Never Divorced.. yet remarried..

[yolandanewell]

What is the name of your state? CA

This is a question for my mom. In '66 she married a man in Nevada - in '68 they seperated. He brought her paperwork and had her sign them and she assumed they were divorce papers? (I know I've already questioned her on "how could you not know?).

Apparently - there was never a divorce.

"Mike" remarried "Pam" and my mom married my dad in 1973 and they remained married until he passed in '98.

It has reached the time for her, post retirement (in 2004) to file for social security.

A red flag was raised in that she was married to two men at that same time.

What is her next step?

 

[garrula lingua]

Call the Nevada county where she & hubby lived in 1968.

Ask them to check the records to see if a divorce was ever filed.
If so, ask if you can get a copy of the file (maybe the divorce was finalized; at least she would have some defense to believing she was divorced).

(the clerk has the right to charge you a research fee, and a copy fee. ask how much before they search the files.)

BTW, who 'raised the red flag' ?

Is SS saying they will not pay her benefits based on your Dad's contributions ?

If so, are they then saying she can still claim off husband # 1's benefits (as he no longer is validly married to 'Pam').

 

[yolandanewell]

Thank you!

Call the Nevada county where she & hubby lived in 1968.
They married in Nevada, resided in California..

Ask them to check the records to see if a divorce was ever filed.
If so, ask if you can get a copy of the file (maybe the divorce was finalized; at least she would have some defense to believing she was divorced).

(the clerk has the right to charge you a research fee, and a copy fee. ask how much before they search the files.)
Will do pronto!!! I'm sure they will have to dig... been a while! so the fees are warranted!

BTW, who 'raised the red flag' ?
Mom says that when she was in a phone interview while she was applying for her own SS benefits, she mentioned that she wasn't sure of the divorce date.

Is SS saying they will not pay her benefits based on your Dad's contributions ?
What is odd is... my mom IS receiving my late fathers SS benefits... so what is strange is that if this is infact true, that she isn't divorced from Mike, that this was not caught sooner

If so, are they then saying she can still claim off husband # 1's benefits (as he no longer is validly married to 'Pam').

I believe what she is being told is that if she was, in fact, never divorced - that she will be responsible not only for paying back my late fathers benefits.. but she will be ineligiable for her own?

I've not helped her in this process so youre getting all of this information from what I've been told... if any of this makes sense - I appreciate so much your input.. if not.. I'll try to pin down the correct answers to your questions...

Thanks so much!

 

[garrula lingua]

Well, if Mom was married to Hubby #1 for at least 10 years (and if she wasn't divorced, then she was still Mrs. #1), and they are 62 or ++, then she should be able to claim 1/2 of H1's SS benefits (unless benefits under her own name are higher).

Mom might lose some death benefits paid thru H#2 (SS should agree to monthly repayment plan) ... , but at least she should qualify, at retirement, for a monthly stipend based on H2's earnings (who knows what the difference is between their earnings?).

SS may recognize 'putative' spouse ... I don't know. If so, she'd win in her bid to be recognized as married since 1973 ... it would probably involve an appeal process with her showing that the divorce was filed and she believed she was divorced in 1968, and is an innocent victim of misinformation by H1 ...

How old is Mom & how old is H1 and H2 (at death) ?

Someone needs to contact Hubby #1 and find out if he ever completed the divorce.
His wife won't be happy if she loses his SS.

You also said H1 'remarried' Pam ... was this his wife #1 ?
Did H1 ever correctly divorce 'Pam' before he married your Mom ??

 

[yolandanewell]

Thank you!

Well, if Mom was married to Hubby #1 for at least 10 years (and if she wasn't divorced, then she was still Mrs. #1), and they are 62 or ++, then she should be able to claim 1/2 of H1's SS benefits (unless benefits under her own name are higher).
Phew.. this is confusing... She is not after H1 benefits... she is trying to get her own She will be 62 on 4/30/08 - H1 is now 63 and my father died in 98 at the age of 62

Mom might lose some death benefits paid thru H#2 (SS should agree to monthly repayment plan) ... , but at least she should qualify, at retirement, for a monthly stipend based on H2's earnings (who knows what the difference is between their earnings?).
that's a question I'll have to ask - they both remained with the same companies all throughout my lifetime... I think mom made more though

SS may recognize 'putative' spouse ... I don't know. If so, she'd win in her bid to be recognized as married since 1973 ... it would probably involve an appeal process with her showing that the divorce was filed and she believed she was divorced in 1968, and is an innocent victim of misinformation by H1 ...
Well, according to mom - she has had a conversation with H1 and he claims that he never brought her paperwork... claiming that she has had a "false" memory...

How old is Mom & how old is H1 and H2 (at death) ?
Mom will be 62 on 4/30 and dad passed at 62


Someone needs to contact Hubby #1 and find out if he ever completed the divorce.
His wife won't be happy if she loses his SS.
I think, if I'm not mistaken that "Pam" and "mike" have divorced...which leads me to this question... (mystery after mystery).. if my MOM was still married than "Mike" was still married - and how on earth does another "marriage" and "divorce" occur on his part too?


You also said H1 'remarried' Pam ... was this his wife #1 ?
I'm so sorry... that should have been "mike ALSO remarried to a woman named "Pam"... meaning both my mom and mike married other people after the two of them split...
Did H1 ever correctly divorce 'Pam' before he married your Mom ??

I'll have to first off find out what the status of "mike" and moms marriage is .. then maybe we can go from there, yes?

 

[garrula lingua]

Yes, it's a mess.
I'd start checking in Nevada for 1968 divorce filings, to see if there's anything there to support Mom's contention.

I'd also check into what SS's policy is regarding similar situations. This has happened before (many times, I'm sure).

I've never dealt with SS, other than helping with homeless apps for SSI & going to SS offices with homeless while in law school.

 

[yolandanewell]

Thats what I tell mom...

Just to keep her calm...

"Mom I'm certain you are not the FIRST person to go through this!"

Poor thing is panicking... which I can completely understand - she's worried on several levels..

I'll eat the elephant one step at a time... thank you so much for your help!!!

 

[LdiJ]

Just to keep her calm...

"Mom I'm certain you are not the FIRST person to go through this!"

Poor thing is panicking... which I can completely understand - she's worried on several levels..

I'll eat the elephant one step at a time... thank you so much for your help!!!

I really think that it would be a good idea to also have your mother consult an attorney.

 

[yolandanewell]

Thank you LDJ

I'll talk to her this morning...

 

[yolandanewell]

Update...

Well, SS has approved her benefits - I'm still trying to get mom to pursuit the issue of finding out what the heck is going on however she feels "leave well enough alone"... I fear that there are crossed communications occuring - hopefully she'll agree to speak with an attorney... "just to be safe"...

Thank you for your help

 

[mistoffolees]

Well, SS has approved her benefits - I'm still trying to get mom to pursuit the issue of finding out what the heck is going on however she feels "leave well enough alone"... I fear that there are crossed communications occuring - hopefully she'll agree to speak with an attorney... "just to be safe"...

While speaking to an attorney is prudent, what is to be gained by 'finding out what the heck is going on'? In her mind, she divorced the guy and remarried. SS apparently agrees since they're approving her benefits.

Unless the attorney strongly suggests proceeding (if, for example, the first guy might have a claim to her estate), I would drop it.

 

[yolandanewell]

Good point!

Consider it dropped like a hot potato!!! Thanks for that heads up!