Chances of Change in Custody?

[allwipedout]

What is the name of your state (only U.S. law)? : Oregon & Florida

In 1998 I was awarded primary custody of my daughter in Oregon. Now my daughter is 12 and wants to live with her father because she does not like the state we live in, which is now Florida. I understand my daughter's point of view in that she has had a hard time making close friends here and we not have a lot of family here, but right now we do not have the option of moving back to Oregon.

I am a stay-at-home mom and have a son with my new husband. We started homeschooling this last year at my daughter's request because she was having a hard time adjusting to middle school and wanted to be able to focus more on her interests. When my daughter is here we get along well and she is generally content to be here and has become active in a local club. But, when she goes to Oregon, she has another mind set.

My daughter's father has said that he is willing to go to court to try to get the custody changed if my daughter really wants to live with him. Although he is a nice person, during her life he has not spent a lot of time with her, even though she has been going every summer since she was a toddler. When she is in Oregon she usually stays with her grandparents, and even now does not stay at his house because she does not like it and would rather stay at the grandparents' home. He works a lot, but his parents live nearby and have always cared for my daughter when he is not available to be with her. He is also currently divorced and has another daughter that he does not have custody of. My daughter has several close friends/relatives there that she likes to hang out with.

What are the chances that the judge would rule in favor of granting her father custody now? How much weight does a judge give to a child's preference when determining change of custody?

Thank you very much for any input you can give!What is the name of your state (only U.S. law)?

 

[Proserpina]

How long have you lived in Florida?

 

[allwipedout]

We (my daughter and I) moved to Florida during our custody case in 1998.

Part of the custody covered my being able to move to Florida with my daughter.

 

[Proserpina]

We (my daughter and I) moved to Florida during our custody case in 1998.

Part of the custody covered my being able to move to Florida with my daughter.

Had it been a very recent move I could understand the indecision - new place, new family situation - and though I personally don't think a 12 year old should be making the decision unless it's in extreme circumstances, I could understand how her wishes would be a consideration.

But as it stands? Nope. Dad needs a change in your daughter's circumstance to justify changing custody if you're not willing to agree. And quite honestly I believe it's a mistake for Dad to allow your 12 year old daughter to be the one deciding where she wishes to live. When she's 18 she is absolutely free to do that - but until then, she goes by the current orders. This is an adult decision that needs to be made by the adults.

 

[allwipedout]

Thank you Dogmatique for your response

My ex's argument is that my daughter is very close to her grandparents and she has more family and friends there, and he rarely gets to see her, so he wants her to be able to live there. He also says that his newest daughter needs to be able to see my daughter and get to know her.

My argument is that my ex has not had a very good track record of actually spending time with our daughter, and that the family there has shown to give in to my daughter's desires on too many occasions without actually thinking things through. I also have a 7yo son who is very attached to my daughter and would be devastated, along with my husband and I, if she were to move to her father's home. I also think that my daughter has a greater chance to a good future by living here than she would in the small town where they are currently living.

 

[Proserpina]

Thank you Dogmatique for your response

My ex's argument is that my daughter is very close to her grandparents and she has more family and friends there, and he rarely gets to see her, so he wants her to be able to live there. He also says that his newest daughter needs to be able to see my daughter and get to know her.

My argument is that my ex has not had a very good track record of actually spending time with our daughter, and that the family there has shown to give in to my daughter's desires on too many occasions without actually thinking things through. I also have a 7yo son who is very attached to my daughter and would be devastated, along with my husband and I, if she were to move to her father's home. I also think that my daughter has a greater chance to a good future by living here than she would in the small town where they are currently living.

Custody isn't going to be changed because he wants to see her more often - and he does have the option of moving closer.

Of course your daughter deserves the chance to get to know all of her step- and/or half-siblings but no matter where she lives, she's going to go for long periods where she doesn't see certain family members. This can't be helped, and it's just part of how things are for her right now. If she stays with you, she'll miss her half-sister. If she lives with Dad, she'll miss her half-brother. It makes no sense for Dad to use this argument.

I can't see a compelling reason why Dad would succeed in an attempt to change custody. Though he perhaps has legitimate concerns he's got to realise that what he's claiming might be unfair to him would be equally unfair to you if the situation is reversed. Nobody would win, and your daughter would learn that she can successfully manipulate at least one parent - and that will do her absolutely no favors in the long run.

Kiddo stays with you, Mom. Encourage Dad to visit more often, perhaps - even an extended vacation with grandparents involved. Can they have internet sessions maybe? Webcams, that kind of thing? There's no reason why she can't enjoy close bonds with even the relatives she's far away from - it's just going to be on your terms, and not hers.

 

[allwipedout]

Thank you again Dogmatique!

I do realize it is an unfortunate situation for my daughter, I have tried to make it as easy for her as possible, including extending stays, unlimited phone calls and online communication. My daughter regularly talks to her grandparents, but does not talk to her dad very often.

The grandparents used to drive her and stay in the area for several months at a time, but now they can't afford it and I think it has made it a little harder for them and my daughter. The dad has come out to visit twice I think, each for a weekend visit.

Hopefully he will not insist on going to court, but if he does, I feel a little better that he may not be able to get custody of her.

 

[Proserpina]

Thank you again Dogmatique!

I do realize it is an unfortunate situation for my daughter, I have tried to make it as easy for her as possible, including extending stays, unlimited phone calls and online communication. My daughter regularly talks to her grandparents, but does not talk to her dad very often.

The grandparents used to drive her and stay in the area for several months at a time, but now they can't afford it and I think it has made it a little harder for them and my daughter. The dad has come out to visit twice I think, each for a weekend visit.

Hopefully he will not insist on going to court, but if he does, I feel a little better that he may not be able to get custody of her.

If it goes to court I would hope Dad would realise that your daughter is the one most at risk of being hurt and confused - not him, and not you. I do hope you can all work this out without it going that far, but yes, from what you've posted it would seem very unlikely that Dad would be successful.

Good luck!

 

[LdiJ]

I will add something else mom. Technically Oregon would have jurisdiction of the case since your original case was in Oregon and dad still lives there. However, due to the fact that you and your daughter have lived in FL for 11 years, its quite possible that you could get jurisdiction changed to FL.

Therefore, if you do get served, do consult with attorneys in both OR and FL before responding to the paperwork.

Also, do what you can to get your child involved as much as possible with other children, so that she has the opportunity to make friends.

Also, you need to make it clear to your attorney, once jurisdiction is decided, that what your daughter wants is what she has during the summer...she wants to live with her grandparents and that's most likely dad's intention as well. Your attorney needs to be aware that the child does not actually spend much time with dad.

 

[Ohiogal]

The child's wishes could definitely consitute a substantial change in circumstance due to the fact that the child was ONE when the case was decided and is now 12. That would allow the hearing to proceed and a determination made on best interests.

 

[allwipedout]

I will add something else mom. Technically Oregon would have jurisdiction of the case since your original case was in Oregon and dad still lives there. However, due to the fact that you and your daughter have lived in FL for 11 years, its quite possible that you could get jurisdiction changed to FL.

Therefore, if you do get served, do consult with attorneys in both OR and FL before responding to the paperwork.

Also, do what you can to get your child involved as much as possible with other children, so that she has the opportunity to make friends.

Also, you need to make it clear to your attorney, once jurisdiction is decided, that what your daughter wants is what she has during the summer...she wants to live with her grandparents and that's most likely dad's intention as well. Your attorney needs to be aware that the child does not actually spend much time with dad.

Thank you LdiJ

I have thought about jurisdiction and have no problems if it stays in Oregon since I will be able to use my original attorney who is still familiar with our case. My daughter has always wanted to live in Oregon, so she is technically not having a change of heart. I thought I had read that at the age of 13 the court's will start taking the child's preference into consideration. This is why my ex is probably now pushing for a change in custody, because he really had no chance of changing it before, and my daughter will be turning 13 in the next couple of months.

I have tried many times to get my daughter involved in activities I know that she will like, and while she did make a couple of friends (most of whom later created a lot of drama for her), she has just about all out refused to participate in any of the activities that I have tried to get her involved in, just because she wants to move back to Oregon and does not want to like it here. Obviously, she is doing these things out of stubborness and trying to force me to let her move.

I will definitely make sure to let my attorney know that she spends most of her time with her grandparents, and this was already part of our original custody case, so it shows a long pattern for him now...

 

[allwipedout]

The child's wishes could definitely consitute a substantial change in circumstance due to the fact that the child was ONE when the case was decided and is now 12. That would allow the hearing to proceed and a determination made on best interests.

Thank you Ohiogal

I realize that the court's will probably give weight to my daughter's preference, but I would like to know how much of a weight? Her father is not a bad person, he just doesn't always make the smartest decisions, most of which are made by the process of thinking what will make him look the best to everyone else. I cannot count how many relationships (including engagements and one marriage) he has had in the last few years, but they have all affected my daughter, and unfortunately he has never taken her feelings into consideration before taking major steps in his life. I do not want her to be affected by the swings in his life that he creates on a regular basis, and I do not want her to be further hurt by his regular absenses, which she would see more of, if he were to have custody of her

 

[LdiJ]

Thank you Ohiogal

I realize that the court's will probably give weight to my daughter's preference, but I would like to know how much of a weight? Her father is not a bad person, he just doesn't always make the smartest decisions, most of which are made by the process of thinking what will make him look the best to everyone else. I cannot count how many relationships (including engagements and one marriage) he has had in the last few years, but they have all affected my daughter, and unfortunately he has never taken her feelings into consideration before taking major steps in his life. I do not want her to be affected by the swings in his life that he creates on a regular basis, and I do not want her to be further hurt by his regular absenses, which she would see more of, if he were to have custody of her

Oregon is fun time...no school or schoolwork, spoiled by grandparents, can play all day with friends and family, etc.

Florida is responsibility time...school, schoolwork, no playing all day with friend and no spoiling by grandparents.

That is how she sees it, even if she doesn't realize that.

It should be pointed out to her, that the time she enjoys most in Oregon is the summer time, and that if she goes to live in Oregon she will be spending the summers in FL, with you, instead. So she won't have that fun summer time in OR.

 

[Ohiogal]

Thank you Ohiogal

I realize that the court's will probably give weight to my daughter's preference, but I would like to know how much of a weight? Her father is not a bad person, he just doesn't always make the smartest decisions, most of which are made by the process of thinking what will make him look the best to everyone else. I cannot count how many relationships (including engagements and one marriage) he has had in the last few years, but they have all affected my daughter, and unfortunately he has never taken her feelings into consideration before taking major steps in his life. I do not want her to be affected by the swings in his life that he creates on a regular basis, and I do not want her to be further hurt by his regular absenses, which she would see more of, if he were to have custody of her

The child's wishes will NOT control. They will be one of several factors that will be considered and weight will be given to her wishes based on her age and maturity level as well as her reasoning.

 

[stealth2]

I have tried many times to get my daughter involved in activities I know that she will like, and while she did make a couple of friends (most of whom later created a lot of drama for her), she has just about all out refused to participate in any of the activities that I have tried to get her involved in, just because she wants to move back to Oregon and does not want to like it here. Obviously, she is doing these things out of stubborness and trying to force me to let her move.

Or, ya know.... maybe she simply didn't like those activities, as much as you may have thought she would/should. It isn't obvious to me that she's doing things out of stubbornness to allow her to move. It seems more obvious that there are other things that interest her, which perhaps you're not aware of.

I *knew* my son would not only like baseball, he would be a superb catcher. Funny thing.... he wanted to be a pitcher. Then I *knew* my son would be an awesome wrestler - basically physical chess... strategy is such a huge component. Problem with both of those things I *knew* he'd like? He hasn't an athletic bone in his body.

Okay, I could handle that. I *knew* lots of things he'd really like. Problem being.... they were things I *thought* he *should* like. Once I embraced the quote in my sig line, things became much clearer. What *I* thought he
should/would like, weren't the things he thought he would or did like. And funny thing was? When I opened *my* mind to it, he bloomed and started taking the first steps towards what looks to be a brilliant future in music.

So no... she may not just be being stubborn to force you to let her move. Maybe she feels that you are constricting her to your dreams and hopes for her - and not allowing her to follow her own dreams. Maybe she feels she'll be more able to do that at her Dad's/Grandparents'. Might be something to think about.