Mothers Day Holiday, Mom out of town.

[bd420]

I live in Michigan.

Part I
I am the Father of 2 children and shortly before this past Mother's Day I had learned that the childrens Mother would be out of the State (in LV, Nev) during most of the time of the Mother's Day Holiday.

I ended up dropping the kids off at the children's Grandmothers house at the usual weekly dropoff time, which is Sundays at 5 PM.

The Mother is recently claiming that she is entitled to 2 days of parenting time, for the Friday thru Sunday at 5 PM that I had the kids during the Mother's Day Holiday (MDH) that she would have had the children, had she been present.

There were NO contracts signed, No emails sent, and No phone dialogue concerning any 'agreement', 'request', 'change of schedule', etc, inititiated by either parent regarding the MDH Parenting Time.

My view, right or wrong, was simply that their Mother had forfeited her Parenting Time for this holiday by choosing to be unavailable.

This is the end of Part I. Is the mother entitled to the 2 days back in your opinion(s)?

Part II
In a rare verbal exchange with the Mother, I've come to find out that she really just wants the 2 days back for kids Grandmother and Step-Grandfather, so that they can take the children out of the area for 2 days on my scheduled time. A request to have the children during my time is not uncommon by the mother, I simply ask for the time back at a later date.

Basically, she wants to exchange or allocate the 2 days she 'gave away' in my mind, and give those to her own mother and step-dad during my time.

My position is that the children can go with their grandparents during my time, as long as I get that time back, but the Mother is unwilling to concede the time back, citing the 2 days I ‘owe’ her for the MDH that she was out of state during.

This is where this saga gets outrageous, and now I'm just primarily venting/sharing an extraordinary circumstance to get it off my chest, bare with me.

The grandmother asks me, unbeknownst to the Mother, if she can take the kids. She offers me a $50 gift cert to my fav resturaunt to sweeten the pot and sway me. I didn't realize that this was actually a bribe in exchange for the time I always request back. The grandmother agrees with me that since her daughter was not in town, she shouldn't even be asking for the 2 days back, but rather than tell her daughter this, she decided to call me and offer this bribe.

When I brought up the fact that dinner or no dinner, I want in writing that the mom will give me these 2 ‘grandparents’ days on my time back, the g-ma was dejected, and basically said, so that's the way you want to do it? That's when I realized the dinner cert was a bribe.

So.....this 'forced' the g-ma to confront her daughter and ask her to quit asking me for the 2 MDH days back, and just let the kids go with them in exchange for giving the time back, and all is well. Expectedly, the mom blew up at this idea and was not 'happy' with her mom.

So, back to square one which means the 'deal' was off for the g-parents taking the kids out of town on my time in exchange for me getting the time back. Kids are Bummed out, mom thinks it's my fault, kids thinks it's the mom's fault, grandparents blame the mom as well, and I'm in a position where relenting is not an option, based on prior precedence.

Based on pressure from the g-parents, the children, and my wife, I cave and refer you back to the verbal exchange I had via a telephone call that I didn't want to make with the children's mother.

During the call, the mother reveals for the 1st time, that she actually thinks that Mother's Day should have been a 'wash', ie meaning, that she does NOT feel that she should have the time?! She agreed I should have kept them like a normal non-holiday weekend, and she would have done the same!?

She further explains for the 1st time, that her real issue was in regards to 10 months ago (!?) when WE were out of state from Sunday 5pm (normal drop off) to Tue afternoon. However, the difference here was that We HAD worked something out with the Mother prior to even booking the vacation itself, and she DID consent to dropping the kids off in the care of kids 23 year old step-brother. The kids actually like the step-brother very much, and they were more than comfortable with being in his care, however, I realized regardless that the Mother still had to consent to this arrangement otherwise the kids would have to rightfully so stay with their mother a couple of extra days until we got back from vacation and that furthermore I would be willfully forfeiting these 2 lost days. Hence the agreement BEFORE the trip was even booked.

Even though the mom consented to the normal dropoff, I had my doubts she would actually do it right up until the long distance phone call confirmation that they were at our house.

This is where my aforementioned apprehensive phone call with the mom gets twilight zone bizarre. The Mother proceeded to tell me that since she didn't know this individual on a personal level (which is very true, she doesn't know the kids step siblings at all) she couldn't rule out the possibility that our daughter wouldn't be RAPED by the step-brother!!! When I asked the Mother why she would drop off our daughter into an environment that she thought could be unsafe enough whereas our daughter could have been at risk of being raped, she said she HAD TO bc the Friend of the Court TOLD her that if she didn't drop off the kids she could be ARRESTED and Sent to Prison/Jail?!!! WTF?!!

So, in order to save herself from Jail Time, she put our daughter in danger of being raped, this is all in her eyes/mind, not mine of course.

After I continued to persist on this outlandish scenario, she said this conversation was becoming off-topic, her voice quivering, and she hung up on me.

Still no resolution to the original problem, and I’ll sign off with some Ironic Facts:
1) I DON’T let our daughter stay at or with her step-grandfather’s house/care bc the kids Mother is on record stating that he physically abused her as a child.

2) The grandmother alluded that her daughter most likely brought up the outlandish rape scenario in the 1st place, because of ‘things that happened to her (the daughter) many years ago when she was very young’?! So we have g-ma inferring that her own daughter has been not only physically abused, which I knew about, but sexually abused, which I had sorta suspected, but never had confirmed.

bd

 

[Isis1]

what does your court order say about make-up parenting time?

 

[TinkerBelleLuvr]

In Michigan, Mom would be entitled to "make-up" days ONLY if she had been denied parenting time. If she chose to be gone, that is her perogative, but she doesn't get to then arbitrarily make 'em up later.

http://www.co.midland.mi.us/departments/extra.php?id=13&pid=268

Make-up Parenting Time Policy


TO: SEPARATED PARENTS

Because the Circuit Court strongly believes that it is important for a child to have a good relationship with both parents, the court adopts a make-up parenting time policy pursuant to MCLA 552.642; MSA 25.164(42).


It will be the responsibility of the Friend of the Court to keep an accurate record of alleged parenting time denials, which shall be available to the court. In order to assure that the Friend of the Court has the correct information upon which its parenting time alleged denials will be based, the following procedure is adopted.


Within seven (7) days of an alleged, wrongfully denied parenting time, the non-custodial parent shall advise the Friend of the Court in writing, of the dates(s) of alleged, wrongfully denied parenting time. The Friend of the Court shall schedule a hearing before the referee (or circuit court judge) to determine whether parenting time was wrongfully denied. Notice of the hearing shall be given to both parties.
The Friend of the Court shall also send to the custodial parent a notice of the application of this policy with the alleged denial. This notice shall contain the following statement in boldface type of not less than 12 points.

FAILURE TO RESPOND TO THE FRIEND OF THE COURT OFFICE WITHIN 21 DAYS OF THIS NOTICE TO WORK OUT A SATISFACTORY ARRANGEMENT MAY RESULT IN CONTEMPT OF COURT PROCEEDINGS BEING BROUGHT AGAINST YOU. ANY AND ALL RESPONSES PRIOR TO HEARING MUST BE MADE IN WRITING.

The date of the postmark will be used to determine whether either party has complied within the time limits.

If the parties reach an agreement to resolve the alleged violation of parenting time prior to the hearing, the complainant may request the hearing be dismissed. The request to dismiss the hearing must be made in writing.


The following are examples of explanations by the custodial parent for denial of parenting time which are generally not acceptable.

The child had a minor illness
The child has to go someplace else.
The child was not home.
The non-custodial parent is behind in his/her support obligation.
The custodial parent did not want the child to go on parenting time.
The weather was bad.
The child had no clothes to wear.
The child refused to go.
The non-custodial parent failed to meet preconditions unilaterally established by the custodial parent.
Religious reasons - unless provided for in the court order.

The following are examples of explanations by the custodial parent for denial of parenting time which are generally acceptable:

The non-custodial parent was impaired by drugs or alcohol at the time of parenting time.
The non-custodial parent failed to arrive for parenting time within one-half hour of the time specified in the order unless otherwise arranged by the parties.
The non-custodial parent failed to meet mutually agreed to or court established preconditions.
The non-custodial parent has established a pattern of ailing to exercise scheduled parenting time.


After a final determination that parenting time was wrongfully denied, an Order will be entered providing that parenting time shall be made up at a later date with the same type of parenting time that was denied, i.e. weekend for weekend, weekday for weekday, holiday for holiday, and summer parenting time for summer parenting time or as the parties can agree.

The order may also provide for the non-custodial parent to give the office of the Friend of the Court and custodial parent a written notice of makeup parenting time at least 1 week before a makeup weekday or weekend parenting time or at least 30 days before a makeup holiday or makeup summer parenting time.

Should you have any questions regarding this policy, please contact the Friend of the Court, or write a letter stating what information you need clarified.

 

[mmmagique]

Rather than dividing up time like you might a pie, might I suggest that unless it is excessive, you allow someone who would like to do something nice for your children the opportunity to do so, even if it is *your* time?

I just really don't understand this whole thing.

 

[escape2paradise]

Unless your order says you have to allow make up time, you don't legally have to. However, you are being a petty jerk. Is mom a little off, it sounds like it. She went about things all wrong, but that doesn't exclude you from doing the right thing. Let the kids go with the grandparents. Provided, of course, this is not the same grandpa that is accused of abuse.

 

[Ohiogal]

Does the court order state she forfeits time? Is there a ROFR in your court order? Who handles transportation? Were you supposed to drop the children off for the MOther's Day holiday? I noticed you dropped the children off on Sunday at 5pm on Mother's Day.

As for the rest GROW UP. Why are you denying your children the time to do something enjoyable -- it is YOUR time? Great. I want my marbles and baseball and to go home because you won't do what I want.
Nice parenting. Nice maturity level. I am sure you get along real well with your children since you seem to be on their level of acting.

 

[Isis1]

past posts make for some interesting reading. lovely name handle. no wonder he "knows" mom was using drugs

 

[TheGeekess]

past posts make for some interesting reading. lovely name handle. no wonder he "knows" mom was using drugs

I was wondering if that was his birthday or his hobby.

 

[Isis1]

I was wondering if that was his birthday or his hobby.

he referred to it as a "special date' to him reading his posts, i started to wonder if mom ran off with HIS supplier

 

[penelope10]

Just wanted to ask---Do you particularly dislike these grandparents for some reason? Do you feel that your children would not have fun in the care of GM and GP? You do know that GM and GP have no control over how their daughter acts---she's an adult. Have you become so entrenched in "winning" that you have lost sight of the big picture?

If GM and GP are people that enrich your children's lives, why would you want to deny time with these grandparents? Frankly I feel it's rather sad that the situation is so bad that you acknowledge that GM and GP felt compelled to "sweeten" the pot in order to spend the time with the kiddos. Perhaps their daughter is a flake etc. They have no control over that now, she's an adult. If they are cordial to you and kind to the kiddos, let them HAVE the flipping time. You're going to probably be alive longer than they are at this point. (Other opportunities for you to spend with the children). Time is more on your side than their's. Grow up.

 

[bd420]

Thanks Ginny J for the reply, Midland County is actually the adjacent county as well.

Our court order says nothing specific on Make-Up Parenting time, it defers to the Michigan CS Manual on this and many other issues.

Doing something nice for the children is the obvious positive in this scenario, however I've got a few extra factors I've had to consider for the past 3 years when the nice is on my time: 1) Their mom won't give the time back 2) This nice time is with the grandparent that abused the mother as a child, alledgedly by the mother herself, which I am stedfastly against since the outset. I did ask for a certified psychic evaluation of the step-grandfather to see if he was fit to care for my daughter, but both he and the kid's mom REFUSED this request, which I have documented in versions of the divorce settlement. That would have cleared up A LOT of issues, so why not do it? Maybe the answer is bc he is NOT FIT and they know it???

OhioGal, I expected some responses like this, it's hard to present the entire backdrop of 3 years in one post, thanks for not giving me the benefit of the doubt however, class act.

IsabellaSoriano, the reference to 420 never gets old, turn the page bro, it's just a numba.

penelope10, I don't mind the Gp's, as long as I know the GF is 'safe', which I don't. It's way beyond doing the right thing, the mom just does not co-operate in return. I spose I should just give her the Full custody that she wants but doesn't want to go to court and get as well? I mean, that'd be pretty grown up, wouldn't it?

I'll be back posting in Sept when our 14 1/2 year old tells his mom, as he's planning, that he doesn't want to live with her and her husband anymore and is moving to Dad's. The same husband that she had in the presence of the kids 3 WEEKS into the divorce proceedings/separation. The same situation that I asked her, in one of the divorce settlements, if she'd pay for 100% (as opposed to the 1/3) of any counseling that either child may incur due to her new beau being brought into the picture 5 1/4 MONTHS EARLIER than MOST Child Psychs would have suggested. She REFUSED. My son HATES HIM. He says he was brought into his life TOO EARLY. He WASN'T READY.

It truly SUCKS to be right about most of the things that have been happening in this aftermath, but doing the right thing is not always so cut and dried, have I made my point?

Yes, if nothing else, this has been an 'entertaining' 3 years. Over 3 1/2 since Dec 23rd of 2004 actually.

Thanks all so far,

bd

 

[Humusluvr]

I did ask for a certified psychic evaluation of the step-grandfather to see if he was fit to care for my daughter, but both he and the kid's mom REFUSED this request,

I, also, would refuse to be seen by a psychic

 

[TinkerBelleLuvr]

I think it's a case of unwritten rules that know one knows how to navigate. After a while, you don't know how to avoid the land mines, or should I say Rule mine.

My view, right or wrong, was simply that their Mother had forfeited her Parenting Time for this holiday by choosing to be unavailable.

This is the end of Part I. Is the mother entitled to the 2 days back in your opinion(s)?

That's why I posted the MI rules, if it is NOT spelled out in their court order.

I'll be back posting in Sept when our 14 1/2 year old tells his mom, as he's planning, that he doesn't want to live with her and her husband anymore and is moving to Dad's.

Children may have INPUT at that age, but don't get to "decide". I KNOW this one.

 

[Humusluvr]

IsabellaSoriano, the reference to 420 never gets old, turn the page bro, it's just a numba.

Does "numba" rhyme with "dumba?"

Because the more you post, the dumba I think you are....

 

[TinkerBelleLuvr]

[The parties to this action were the parents of 4 children. The mother was awarded physical custody in a judgment entered in 2001. In 2004, the father filed a motion to change custody of one of the children. He alleged (as the basis for his motion) that this child desired to reside with him because they had many interests in common. The trial court declined to hold an evidentiary hearing finding that the father had not demonstrated that a change in circumstances had occurred justifying modification of the custody of that child.
The father than moved for reconsideration of the denial. He alleged several additional factors that he claimed supported his motion. Again the court denied the request finding that the allegations could have been raised in the original motion.

The Court of Appeals affirmed. To modify a custody award there must be a proper cause or change of circumstances that establishes that the modification is in the child’s best interests. “Proper cause” to change custody exists when an appropriate ground which has or could have a significant impact on the child’s life merits a reevaluation of the child’s custodial situation. A “change of circumstances” exists when conditions pertaining to the child’s custody, which have or could have a significant impact on the child’s well being, have materially changed.

The Court of Appeals concluded that the defendant cited no authority to support his assertion that the child’s desire to live with the petitioning parent is sufficient, in and of itself, to constitute proper cause or a change in circumstances that would support a change in custody. Further, the Court held that it is not an abuse of discretion for the trial court to deny a motion for reconsideration based on factors that could have been provided in connection with an initial motion.

MICHEL v. MICHEL, (Unpublished #256395), November 9, 2004
http://courts.co.calhoun.mi.us/04dom014.htm

So, unless there is WAY more, unless mom agrees, you are fighting an uphill battle.