UA Advice

[bison]

What is the name of your state? Ohio

First, I'll start by saying "another UA thread ." I know. Sorry. But I didn't find any threads that relate to my situation.

Here's my story.

I left for USMC boot in December. Graduated that in March, cake. Went through SOI (which is when I should have left.) SOI gave me a pretty good idea of what the real Corps is. But I went through with it because the whole time in SOI you hear "it gets better in the fleet" and all that.

So I get to the fleet. By this time I realize it's too late for an entry level seperation. All of a sudden I'm getting all this weight carried on my shoulder. I'm sad all the time. And I hate to say that because I never thought I would be "the one." Not only that, but I really suck at hiking. I have girl feet, most of them say. Put more than 30lbs on my back and half a mile later both my feet will be covered in huge blisters. I feel like I'm doing everyone a favor by not being there. I would be combat ineffective.

I took appropriate action. I went through my chain of command (which reached about 2 people high) that I need to speak with a chaplain. Never happened. I also did this at SOI. Never happened. In the military I just always felt so down about everything. It also made me realize how stupid this war is. And although I support the people in it, I will never support the war itself.

I've talked to the GI Rights Hotline. They don't know too much about the USMC. One guy even told me to drug pop upon return. I'm sure there are better routes to take.

In 5 days I will hit my 30 mark. I don't really understand "Desserter" status. I read this forum and see packages, dfr, and all that. Would be helpful if someone could explain

When I left I had no intentions on ever returning (which probably wasn't the best intention) so I made it pretty obvious. I packed every personal belonging I had. I laid out my CIF gear (which was probably stolen since Marines can't keep track of anything.) I took my ID with me. And my BDUs, just in case I was to return. I simply took a cab to the airport and flew out. I told the cab driver I was going on recruiter's assistance.

I told everyone here at home I'm on medical leave. When they see my feet it's very understandable, so that's what everyone thinks. I'm not telling anyone I'm UA. I just don't know what to say, especially to my family, when that time finally comes around. Anyone else do this?

Another thing, I just want to go to college and live a normal life. I obviously can't go to college while I'm UA. I just want OUT. What really sucks is I basically unpacked everything. I took an entire seabag + some other bags home. When I go back would I have to bring everything again?

Here's another problem. I have a huge feeling no matter what my unit would keep me. We deploy in Fall. They want numbers. Actually, someone in our unit went UA on their last deployment. He stayed home the entire time they were deployed. Then he came back when they did. The only thing that happened to him was he was thrown back in our unit and he got 1 stripe taken away. Big deal. He will probably go UA again for this one as well. He told me.

And even another problem..money. I can't afford to get back to NC. Not only that, but I'd be afraid to fly with my status. I don't drive and no one is going to take me to NC. I obviously can't get a job and save up to take a bus back or anything. I mean my family is dead broke, I'm not ashamed to say I come from nothing.

My question is, when should I return if I want out? Remember, I'm in permanent duty. I've considered remaining a desserter for the rest of my contract, what would that do? Sorry for the long detailed post, but I wanted the best advice as possible. Thank you for reading.


edit: Forgot to mention. Since I left my cell phone has been off the hook with pretty much my entire chain of command contacting me. Telling me to come back. Offering to help me when I return, saying if I need to speak with a chaplain they'll set me up and all that. I think going UA made my point pretty clear, and although I hate to say it, it seems like they're crawling at my feet. I never answer it of course, it's all voicemails. And I should probably get my number changed.

 

[cyberspook]

You don't have to go back to NC to turn yourself in. You can do it at any military installation. A reserve barracks etc.

You cannot stay UA forever. You can't live your life that way. They never forget.

You NEED to go back NOW and work it out. At this point you can do this with minimal penalty (just as your voicemails are telling you).

Don't let this get you. You came from nothing but you don't have to amount to nothing. GO BACK NOW!!!

 

[bison]

If I go back now they will definately keep me. Not what I want. I want out.

 

[Taken83oveR]

I just wanted to stop in and wish you the best. I know how the military can be very stressful on you and your family.

If you really have a problem with your feet, I would definably get it looked into. This could be your meal ticket out of the military.

 

[Rock75]

kill! kill! kill 'em all!

First of all devildog (I'm a Marine too, thanks.) Don't you just love when all NCO's call you that?! Well anyway back to my point... yut! (joking.)

Being serious now.. ok.. the GI Rights hotline knows jack squat about stuff on our side of the fence. I automatically knew you were a fellow Marine when I read the topic. The Marine Corps uses the term "UA" instead of AWOL.. which the Army uses.. ever notice how theres so many Army personal on here..???? Blahh.. ok basically, I learned from my own experience and another fellow Marine's experience to take their advice with a grain of salt. Let me guess.. they told you wait it out 6 months which will be an automatic administrative discharge?? They told me that too.

I left when I was at ITB. What you wanted to do. I am/was still on student status.. I never made it to the fleet. Now in your case, wow, the fleet.

Packages?!!!

This 'aint the Army, brother. Things aren't that easy in our branch. (No offense.)

We don't have a 1-800 number to call and check up if we're kicked out yet. Gee, I wish it were that easy. Kinda silly if you ask me, in my opinion.. anyway.. deserter status.. so your gone longer than 30 days?! Me too. Basically, watch your back. Don't be too paranoid though. Sometimes it will take up to 3 months before they put your name on the system as a deserter and put out a warrant for you.. I know what your thinking, "Oh snap! A warrant?!".. it's not like a bounty hunter is gonna come knocking on your door... they put it in the.. i forget what it's called.. basically they put your name on the system that cops have to check your record when they pull you over... so be careful how you drive and be cautious about broken tail lights.. keep in mind and choose wisely who you get a ride with.. now in days cops pull someone over and check everyone in the vehicle.. it happened to me.. luckily the guy was obviously new and gullible. Phew! I'm just remembering some of the stuff I was worried about when I was in your shoes.. (still am, just more into the game.).. you don't have to seclude yourself from the world. Live your life like it's your last day on earth.. just don't get too crazy.

Technically, a deserter is someone who leaves with no intention of returning.. like.. f* this I am leaving and not coming back... if you go UA and make it to deserter status.. when you do go back.. you obviously didn't have those intentions and you aren't charged as a deserter.. but you will face the consequences for going UA to begin with.. catch my drift? If you go back, they will clear you of your deserter status and charge you with UA. If you don't go back and get pulled over, your record checked, arrested, get sent back con-style.. then you will get charged as a deserter.. because you didn't go back on your own.. hope i'm not confusing you...

According to a female Marine on here, people have been gone for 3-5 years! She went UA and turned herself in after 6 months.. they gave her the choice to retain.. go back.. but she just wanted out. She said there was a couple Marines in her situation. Some did retain and some just left like her. You... heck, I, might face brig time when I go back.. and you if that's what you later decide to do.. but it isn't bad. Think of the legal Marines down in SOI back in receiving.. the ones in the jumpsuits that did working parties all day.. you'll do stuff like that.. I think. I'm still on student status so I am thinking that's what my future will be.. I don't know about you though, your already a field Marine..

And I too brought everything I had.. uhhh I was at SOI.. theres only so much we have.. everything I had fit in a seabag.. ANYWAY...

Your unit deploys in the fall?! This better not be a reason why you went UA.. Ok aside from the deserter status and UA.. and all that.. this is another factor.. going UA and intentionally missing a movement.. that's something else they can charge you with.. fom the sound of it.. your COC wasn't too hard on that other guy... first time offenses aren't too bad given a good reason.. then again.. every coc is different

I'm reading your post as I reply so if i'm jumping back and forth.. that's why..

And people in your unit contact you?! I know how you feel. I have Marines that I was close with all through the DEP and SOI call me leaving me voicemails about wanting to talk to me and "wanting to know some information"... my recruiter also knows about this and tends to tell every swingin' d*ck my story.. so every new Marine from our station knows me without actually knowing me.. and word does get around in my small town.. so people do know.. and I could care less.. I know what i'm doing and I know my game plan.

I plan to return, on my own account soon. I do plan on retaining. I know there will be some hard times ahead of me with this hanging over my head, but I am strong and will get through them.. hello.. are we not Marines?! Regardless what we do or did.. no one will ever take the title from us. We earned it. Like they say.. "Once a Marine, always a Marine".

In my opinion, your best bet would be the 6 month deal.. or just go back whenever you think it's the right time.. once you get everything taken care of at home. Save some money and think about where you want to go with this.. do not go back and pop. That is the most idiotic thing I have heard.. True, it works. But why do that? You could have done that while still being at your unit and get kicked out for it.. you went UA for a reason. If you stay UA and go back when your ready, i'm sure you will get the same thing.. retain or a OTH.

Any questions.. any concerns.. any thing at all.. I am here for you brother. We're family.

S/F

With that said.. I hope I helped you. A lot or a little.. as long as I helped in any way. If anyone has any smart remarks to make.. don't waste your time.

 

[SHORTY LONG]

You don't have to go back to NC to turn yourself in. You can do it at any military installation. A reserve barracks etc.

You cannot stay UA forever. You can't live your life that way. They never forget.

You NEED to go back NOW and work it out. At this point you can do this with minimal penalty (just as your voicemails are telling you).

Don't let this get you. You came from nothing but you don't have to amount to nothing. GO BACK NOW!!!

I agree with cyberspook's post; and add that since you say your feet are ill, then check yourself into the nearest VA Hospital if nothing else! It never ceases to amaze me how many Marines make it through boot-camp etc., and then say oh the hell with it. The following information is the latest statistics on UA's, and Deserters.

FORT BRAGG, N.C. - There is no crack team of bounty hunters, no elite military unit whose job is to track them down and bring them in.

Despite a rise in desertions from the Army as the Iraq war drags on into a fifth year, the U.S. military does almost nothing to find those who flee and rarely prosecutes those it gets its hands on.

An Associated Press examination of Pentagon figures shows that 174 troops were court-martialed by the Army last year for desertion - a figure that amounts to just 5 percent of the 3,301 Soldiers who deserted in fiscal year 2006. The figures are about 1 percent or less for the Navy and the Marines, according to data obtained by the AP under the Freedom of Information Act.

Some deserters are simply allowed to return to their units, while the majority are discharged in non-criminal proceedings on less-than-honorable terms.

Pentagon officials say that while the all-volunteer military is stretched thin by the fighting in Iraq and Afghanistan, the number of deserters represents an extremely small percentage of the armed forces, and it would be a poor use of time to go after them, particularly when there is a war on.

As a result, the Pentagon does little more than enter deserters' names into an FBI national criminal database.

In most cases, as long as a deserter stays out of trouble - as long as, say, police don't pull him over for speeding and run his name through the computer - he is in little danger of getting caught.

"A deserter either returns voluntarily or he spends the rest of his life looking over his shoulder wondering when he'll be discovered," said Maj. Anne Edgecombe, an Army spokeswoman.

She added: "Rather than dedicate seasoned noncommissioned officers to the task of tracking down a deserter, commanders choose to spend time and resources to ensure their Soldiers are properly trained and prepared to perform the missions they will be tasked with in places like Iraq and Afghanistan."

Sgt. Ricky Clousing of the Army's storied 82nd Airborne Division found that out after he slipped away from Fort Bragg in the middle of the night in 2005 rather than return to Iraq.

Having left a note in his barracks announcing his intentions, he was sure police would be waiting for him with handcuffs by the time he reached his home in Washington state. But no one was there.

A year later, when he tried to turn himself in near Seattle to make an anti-war statement, he was not hustled off to the stockade in leg irons. He was given a bus ticket and told to report to Fort Bragg on his own.

"I thought I would be more of a priority," said Clousing, a 24-year-old paratrooper and military intelligence interrogator with combat experience.

Clousing ultimately pleaded guilty to a reduced charge of being absent without leave. He was given a bad-conduct discharge and sentenced to three months in prison.

The Army is by far the biggest branch of the military, with a half-million active-duty members, and accounts for the vast majority of U.S. troops in Iraq. The number of Army deserters plummeted after the 2001 terrorist attacks and the start of the Iraq war in 2003, perhaps in a burst of patriotism, and bottomed out in fiscal year 2004.

But desertions crept back up as the fighting dragged on and the death toll climbed. Since fiscal year 2004, desertions are up by more than a third.

A total of 4,399 Soldiers deserted the Army in fiscal year 2001; 3,971 in 2002; 2,610 in 2003; 2,450 in 2004; 2,659 in 2005; and 3,301 in 2006.

Desertions from the Navy have declined steadily since 2001, and are down 36 percent over the past three calendar years, falling to 1,296 in 2006. Desertions from the Marines and the Air Force bounced up and down after 2001 and stood at 834 and 42, respectively, in fiscal year 2006.

Exactly how many deserters are caught is unclear, largely because each branch of the military keeps statistics in different ways and does not give breakdowns of how many people who deserted in a given year are ultimately caught.

Many deserters decide to turn themselves in and face the consequences. Others are eventually caught, but usually after they expose themselves in some way - they get arrested for a civilian offense, or apply for a passport or a job that requires a background check, military officials say.

Under the military criminal code, the maximum penalty for desertion during a declared war is death. But such a sentence has been carried out just once since the Civil War, when Pvt. Eddie Slovik went before a firing squad during World War II. The next-highest punishment is five years in prison.

The number of Army Soldiers prosecuted for desertion tripled in the year after Sept. 11. But it has essentially held steady since 2002. The Navy prosecuted 17 deserters in 2006, the Marine Corps just four. There were 10 prosecutions for desertion in the Air Force during fiscal year 2006.

The decision of whether to prosecute is up to the Soldier's unit commander.

Deserters who are discharged on less-than-honorable terms through an administrative, or non-criminal, proceeding lose the medical and educational benefits and other privileges available to veterans.

"I sort of look at the administrative discharge process as the equivalent of a firing ... leaving with a bad reference," said David Miner, a former Army attorney now in private practice, with Clousing among his clients.

The number of Army deserters in 2006 amounted to less than 1 percent of the active-duty force. That compares with 3.4 percent at the height of the Vietnam War in 1971

"We had a larger problem in Vietnam because we had the draft," said Scott Silliman, a law professor and director of the Center on Law, Ethics and National Security at Duke University, who added he knows of no units that chased down deserters back then, either. "Here the individual is not going to go into the military unless they had some inclination to do so in the first place."

In the Army, officials said deserters are typically junior enlisted Soldiers in their teens or early 20s, with less than three years of service. Most often, they cite financial or personal problems as a reason for leaving, officials say.

Army and Marine officials say there is no evidence that repeated deployments to Iraq are leading to more desertions. The Army's Edgecombe said that more than 60 percent of deserters over the past 18 months have had less than a year of service, so they haven't been deployed at all.

In recent years, the military has lowered its standards to fill its ranks, letting in more recruits with criminal records or low aptitude scores. But officials said that does not appear to be a factor in the rising desertion rate either.

In fact, Edgecombe said, recruits who got into trouble before they enlisted tend to shape up under the influence of the military's code of honor and discipline.

Those who leave without permission are considered AWOL for 30 days, after which they are "dropped from the rolls" and branded deserters.

That is when the paychecks are supposed to stop, but a congressional audit found that more than 7,500 deserters and Soldiers who were absent from duty improperly received $6.6 million in pay between October 2000 and February 2002.

Once a Soldier is dropped from the rolls, employees at a small Army office at Fort Knox in Kentucky enter the deserter's information into the FBI database.

When someone is arrested for a civilian offense and the computer flags him as a deserter, local authorities typically hold him and contact the military, which might send someone to bring him in, or ask him to come in on his own.

The military does actively chase down deserters who committed crimes before abandoning their posts. Military officials do not have jurisdiction off-base to arrest a deserter, and so the federal Marshals Service works with the military in such cases. Spokeswoman Nikki Credic said federal marshals arrested 68 deserters from all services in fiscal year 2006.

"People have been hiding for years and years. If you want to hide out, you can," said Maj. Jay Delarosa, a Marine Corps spokesman. But he added that in the information age, it is less likely that a deserter can hide forever.

"There's other ways people reveal themselves besides being caught with a broken tail light," Delarosa said.

 

[bison]

Thanks for all the replies.

I do plan on turning myself in, but not ANYTIME soon. I'm enjoying life so much back at home. My mother is happy to have me return, too. Not to get too personal but she's pretty old and sick with no one really taking care of her.

cyberspook - if you think SOI is full of BS, just wait until the fleet. I'd say 300% worse. I'd just like to throw in some advice for you though, since you are entry level, they will probably just seperate you out upon your return. One of my friends from boot left SOI on day 3 (lol) and returned the week before we graduated. He was out of the Marine Corps 3 weeks later. Lucky fjkgsorlgjhosejhsehoph.

Shorty - great article. It actually makes desserter status not sound too bad, lol. Except I didn't get paid, and payday was about 10 days later.

6 months sounds like a good time to come back. I would probably come back sometime early 2008..thoughts on doing that? Should I also contact a lawyer or JAG before doing so?

Any ideas on what sort of jobs don't give background checks? And is there any way to check if your name is in the system already before I go try and get a job and get caught?

Thanks!

 

[FREEFROMTHEUSMC]

Read my thread:

https://forum.freeadvice.com/showthread.php?t=364209

I went UA right after bootcamp and was gone for a year and 2 months, I turned myself in a few months ago to the base at Quantico, VA and spent 40 days getting out processed. In my thread is my complete experience so you will know exactly what it's like when you turn yourself in.

So you made it to the fleet? Better hope you don't miss a movement. I was down there, the only ones who get off "easy" are those of us who didn't miss a movement or left in training. Almost everyone who made it to the fleet ended up also missing a movement. I say this because any extra charge added onto the UA, Article 86 I think, almost certainly equals a court martial, usual Special, with a BCD and some brig time.

But if it's just the UA charge, expect what I got, which was between 20-40 days outprocessing with an OTH.

You sound just like me, it's pretty tough to break the news to your parents, but somehow you're gonna have to.

Good luck and I'll be checking in to answer any questions/fears you might have.

 

[cyberspook]

cyberspook - if you think SOI is full of BS, just wait until the fleet. I'd say 300% worse. I'd just like to throw in some advice for you though, since you are entry level, they will probably just seperate you out upon your return. One of my friends from boot left SOI on day 3 (lol) and returned the week before we graduated. He was out of the Marine Corps 3 weeks later. Lucky fjkgsorlgjhosejhsehoph.

Where in God's name did you get the idea tha I am a entry level Marine? I am no where near the boat you UA guys are in and I resent the implication albeit an error that I am.

And, I have been to the FMF (Fleet Marne Force).

 

[SHORTY LONG]

Where in God's name did you get the idea tha I am a entry level Marine? I am no where near the boat you UA guys are in and I resent the implication albeit an error that I am.

And, I have been to the FMF (Fleet Marne Force).

Give them hell Marine! Ooh Rah.

 

[Rock75]

Where in God's name did you get the idea tha I am a entry level Marine? I am no where near the boat you UA guys are in and I resent the implication albeit an error that I am.

And, I have been to the FMF (Fleet Marne Force).

I believe that was toward me.. =D

SOI.. BS? Uh, duh. I wasn't just at SOI Marine. I was at ITB. And I didn't leave because it was "BS". That's irrelevant. I left for other reasons. I was 2 weeks from graduation. It wasn't that bad. But I left and that's that. I believe that I will get out, if it's what I choose to do. But that is not my intent. Give me a slap on the wrist, make me do working parties, take all my pay, heck.. give me brig time. I know what I did was wrong. I will pay for it. But I would never intentionally miss a movement, thanks. You see.. although I messed up greatly.. I still have my honor.. in the Marine Corps it kinda means something.. Call me a sh*t bag Marine for what I did.. but missing a movement.. now that.. is one in his truest form. Honestly brother, if you wanted out.. you should have claimed insanity/depression/PTSD/ or some other physiological situation. If it be for your "girlie legs" or that.. it would have been a medical discharge. Would have saved you some trouble. Depression and all that comes with wearing the uniform. No one said it was going to be easy. As for me... like I said, I know what I did and I could only hope for the best. I have my game plan and that's all that matters. Fleet Marine or not.. we're in the same boat. =)

S/F

 

[SOLDIERFIRST]

time changes everything

What is the name of your state? Ohio

First, I'll start by saying "another UA thread ." I know. Sorry. But I didn't find any threads that relate to my situation.

Here's my story.

I left for USMC boot in December. Graduated that in March, cake. Went through SOI (which is when I should have left.) SOI gave me a pretty good idea of what the real Corps is. But I went through with it because the whole time in SOI you hear "it gets better in the fleet" and all that.

So I get to the fleet. By this time I realize it's too late for an entry level seperation. All of a sudden I'm getting all this weight carried on my shoulder. I'm sad all the time. And I hate to say that because I never thought I would be "the one." Not only that, but I really suck at hiking. I have girl feet, most of them say. Put more than 30lbs on my back and half a mile later both my feet will be covered in huge blisters. I feel like I'm doing everyone a favor by not being there. I would be combat ineffective.

I took appropriate action. I went through my chain of command (which reached about 2 people high) that I need to speak with a chaplain. Never happened. I also did this at SOI. Never happened. In the military I just always felt so down about everything. It also made me realize how stupid this war is. And although I support the people in it, I will never support the war itself.

I've talked to the GI Rights Hotline. They don't know too much about the USMC. One guy even told me to drug pop upon return. I'm sure there are better routes to take.

In 5 days I will hit my 30 mark. I don't really understand "Desserter" status. I read this forum and see packages, dfr, and all that. Would be helpful if someone could explain

When I left I had no intentions on ever returning (which probably wasn't the best intention) so I made it pretty obvious. I packed every personal belonging I had. I laid out my CIF gear (which was probably stolen since Marines can't keep track of anything.) I took my ID with me. And my BDUs, just in case I was to return. I simply took a cab to the airport and flew out. I told the cab driver I was going on recruiter's assistance.

I told everyone here at home I'm on medical leave. When they see my feet it's very understandable, so that's what everyone thinks. I'm not telling anyone I'm UA. I just don't know what to say, especially to my family, when that time finally comes around. Anyone else do this?

Another thing, I just want to go to college and live a normal life. I obviously can't go to college while I'm UA. I just want OUT. What really sucks is I basically unpacked everything. I took an entire seabag + some other bags home. When I go back would I have to bring everything again?

Here's another problem. I have a huge feeling no matter what my unit would keep me. We deploy in Fall. They want numbers. Actually, someone in our unit went UA on their last deployment. He stayed home the entire time they were deployed. Then he came back when they did. The only thing that happened to him was he was thrown back in our unit and he got 1 stripe taken away. Big deal. He will probably go UA again for this one as well. He told me.

And even another problem..money. I can't afford to get back to NC. Not only that, but I'd be afraid to fly with my status. I don't drive and no one is going to take me to NC. I obviously can't get a job and save up to take a bus back or anything. I mean my family is dead broke, I'm not ashamed to say I come from nothing.

My question is, when should I return if I want out? Remember, I'm in permanent duty. I've considered remaining a desserter for the rest of my contract, what would that do? Sorry for the long detailed post, but I wanted the best advice as possible. Thank you for reading.


edit: Forgot to mention. Since I left my cell phone has been off the hook with pretty much my entire chain of command contacting me. Telling me to come back. Offering to help me when I return, saying if I need to speak with a chaplain they'll set me up and all that. I think going UA made my point pretty clear, and although I hate to say it, it seems like they're crawling at my feet. I never answer it of course, it's all voicemails. And I should probably get my number changed.

Nothing I hate worse than a deserter is an adulter, your chain of command is not kissing your feet, they are working to get you back into the fold.

If you go back now, they feel they can rehab you. Bust you then rehab. I will never understand why an individual would sign a contract, take an oath and then break their oath.

I hope you turn yourself in soon.

v/r
Soldier First

 

[bison]

What do you mean by rehab?

Sorry cyberspook, directed that towards you by accident.

Can you still get things like a drivers license under desserter status?

 

[SOLDIERFIRST]

Rehab

What do you mean by rehab?

Sorry cyberspook, directed that towards you by accident.

Can you still get things like a drivers license under desserter status?

Depends on the what the chain of command feels is adequate as rehab. Some commands feel that making an example out of an individual is the thing to do. Personally I don't buy into that ideal.

Once you go into NCIS database, your name will be on every Federal database that is run by the government. If a states participates in that database access, they could run your SS and find out you are a deserter. With todays immigration and terrorist issue, I would expect all agencies to check necessary databases to ensure you are who you are.

Apply for that school loan? They verify your SS. As a deserter you will not qualify for many federal programs (assistance, loans, etc). Apply for a job and let your employer find out you are a deserter;watch them drop a dime on you so fast.

Back in the day, you could go to work for your family and no one would ever be the wiser, but in today's society computers are everywhere.