
do this, trust me

hey ron, I received one call on my cell phone and informed the people that they are not allowed to accrue me more debt in their attempts to collect a debt and by calling my number and using my minutes they were doing just that and to NOT call me again or I would take action. They never did. Sometimes, you have to put it right in their faces!!!!
 

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