Deface/damage Public Property

[Johnmelissa]

Warning Call

Carl, thank you very much. Is it common for police to have scanners in their homes? Can you assign a percentage? If so, is it legal for an officer to evade law enforcement against himself by monitoring a police scanner; sort of a case of "sworn officer" insider trading. That should be a crime as the scanner would be a TOOL to be used by the officer to avoid citation or arrest. Also, how do scanners alert the operator? Does the screen have to be watched constantly or does it emit an audible tone?

Thank you.

 

[CdwJava]

Carl, thank you very much. Is it common for police to have scanners in their homes?

Not so common ... but, they almost all have their police radios if they are assigned, and some may keep them on all the time to scan traffic. I know many officers that do that, but far more keep the darn thing off when they are at home. I turn mine on, but then, I'm responsible for what happens so there are times when I want to know what is going on. When I was just an indian, I almost never turned it on at home.

Can you assign a percentage?

Not really. I'd say close to 3/4 have a scanner or radio of some kind at home, but probably less than 25% might be listening. But, that's just a guess.

Far more likely is someone else was listening and called him ... if he moved the vehicle as a response to the radio call.

And, yes, it is also possible that someone at the agency (dispatch, admin, patrol, etc.) called him and told him to move the truck.

If so, is it legal for an officer to evade law enforcement against himself by monitoring a police scanner; sort of a case of "sworn officer" insider trading.

If the general public can do it, the officer can do it. So, yes, it is lawful for him to do it.

That should be a crime as the scanner would be a TOOL to be used by the officer to avoid citation or arrest.

As nice as that might be, and as useful a tool as that might be for use against dopers and the like, it's just not in the law.

Also, how do scanners alert the operator? Does the screen have to be watched constantly or does it emit an audible tone?

It's audible. When a channel that you are scanning has traffic, it comes over the radio. Depending on the radio or scanner, you can set certain channels to have priority (like the primary dispatch channel for where you live, perhaps). So, if he was listening to his scanner - even in the background - chances are he would key on his address being put out over the air ... I know I would.

When i was in So. Cal. I used to train my officers to pick out pieces of conversations by scanning two primary channels, our car-to-car channel, the primary dispatch channel for a neighboring agency, the AM radio set to news talk, and I would carry on a conversation with him or her. I would then randomly ask where another officer was and what kind of call they were on. In other words, the officers were trained to key on important pieces of conversations through a blizzard of "noise". Any officer on the job for a year or more will develop that skill to one degree or another.


Regards,

- Carl

 

[Johnmelissa]

Warning Call

Excellent. Your posts are highly educational. I just couldn't believe that the neighbor ran out and moved the truck immediately before the responder would have arrived. Just too much luck there. I got lost on that "indian" reference. How does that apply?

Thanks,

John (my daughter's name is Melissa; you have to get user names and passwords from somewhere, right?)

 

[CdwJava]

Excellent. Your posts are highly educational. I just couldn't believe that the neighbor ran out and moved the truck immediately before the responder would have arrived. Just too much luck there.

It probably was not "luck", but then, it could have been coincidence ... no way to know for sure, though it's likely he heard it or someone who DID hear it (even a non-cop) called and told him. Like I said, that happens a lot here.

I got lost on that "indian" reference. How does that apply?

Sorry. I was referring to when I was a patrol officer or an investigator, an "indian" as opposed to a supervisor, or "chief". It's oft-used police venacular.

John (my daughter's name is Melissa; you have to get user names and passwords from somewhere, right?)

Ah! I just assumed your wife was Melissa, or some such thing.

As a note, using kids, pets and birthdays as PASSWORDS would be a very bad idea!

- Carl

 

[Johnmelissa]

Warning Call

Carl,

I don't see my last post. I guess I clicked the wrong button. Good thing I'm not in one of those missile silos in North Dakota. Speaking of which, they could probably lob one of their low yield devices onto the Capitol of Somalia and end this pirate affair post haste, eh? But I digress. Oh yeah, indians. I like that one. I never thought of it that way. It's sort of reverse engineering. If you're a Chief, below you must be indians. Got it.

You have a mind for security. When I use the Internet, I just try to get tasks over with using the first thing that comes to mind but that's what the info perps (or is it unsub - my wife likes Law and Order - SVU) would try first, the closest and most public names and numbers. Sometimes I think this Brave New World would be easier to negotiate if everyone had a barcode behind their ear - sort of just scan and run.

O.K. I learn a lot about the "real" law from you. Thanks.

 

[CdwJava]

You have a mind for security. When I use the Internet, I just try to get tasks over with using the first thing that comes to mind but that's what the info perps (or is it unsub - my wife likes Law and Order - SVU) would try first, the closest and most public names and numbers. Sometimes I think this Brave New World would be easier to negotiate if everyone had a barcode behind their ear - sort of just scan and run.

O.K. I learn a lot about the "real" law from you. Thanks.

Personally, I would not want an America that was THAT "Big Brother"-ish. Though, I suspect for ease of life we're heading to that or chipping some day.

And "perps" is used mostly in "Law and Order", while "unsubs" tends to be used in "Criminal Minds." Those aren't terms we use too often out here ... but, then, the east - and NYPD - is a different animal, and much of the TV is dominated by it (like all the Law and Orders for example).

- Carl

 

[Johnmelissa]

Complaint Investigation Process

Carl, I made a complaint. It included a floodlight aimed directly at the front of my yard, garage and driveway. About 6 days after I sent the complaint, the light I wanted to demonstrate for the Sgt. investigating went out. The Sgt., on my property for an interview, didn't see the light because it had been turned off and said that he hadn't told the Deputy but that maybe the deputy had seen it on the Sgt.'s desk. One thing is for damn sure; that light that was aimed directly at my house from the cop next door was turned off right after the Sheriff Dept. received the complaint. Question, Carl: is the officer complaint investigation supposed to revealed immediately to the officer? How is that process supposed to go, covertly? Should I ask the Sgt. investigating if he gave infromation without authorization or would that spoil any chance I have to get a sustained complaint. Should I call the DA or IA???

THANKS, Carl - Always The Good Cop.
THANKS, John

 

[CdwJava]

Question, Carl: is the officer complaint investigation supposed to revealed immediately to the officer?

Pursuant to state law, the agency is required to notify the accused officer of the nature of the complaint and that an investigation will be taking place. So, unless the agency was simply conducting an administrative review of the complaint prior to initiating a formal investigation, he was advised of the complaint.

How is that process supposed to go, covertly?

The investigation can be covert, but in the end he has a right to all o fit. At the start, he only has a right to see the complaint and the "charges" being investigated by the department.

Should I ask the Sgt. investigating if he gave infromation without authorization or would that spoil any chance I have to get a sustained complaint. Should I call the DA or IA???

The DA has nothing to do with this as you have explained it. This would be entirely an IA issue. Is it possible that someone dimed off the Sgt's trip to your place? Sure. But, in most larger agencies I don't see that anyone would know the IA Sgt's comings and goings ... heck, I work in a small one, and mine might know if I'm leaving, but unless I say that I'm going to Interview John Smith, they wouldn't know whether I was on my way to Starbucks or taking an late lunch.

Sorry. No easy answer. but, at least it sounds like his agency is looking into it. That's something.

- Carl

 

[Johnmelissa]

Complaint Process

Carl, thanks. I appreciate the info and your rapid response. I sure hope you're not billing me like my attorney.

You are, once again, spot on. The officer was notified, came home and turned off the floodlight he had directed at the front of the house. All by the book. My complaint included a judge's order, from arbitration, to turn off other lights the neighbor/cop directed at our bedroom windows. I guess he wanted to clean up any behavior that might be suspect in a complaint investigation. Actually, I hadn't mentioned the front floodlight in the complaint. FYI, a Sergeant (I believe he is the neighbor/cop's supervisor) came to our house in uniform on a motorcycle. I don't think he was IA and probably indicated that the agency doesn't take the complaint seriously at all. When the Sergeant interviewed me at my home, I told him I wanted to show him a light aimed at my house but that the neighbor/cop shut it off a couple of days after I filed a complaint. The Sergeant said that the neighbor/cop didn't find out from him but the neighbor/cop may have seen it on the Sergeant's desk. I just thought that was an odd response since a complaint, as you've indicated, is revealed to the officer upon receipt. It was as if the Sergeant was attempting to cover himself. Also, he told me when scheduling the interview that he wanted to come when the neighbor/cop was NOT home and was away at work. A bit of intrigue here.

A little irony; the neighbor/cop is so paranoid that he has MANY cameras at various points on his property and one is high on a flag pole sticking way out from the front facia of his house and is aimed directly at our ENTIRE front yard. The Sergeant's arrival and departure was clearly and completely recorded on the neighbor/cop's security video system - HE GOT HIS BOSS.

I'm so old that I used to watch the flickering films of the Keystone Cops. Something brings that to mind.

Thank you very much for all the good information.

 

[CdwJava]

Carl, thanks. I appreciate the info and your rapid response. I sure hope you're not billing me like my attorney.

Wellll ... times ARE tough, and I AM raising a family of five on my sole income.

FYI, a Sergeant (I believe he is the neighbor/cop's supervisor) came to our house in uniform on a motorcycle. I don't think he was IA and probably indicated that the agency doesn't take the complaint seriously at all.

Not necessarily. Many complaints are farmed out to immediate supervisors to be addressed unless they are likely to involve complex investigations or could result in criminal prosecution. It could be that the powers that be felt that the supervisor could look into it effectively.

The Sergeant said that the neighbor/cop didn't find out from him but the neighbor/cop may have seen it on the Sergeant's desk. I just thought that was an odd response since a complaint, as you've indicated, is revealed to the officer upon receipt.

It may not have been revealed to him, yet. As I mentioned, an administrative inquiry can be made to determine if there is sufficient cause to pursue an investigation or if it can be disposed of without a full IA investigation. It might be possible for him to have the paperwork on hi sdesk and for someone to observe it ... that's sloppy, but depending on how the physical set-up is at the office, it is possible.

It was as if the Sergeant was attempting to cover himself.

It might be. He may have let it leak, or, he may have left it out so that anyone on the shift could have read it. Who knows? But, if the lights are off, does it matter now?

A little irony; the neighbor/cop is so paranoid that he has MANY cameras at various points on his property and one is high on a flag pole sticking way out from the front facia of his house and is aimed directly at our ENTIRE front yard. The Sergeant's arrival and departure was clearly and completely recorded on the neighbor/cop's security video system - HE GOT HIS BOSS.

Nothing illegal about recording what is in public. If his camera high up on the flagpole is looking into your backyard, then he might be committing a crime. I'd have to look at the law on that again, but I believe that if something is being recorded from a place where a person cannot observe it, then it can be criminal. But, if it is aimed towards your front yard, then it's annoying, but not likely a crime.

Thank you very much for all the good information.

Sorry you have to go through all of this. If he were one of mine, this would have ended a long time ago.

- Carl

 

[Johnmelissa]

Complaint Process

OK, Carl, you're a good man. My father was the breadwinner and we, 4 kids, always had a mom at home. It was the old days and he built Chevys, Pontiacs, Buicks and Oldsmobiles for General Motors in Southern California (those cars would go, man). Mom stayed home and rounded up all us wild children and she did some great home cookin'. Somebody told me once, whatever you have is enough. I figure that's about right. If you've got a good wife and kids to carry on I guess you've got it all. Maybe that's why you seem to be a well balanced cop who is there to "help" people.

You're right, there's nothing illegal about the camera. It's there simply to harass us. I just thought it was ironical that the only things of any significance to come from the neighbor/cop's video security system are images of his own BOSS. Kinda funny.

OK. Thanks again, Carl, I'll talk to you next episode. Say hi to the family for me.

 

[CdwJava]

A good wife, three kids, and they've all had to suffer through the cruddy schedules, the calls in the middle of the night, and the mood swings. But, we persevere through faith, God, and family.

Good luck, and thanks for the kind words.

- Carl

 

[Johnmelissa]

Expunge Arrest Record

Carl,

I was falsely arrested 2 years ago for "battery by garden hose water" which was immediately rejected by the D.A.'s office. The psycho neighbor/cop sprayed me with water, told his family to come out and call the cops when I sprayed him back and ran in the house and hid. The event was on video which the cops ignored and I begged for lie detector tests.

My question here is can I get ALL reports and investigation-generated material; anything and everything on record with the local sheriff's office related to this false arrest? How do I get documents from the sheriff's office as it is hostile to the public and to citizens who request documents. Often they provide one-sentence "reports" when there are reams and reams on file. How do I obtain ALL reports, charges and documentation related to my false arrest of 2 years ago so that I am prepared to file an expungement proceeding in court?

Thanks,

John

 

[CdwJava]

Carl,

I was falsely arrested 2 years ago for "battery by garden hose water" which was immediately rejected by the D.A.'s office.

I seem to recall that ...

The psycho neighbor/cop sprayed me with water, told his family to come out and call the cops when I sprayed him back and ran in the house and hid. The event was on video which the cops ignored and I begged for lie detector tests.

All of which we discussed previously, so I don't suspect we need to rehash the ins and outs of that here.

My question here is can I get ALL reports and investigation-generated material; anything and everything on record with the local sheriff's office related to this false arrest?

By way of subpoena or court order. That will require there be some legal proceeding in process. You can ASK for this information, but they are not under any legal obligation to give you all of it. Some of the information might be available on request, but that will likely be things like the CAD calls (info on the dispatch system) regarding the location, nature of call, name of reporting party, and the like.

How do I get documents from the sheriff's office as it is hostile to the public and to citizens who request documents. Often they provide one-sentence "reports" when there are reams and reams on file. How do I obtain ALL reports, charges and documentation related to my false arrest of 2 years ago so that I am prepared to file an expungement proceeding in court?

As above.

If you have an attorney, he or she should know how to properly subpoena that information.

You might also want to avoid making claims of "false arrest" in any paperwork requesting expungement pursuant to PC 1203.4 as that may cause them to balk at the request sine, as I recall, no court ever made a decision that any arrest was a "false arrest." Just stick to the details the court needs and leave the opinion out of it.

If charges were dropped or never filed, then you are not seeking an expungement per PC 1203.4, you are seeking a finding of factual innocence pursuant to PC 851.8.

CA Codes (pen:833-851.90)

This is filed with the agency holding the record and with the DA. if rejected, then it goes to a court to seek an order for the purging of all the records related to the incident.

- Carl

 

[Johnmelissa]

Expunge Arrest Record

Carl,

Thanks. Do you think there's a point to attempting to expunge? I'm 59 and retired. It's not like it's hurting my job search.

Is it possible to purge electronic records that can go global in a flash and would they return photographs and fingerprints? I have a desire to clear the record on principle but, ultimately, it doesn't appear to amount to a hill of beans (excuse the down-home, ag reference). I don't expect to "perpetrate" again before I die. I guess that arrest record could just sit there.

To clarify the history, some form went from the Sheriff to the D.A. who "rejected" it immediately.

I could file the 851 myself and give the agency some period of time to respond before I pay an attorney. The Sheriff can simply ignore the 851.

Thanks