Life beyond an "awol" OTH-it's not all dark and grim

[andrew anderson]

Undoubtedly, if you've Googled upon this resource in your underground hunt for information, you're consumed with fear as to what lies ahead. A quick overview of previous threads on this site will inform you that the process is relatively painless provided you go about it in an intelligent manner. Alas, many concerns remain about the prospects of future employment after this black mark on your record. The following is a brief account of my professional life, as well as that of a couple "awol camp" friends, taken from a previous post I made here:

"I'm a state licensed physician who attended a US D.O. school on partial scholarship. I was accepted at 5 institutions, 3 with partial funding, 1 md/phd program, and nobody was unsatisfied with my awol OTH. It came up in every interview, and only one admissions officer blinked twice upon explanation. I have a buddy from "awol camp" who is now a litigator and yet another who is very successful in the private sector. In educated sectors of the country, private industry simply doesn't care, by and large.

Unless you desire state funded mediocrity; IE, easy govt jobs with a reasonable pension, middle class wages, and easy, uninspiring work, an OTH will not hinder your professional life."

That's the nuts and bolts of my experience. Literally the only thing that an OTH seriously hinders professionally is a governmental job, and even that isn't off the table. I worked for my state rep as an undergrad, for example. Moreover, the examples above are examples of professional situations in which omitting is an impossibility-these are state boards who perform thorough background checks. Most background checks for private industry jobs that don't require state certification in sensitive fields will never check the VA records. Unless you committed an aggravated crime in the military that translates into a civilian notation, nobody will ever know. Obviously whether or not you choose to not mention your military experience is a highly personal decision. I'm merely informing you of the reality of what will be exposed.

Hopefully this will encourage some of you who are consumed with fear in this difficult situation. Best of luck, guys and gals.

 

[ERAUPIKE]

Undoubtedly, if you've Googled upon this resource in your underground hunt for information, you're consumed with fear as to what lies ahead. A quick overview of previous threads on this site will inform you that the process is relatively painless provided you go about it in an intelligent manner. Alas, many concerns remain about the prospects of future employment after this black mark on your record. The following is a brief account of my professional life, as well as that of a couple "awol camp" friends, taken from a previous post I made here:

"I'm a state licensed physician who attended a US D.O. school on partial scholarship. I was accepted at 5 institutions, 3 with partial funding, 1 md/phd program, and nobody was unsatisfied with my awol OTH. It came up in every interview, and only one admissions officer blinked twice upon explanation. I have a buddy from "awol camp" who is now a litigator and yet another who is very successful in the private sector. In educated sectors of the country, private industry simply doesn't care, by and large.

Unless you desire state funded mediocrity; IE, easy govt jobs with a reasonable pension, middle class wages, and easy, uninspiring work, an OTH will not hinder your professional life."

That's the nuts and bolts of my experience. Literally the only thing that an OTH seriously hinders professionally is a governmental job, and even that isn't off the table. I worked for my state rep as an undergrad, for example. Moreover, the examples above are examples of professional situations in which omitting is an impossibility-these are state boards who perform thorough background checks. Most background checks for private industry jobs that don't require state certification in sensitive fields will never check the VA records. Unless you committed an aggravated crime in the military that translates into a civilian notation, nobody will ever know. Obviously whether or not you choose to not mention your military experience is a highly personal decision. I'm merely informing you of the reality of what will be exposed.

Hopefully this will encourage some of you who are consumed with fear in this difficult situation. Best of luck, guys and gals.

You decided to again minimize the impact your poor decision made on your life, fantastic. You should at least try to make you lie believable if you are going to try to pass off your fantasy as a reality.

 

[andrew anderson]

You decided to again minimize the impact your poor decision made on your life, fantastic. You should at least try to make you lie believable if you are going to try to pass off your fantasy as a reality.

It was a fantastic decision, in fact. I'm proud of it. My morality supersedes any oath.

I'm sad for you that you find success beyond an awol charge to be unfathomable. Alas, please refrain from trolling.

 

[beengone]

thats freakn awesome with success after an OTH!

 

[ERAUPIKE]

Let me point out a couple of things you missed out on yet again. You wanted to be an MD. The state has a licensing board that will more than likely deny your application. You got partial funding for your school, any vet with a GI bill will get their full tuition paid along with additional money to live. I guess your morality cost you more then you thought.

 

[andrew anderson]

Let me point out a couple of things you missed out on yet again. You wanted to be an MD. The state has a licensing board that will more than likely deny your application. You got partial funding for your school, any vet with a GI bill will get their full tuition paid along with additional money to live. I guess your morality cost you more then you thought.

Already passed boards, with no explanation necessary. Further, I was granted a plethora of financial incentives both as an undergrad as well as a medical student via scholarship and grant packages. The GI Bill is certainly a great bonus. Unfortunately, it's irrelevant to the conversation at hand.

My moral capacity is what led me to leave the service in favor of keeping people alive-seriously kiddo, don't try to keep up with me, on any level. End the trolling gig, make some friends, and you won't feel the need to belittle awol kids on the internet.

I can refer you to a specialist via private message if indeed you're ready to confront whatever it is that is bothering you so deeply.

Be well.

 

[cl04]

Im curious how long were you gone and did you turn yourself in? I'm in a little predicament of my own. I start school in August and no longer have any desire to serve this fascist regime bent on world domination. I have made my dissent very known through minor misconduct, as well as verbally to my command. I believe they will try to hold me here out of spite because they know I start a very good school in august. Once mid July rolls around if I'm not in the final stages of being discharged then they had better send a search party out because AMN ***** will be OUT. I don't really fear any type of discharge and shame has no bearing on me as well, there are other ways of serving your country other than institutionalized force. My only concern is what techniques (if any) are used in apprehending individuals that elect to end their service as I might. Thank you

 

[ERAUPIKE]

Already passed boards, with no explanation necessary. Further, I was granted a plethora of financial incentives both as an undergrad as well as a medical student via scholarship and grant packages. The GI Bill is certainly a great bonus. Unfortunately, it's irrelevant to the conversation at hand.

My moral capacity is what led me to leave the service in favor of keeping people alive-seriously kiddo, don't try to keep up with me, on any level. End the trolling gig, make some friends, and you won't feel the need to belittle awol kids on the internet.

I can refer you to a specialist via private message if indeed you're ready to confront whatever it is that is bothering you so deeply.

Be well.

Again, you are stating fantasy like it is a reality. We both know that you are not and never will be a medical doctor. Why do you feel like I am trying to keep up with you? I have already surpassed you on so many levels. I would like to quote JFK here, "A young man who does not have what it takes to perform military service is not likely to have what it takes to make a living." You can try to justify what you did as much as you want but it will not change the fact that it was wrong. You have a permanent mark on your record that will never go away. Please keep your fantasy and non-legal advice to yourself from now on. This is not the itsnotsobad.com forum.

 

[Zigner]

I find it interesting that our OP feels that breaking a promise (oath) somehow puts him on the moral high ground...

 

[ERAUPIKE]

I find it interesting that our OP feels that breaking a promise (oath) somehow puts him on the moral high ground...

Amen Zigner, amen.

 

[cyberspook]

I try not to contribute to this endless topic (which usualy has no legal advice) of what a OTH will do to one's future. But, I have had a few drinks and have very little else to do right now. I will also try to offer my unbiased (good luck with that ;-) ) advice.

A OTH (Other Than Honorable) discharge virtualy offers no veteran benefits, and yes there will be people/potential employers that will discriminate against you for (in their opinion) "shirking" your responsibility to your country, just as many potential people/potential employers will dismiss you for having a weak handshake.

I have known many men that have received these types of discharges. Many of these people are good law abiding citizens with good moral value that have simply made bad decisions in their youth. I have also met many that, well simply stated "suck at life"

The fate of your future is for the most part in your hands. Many people have made bad decisions, or decisions they regret. I have seen to many people let their lives go, simply because of regrets. Spiteful internet post don't help the matter either.

Many will judge you for the mistakes you have made (even if you don't consider them to be mistakes) through out your life.

I hope this will be my last philisophical post. I try to keep my posts limited to what I can contribute on a legal basis from my past expieriences, that's probably why I have so few posts...

 

[BsBfrantic]

Or you could run into several employers that don't agree with the war or killing others, etc. That might admire you for leaving. I believe it goes both ways, especially nowadays with the new view on the Iraq war.

 

[Silverplum]

Or you could run into several employers that don't agree with the war or killing others, etc. That might admire you for leaving. I believe it goes both ways, especially nowadays with the new view on the Iraq war.

Or an (intelligent) employer might wonder what kind of dimwitted doofus signed up for the military if s/he was actually "against killing people."

 

[BsBfrantic]

Maybe they weren't against it at first because they were mislead.....

"According to trends, the number of poll respondents who said they did not support the Iraq war has steadily risen as the war stretched into a second and then a third year. In the most recent poll, 36 percent said they were in favor of the war -- half of the peak of 72 percent who said they were in favor of the war as it began." - CNN poll

" Overwhelming civilian casualties are a daily occurrence in Iraq.
Despite attempts in training and technological sophistication, large-scale civilian death is both a direct and indirect result of United States aggression in Iraq. Even the most conservative estimates of Iraqi civilian deaths number over 100,000. Currently over 100 civilians die every day in Baghdad alone." -Iraq Veterans against the war

" Soldiers have the right to refuse illegal war.
All in service to this country swear an oath to protect and defend the Constitution of the United States against all enemies, both foreign and domestic. However, they are prosecuted if they object to serve in a war they see as illegal under our Constitution. As such, our brothers and sisters are paying the price for political incompetence, forced to fight in a war instead of having been sufficiently trained to carry out the task of nation-building." -Iraq Veterans against the war

IRAQ VETERANS AGAINST THE WAR
PRESENT
THE TRUTH ABOUT WHAT
RECRUITERS PROMISE
• “I can promise you won’t go to Iraq or Afghanistan because of your assigned Military Occupational
Specialty/Duty Station/branch of service/reserve or guard status/because I say so.”
Recruiters can promise this, but their word means nothing to the people who will actually decide
what the military does with you. Personnel from the Navy and Air Force are being pulled as
“Individual Mobilization Augmentees” to run convoys in Iraq after a two-week crash course. The
Marine Corps has even sent band members to Iraq for combat missions.
• “You can choose active duty or reserves and an enlistment period of two years, four years, or more,
depending on the commitment you want to make.”
Every contract is for a period of eight years including time in the inactive reserves. The contract you
sign is unilateral, meaning it only binds you, not the military. You can choose what that contract
says, but it does not stop the military from putting you on stop-loss or involuntarily extending you.
At least 120,000 military personnel have been affected by these policies since 9/11.
• “If you’re enlisted in the Delayed Entry Program (DEP) you can’t get out of serving.”
Recruiters will tell you that you will go to jail if you don’t go, but that’s just another lie. For more
information, go to www.girights.org or call 1.800.394.9544.
• “If you don’t like it, you can get out at any time with a ‘failure to adapt’ discharge.”
There are a variety of unpleasant ways to get out of the military, but “not liking it” is not one of
them. If you refuse to train, the drill sergeants will use any means available to keep you in. If the
command finally decides that discharge is the only option, the process may take months to complete.
• “You will get plenty of money to get a college degree when you get out of the military, as well as
numerous chances to get ahead on your education while still on active duty.”
On average, the Montgomery GI Bill will only cover 1/2 the cost of a public college and 1/5 the cost
of a private college. In order to get that money for college after you get off active duty, you have to
contribute money to the fund from the day they start paying you. So many servicemen are
disqualified from getting that money that the military makes money from the program.
• 28% of women report being raped while in the service. Many rapes go unreported.
• 5.6% of people who enter the GI Montgomery Bill use all the money available to them.
• 75% of Blacks and 67% of Latinos report experiencing racial prejudice in the service.
• Veterans aged 20 to 24 are unemployed at almost twice the rate of their peers who didn’t enlist.
• US war veterans are twice as likely to kill themselves as ordinary civilians.
• Only 12% males and 6% of females vets surveyed made any use of skill learned in the military.
• Vets are 3-5 times more likely to be homeless than non-veteran peers.
“Before you become a weapon of your democracy, ready to fight and kill and die in the
name of the United States of America, you need to have the utmost faith in that democracy.”
– Adam Kokesh, Iraq Veterans Against the War, USMC, Fallujah, Feb-Sep 2004
IVAW









------ We've all seen the documentaries and movies on veterans who talk nothing good about the war and how they were mislead when they joined or how they would be "serving their country". Where are the multitude of those that say different? I have never met one and I have a lot of family and friends that have done tours, killed, re enlisted, etc. But I guess this is not free positive, helpful, etc. advice. Where people don't try and belittle others who stood up for what they believed was right, or took their freedom back and left a job they didn't want to do anymore. Such as andrew anderson here who is now a licensed physician instead of..... in the military- or mentally screwed for the rest of his life, missing body parts, etc. because he did something he really didn't want to do. If a soldier really enjoys his job after he knows what it's all about (training)- good for him. He is happy with what he is doing and he should keep doing it. But why hold someone against their will? I thought America was so proud of our freedom? (without military we can't do this blah blah I know it's coming) I'm glad people come on here to tell the truth about life after awol and OTH discharges. From experience, I can also say it is not as scary or awful as people say.This is not the 1960's.

 

[andrew anderson]

Im curious how long were you gone and did you turn yourself in? I'm in a little predicament of my own. I start school in August and no longer have any desire to serve this fascist regime bent on world domination. I have made my dissent very known through minor misconduct, as well as verbally to my command. I believe they will try to hold me here out of spite because they know I start a very good school in august. Once mid July rolls around if I'm not in the final stages of being discharged then they had better send a search party out because AMN ***** will be OUT. I don't really fear any type of discharge and shame has no bearing on me as well, there are other ways of serving your country other than institutionalized force. My only concern is what techniques (if any) are used in apprehending individuals that elect to end their service as I might. Thank you

was gone for about a year. Turned myself in by simply driving up the base.

Again, you are stating fantasy like it is a reality. We both know that you are not and never will be a medical doctor. Why do you feel like I am trying to keep up with you? I have already surpassed you on so many levels. I would like to quote JFK here, "A young man who does not have what it takes to perform military service is not likely to have what it takes to make a living." You can try to justify what you did as much as you want but it will not change the fact that it was wrong. You have a permanent mark on your record that will never go away. Please keep your fantasy and non-legal advice to yourself from now on. This is not the itsnotsobad.com forum.

You're just a very bitter man who isn't particularly intelligent, hellbent on living vicariously through an internet persona. We both know that.

You're a troll. Nothing else really to say. Sorry you couldn't hack it above the state funded mediocrity.

I find it interesting that our OP feels that breaking a promise (oath) somehow puts him on the moral high ground...

German soldiers were just following orders.(they bleep out Na zi here, which is interesting?) We shouldn't judge-they followed an oath.

Life, and morality, is not so cut and dry. A lot of us considered fighting in an illegal war immoral, and acted accordingly.