nurse negligent????

[moburkes]

We know that you're upset. Your mother, who refuses to acknowledge that she has a serious illness, told her to leave.

 

[GulfBreeze]

my mother was in icu for 9 days. I'm very upset that the nurse left. I have asked several nurses and they all have said the samething, that they would not have left. My daughter is also an RN and she says that I should deffinately sue the Home Health Company. As for the nurse, her license should be revoked. I dont understand how you can say that she did nothing wrong. You should never leave a patient that needs to go to the ER by herself.

I have been a RN for over 17 years. I would never pass judgment on a fellow nurse without personal knowledge (not being there). Now all of a sudden, you have other RNs including your daughter, that she was negligent. This is exactly why the health care is having problems keeping good nurses. People are so sue-happy and are looking for any possible way to harass people. I agree..you will never get the real picture. The nurse didn't leave a dieing patient. She left with the only signs being a slightly higher than normal BP. She was conscious and was walking/talking. She told the nurse to leave and you in fact, told her that you would take care of her going to the ER. Your mother could have called 911 if matters got worse after the nurse left.
9 days in ICU? we got the impression that this wasn't life-threatening from a post of yours. now you say she was admitted for 9 days on an intensive care unit. get your story straight.

 

[redlady]

negligence??

I never said that it wasnt life threatening. i stated before that she almost died. my mom had her oxygen on when I got there and she was so badly short of breath that I had to call 911. By the time she got to the hospital she was admitted to ICU due to her Congestive heart failure. even the nurses agreed she was very ill and it could have costed her her life. the reason i'm upset it because i feel that this nurse should have stayed with her or call me to tell me she was leaving.

 

[GulfBreeze]

Lya, since when is 180/90 stable? Are you a medical professional? I missed that memo!

while this BP of 180/90 isn't a normal one, it doesn't make the patient unstable. You would be surprised at what lack of oxygen will do to the BP and how fast it will rise without sufficient O2. Her BP lowered after she put her O2 back on. The appropriate measures should be taken to lower a person's BP, but 180/90 short term isn't life-threatening. This patient didnt help herself by being non-compliant and having her O2 off. This entire thread is a waste of time. Let this person do whatever they choose. Its apparent that nothing they read here will convince them that they share with the fault. They just want to put the blame on a nurse who is being wrongly accused. In the end, this matter will be investigated if it goes that far, and the nurse will be cleared (IMHO) based on the info provided....end of discussion please, thanks...

 

[redlady]

negligence??

isn't the fact that she had to spend 9 days in ICU, damage enough?

 

[GulfBreeze]

I never said that it wasnt life threatening. i stated before that she almost died. my mom had her oxygen on when I got there and she was so badly short of breath that I had to call 911. By the time she got to the hospital she was admitted to ICU due to her Congestive heart failure. even the nurses agreed she was very ill and it could have costed her her life. the reason i'm upset it because i feel that this nurse should have stayed with her or call me to tell me she was leaving.

almost died....life-threathening......not the same?

911 was called, something the nurse could have done but you chose to tell her that you would take her...along with your mother telling her to leave. i am sure your CHF mother knows the importance of O2...so why does the nurse find her without it?

non-complaint patient has a complaining child. maybe you should stay with her yourself.

 

[GulfBreeze]

isn't the fact that she had to spend 9 days in ICU, damage enough?

your mother stayed 9 days probably because she is a CHF patient...probably needed to remove fluids around the heart. dont know. no telling what else she doesnt do that she is suppose to do. diet, O2, medication etc...sounds to me like she needs 24/7 care.

 

[lya]

GB, you've posted twice since your post asking everyone to let this discussion end!

Let it end!

 

[free_spirit_etc]

I was kind of thinking the nurse saved the mother's life. Home Health nurses drop by and check the patients. It seems like the nurse happened to drop by at the right time - more or less...in time to call the doctor..in time to call the daughter...in time to save the mother's life.

If the mother was non-responsive by the time the daughter got there - think how non-responsive she would have been by the time someone found her, had the nurse not dropped by the check her when she did.

Kind of one of those angel of mercy kind of things.

Kind of scary to think of what might have happened had the nurse not come by when she did.

Free

 

[GulfBreeze]

while it can be said that as a nurse, you are told from the beginning to CYA (cover your a**) and in this case, the nurse should have ignored the daughter and called 911 and waited..because the patient is the nurse's patient, not the daughter's. She had a direct order by the MD to have the patient taken to the ER. He didn't however say that she should immediately call 911. It is a greyline whether the nurse did wrong by not staying. The condition her mother was in, was in the nurse's opinion, not life-threatening at that time. Did the mother's health deteriorate? It appears it did.
It was not the nurse's fault that the mother is non-complaint. Nurses try to help people out and many will say that these "ANGELS" are wonderful and caring...something I agree on. We do this to help people out...god knows we are not in it for the money. The responsibility out weights the financial rewards. The real award comes in knowing that you did your best and have made a difference in people's lives. Along the way, there will be people that will make you wonder if its all worth the harassment like this.
I have taken this too personally since it deals with nurses. It is best I just leave it here and not make any further comments because it is not productive. Best of luck to redlady. Remember one thing...life is too short to dwell on things like this. Enjoy your time with your mother while she is around. Luckily she is still here to enjoy some more.

 

[lya]

OK--I checked with a Home Health RN, MSN.

The nurse did nothing wrong and here's why:

Standard of Care requirement is to notify the physician within 4 hours of a change in condition. The RN called the physician immediately, thus meeting the standard of care.

Standard of Care requirement to notify the caregiver within the same day, which can be after the caregiver's normal working hours. The RN called the caregiver immediately.

Standard of Care requirement to recheck vital signs or condition that is changed prior to leaving the home of the patient. The RN rechecked the vital signs, which showed improved BP and improved respiratory function with oxygen supplementation.

That's it. There are no standard of care deviations; therefore, there is no act of negligence, no reason to seek revenge against the nurse. A review by any agency will support that the standards of care were met.

Furthermore, the caregiver assumed responsibility for promptly coming home to take the patient to the ER. Any delay of 30 minutes or more, not related to driving distance, places the entire burden of damages related to timeliness of treatment on the caregiver.

It is reasonable to expect an elderly, non-compliant patient to spend 7-10 days in ICU when the patient is in CHF and has not properly managed co-existing illnesses/diseases.

A review will prove that the patient's non-compliant behavior contributed to the critical status of the CHF; the co-existing illness/diseases brought about the CHF.

One must remember that Home Health services require that the patient be homebound except for doctor's appointments and religious services AND that a primary caregiver is identified and responsible for day-to-day observation for changes in condition and day-to-day compliance with medical treatments and medications.

For me, at least, now I understand more of why the original poster is so upset; it is he/she who failed in caregiving responsibilities by not insuring compliance and by not noticing that the patient was in distress. Guilt, whether justified or not, often results in projected anger.

It appears, this thread is a classic example of guilt resulting in projected anger and includes an unhealthy behavior of seeking to injure person(s) who caused no harm but whose actions saved the woman's life.

 

[lealea1005]

OK--I checked with a Home Health RN, MSN.

The nurse did nothing wrong and here's why:

Standard of Care requirement is to notify the physician within 4 hours of a change in condition. The RN called the physician immediately, thus meeting the standard of care.

Standard of Care requirement to notify the caregiver within the same day, which can be after the caregiver's normal working hours. The RN called the caregiver immediately.

Standard of Care requirement to recheck vital signs or condition that is changed prior to leaving the home of the patient. The RN rechecked the vital signs, which showed improved BP and improved respiratory function with oxygen supplementation.

That's it. There are no standard of care deviations; therefore, there is no act of negligence, no reason to seek revenge against the nurse. A review by any agency will support that the standards of care were met.

Furthermore, the caregiver assumed responsibility for promptly coming home to take the patient to the ER. Any delay of 30 minutes or more, not related to driving distance, places the entire burden of damages related to timeliness of treatment on the caregiver.

It is reasonable to expect an elderly, non-compliant patient to spend 7-10 days in ICU when the patient is in CHF and has not properly managed co-existing illnesses/diseases.

A review will prove that the patient's non-compliant behavior contributed to the critical status of the CHF; the co-existing illness/diseases brought about the CHF.

One must remember that Home Health services require that the patient be homebound except for doctor's appointments and religious services AND that a primary caregiver is identified and responsible for day-to-day observation for changes in condition and day-to-day compliance with medical treatments and medications.

For me, at least, now I understand more of why the original poster is so upset; it is he/she who failed in caregiving responsibilities by not insuring compliance and by not noticing that the patient was in distress. Guilt, whether justified or not, often results in projected anger.

It appears, this thread is a classic example of guilt resulting in projected anger and includes an unhealthy behavior of seeking to injure person(s) who caused no harm but whose actions saved the woman's life.

Kept my opinion out of this one thus far because I didn't get here until this thread was already on page 3. However, as another RN who deals with families on a daily basis, I just wanted to say thankyou, lya. thankyou, thankyou!!