appealing a red light traffic violation legal error?

[CdwJava]

So if the paperwork at the time of arraingment did have the new violation code written on it would the court have been obligated to let me know the were changing it at the time of the arraignment.

Do I go by the citation or the arraignment papers. I don't seem to have any arraignment papers besides this little receipt thing which doesn't say the violation code on it.

I suspect that there was some paper presented, signed, or filed at the time of the arraignment that contained the specific offense for which you were arraigned. If you received a courtesy notice, that may also have contained the 21453(a) section.

If you were arraigned on 21453(a) the attempt to amend at trial was moot and unnecessary. You might still be able to argue improper notice on appeal, but it might be worthwhile to get all the paperwork.

 

[potsnpea]

I found the paperwork they sent me in the mail telling me the date of my arraignment. It does have the correct violation code on there. So this means I can't fight the violation code error?

So I am kind of SOL.

I really feel like the court room was a sham. The light was clearly covered by a tree and the fact that there was a third light on the left hand side of the street is fine if you could see the two on the right.

The police officer said he was watching for people specifically who ran a red light at this intersection. He said he was watching the light and as soon as it turned red he would look the other direction to see if a car was running the red light.

I remember that day when I was getting the ticket a pedestrian walking by saying this was a speed trap. I am not sure what that is but there were a few police in that area that day.

I think there were sirens going off when I might have gone through the light causing me to miss the light as well while I was looking off to the left to see if any traffic was coming. I was going through the interesection as if I go through all intersections in the downtown area. You always have to watch the side traffic even if you do have the right away because I know plenty of people who have been broadsided.

The area I was driving was on a bend in the road and the lights were set up very odd because of the bend. Then with this tree in the way you have a hard time seeing the light. I see it now, but I can see how I could have missed it if my focus was diverted to the left.

I decided to appeal because I couldn't believe the way the judge and police officer were so cold and unreasonable.

Now I have no option for traffic court.

Well I guess I will live and learn the hard way. I can see how the system is set up now. It is sad that it is the raquet that it is. I understand some drivers certainly need to be put in check but I can rest assure I was not one of those.

I applaud you lawyers out there for learning the law. It is indeed very complicated. Somebody has to stick up for the people.

Thank you anyways for all your help.

 

[potsnpea]

deleted double post

 

[potsnpea]

The thing that counts is what it says on the citation (ie ticket) you received in the mail. That is what you were arraigned on, and that is what you entered your plea to. That cannot be changed at trial, no matter what other papers the court might have with a different number on.

The fact that that the words "red lt viol" were written on your citation after the code section does not give the judge the right to substitute some other code section with a similar description. This is a definite judge error that the appeal court is likely to reverse.

I would focus on this issue and ignore the other circumstance. The appellate court is not going to look at the facts and circumstances, that's not their job.

I suspect it will not matter if you use the audio recording or your own version. The mere fact of being arraigned on charge A and being convicted of charge B is enough. They don't need to know what happened in the trial, there is nothing that could justified the outcome. Your citation, and the court order you were given at the end of the trial are pretty much all you need to win.

I hope this works.

You don't think I should appeal on the fact that not enough evidence was submitted to prove the light was not obstructed from view?

 

[demurringdude]

You need to be precise about which document is which. You should have first received a thing called a citation or complaint or "ticket". That is what you are charged with. It will usually have a photograph of you making the right turn. If you got a second letter from the court simply confirming the arraignment date, then that is a "courtesy notice". It is not the citation. The documents they handed you on the way out of court are called "court orders". You need to be clear about which is which.

To win your case, you will need two documents: a citation that says you violated 21463(a); and a court order that says you were convicted of violating 21453(a). If you have both of those, you will win, if you don't have both of them you will lose. I can't make it any simpler for you than that.

It doesn't matter what it says on a courtesy notice from the court - that document has absolutely no legal standing whatsoever and the appeals court won't even see it.

The court has no jurisdiction to correct a faulty ticket, even if it is obviously faulty, and even if it is obvious what the officer should have written. If the police had wanted to make the correction, they would have had to have served the corrected ticket on you, so it's a good guess that it wasn't them. The fact that they wanted to amend it at the trial also suggests that the police did not believe they had already corrected it. Perhaps an eager court clerk did it. They did you an unintentional favor, it means you will get off.

The appeal court will not re-examine the findings of fact made by the trial judge. So the position of the light and trees etc is of no help to you. You will be completely wasting your time even bringing that up.

If you aren't completely sure about your documents, you can go to the court and ask to see your file, which they are obliged to show you. You can have copies made of anything in there. You may have to insist. You could also get a copy of the audio recording of your arraignment to hear what charge was read out in court.

Good luck!

 

[Zigner]

You need to be precise about which document is which. You should have first received a thing called a citation or complaint or "ticket". That is what you are charged with. It will usually have a photograph of you making the right turn.

DD - are you saying that an officer "usually" takes photos of people he stops for running red lights?

 

[demurringdude]

No, I was just saying right turn on red tickets "usually" have a photo. So I guess I missed the fact that this one was issued by a police officer. Effect on my advice - nil.

 

[CdwJava]

It still goes back to what the OP was ARRAIGNED on. If the arraignment was for 21453(a), then the issue of an amended 21463(a) later on could be moot.

 

[potsnpea]

My citation that the officer gave me says 21463aVC. Then the courts mailed me a notice in the mail stating that I was being charged with 21453aVC which is what the officer intended. The notice was letting me know when my arraignment was scheduled. I had no idea there was a discrempency in the code myself.

When I was arraigned I am sure they used the code number 21453aVC but I had no idea they had changed the code. They may have changed it to the right code but they didn't inform me that they had changed it or that it was originally written wrong on the ticket.

It wasn't until the trial began that I was even informed that there was this discrempency. I found out when the police officer testified that he just noticed that he had made the error and wanted to know if he could amend the mistake because he meant to put 21463aVC. The judge told him that he would change the violation code because it was a technical error and that it was alright to do so. He then made a comment that the code had already been changed on the court papers anyway.

This tells me that the court went ahead and took liberties to change the violation code on their own before the arraignment without the officer knowing.

 

[potsnpea]

It doesn't matter what it says on a courtesy notice from the court - that document has absolutely no legal standing whatsoever and the appeals court won't even see it.

The court has no jurisdiction to correct a faulty ticket, even if it is obviously faulty, and even if it is obvious what the officer should have written. If the police had wanted to make the correction, they would have had to have served the corrected ticket on you, so it's a good guess that it wasn't them. The fact that they wanted to amend it at the trial also suggests that the police did not believe they had already corrected it. Perhaps an eager court clerk did it. They did you an unintentional favor, it means you will get off.

This will be important because the police officer testified he just noticed the number was written wrong when he got to court that morning. He and the court never informed me of a change until the police officer pointed this out.

 

[CdwJava]

The notice you received in the mail indicating the 21453(a) will likely be sufficient notice to inform you that the arraignment was for 21453(a). You may find that this was actually read out in court, too.

If so, then I would think the amendment motion by the officer was moot as you had already been arranged on the proper charge.

But, I suppose it costs you little more than time to appeal and the worst that can happen is that they uphold the guilty verdict.

 

[potsnpea]

On my appeal paperwork there are spots in which I describe the error and then I have to describe how the error harmed me.

The first error I described like this


I was charged with a violation code that was written on my citation. The charge can not be changed after I entered my plea. The courts apparently changed the violation code on their own paperwork but they did not notify me that they were making this change or amendment until I was already in trial.

The way I describe how the error harmed me

I was not properly convicted of the right crime. I had no attorney present to advise me of my rights when the change was made. I had to suddenly defend myself of a different charge. Even though I did defend myself I was not fully prepared to do so.


The second error I described

The Judge allowed the police officer to make a motion to change the charge. The police officer is not an attorney and is not allowed to do any legal act in court. He is there only to give evidence.

The way this error harmed me is

This harmed me because I was having to defend myself against the police officer who was acting as an attorney as well as a witness. This was very intimidating and made it increasingly difficult for me to defend myself.


The third error I described

The court changed the violation code from what the police officer had originally wrote. The court has no jurisdiction to correct a faulty ticket, even if it is obviously faulty, and even if it is obvious what the officer should have written. The police officer should have served the corrected ticket on me. The police gave testimony it was not him that had corrected it for he just noticed it the morning of the trial.

The way I describe how this error hurt me

I should have been given proper notice that the code was being changed so I could properly fight my case. Without this proper notice I did not have all the facts I needed to properly defend myself nor did I have a chance to get legal advise on the matter before my trial. I was not notified that there was a change.




Should I even put the third error on the appeal.

I have the original citation and the paper that they sent me for the arraignment with the corrected violation code on it. I do not have the final conviction. I just have paper work from revenue recovery asking for my payments on the ticket. I do have a tape of the court proceedings. I also have an appeal form CR-142 ready with a low income statement so I can have a complete transcript made of the court proceedings. The court here requires that the oral tape be transcribed which would cost $100 or more dollars. I do qualify for low income and I can get the transcription for free. I have the FW-001 form filled out and ready to go.

My court date was February 5, 2010 so I have until Friday to get my paperwork all in before the 30 day deadline.

So I have the documentation of the first violation code on my original citation. I have documentation of the court changing it before my arraignment.
I have documentation of the judge admitting he didn't notify the court previous to the day of my trial.
I can get documentation of my guilty verdict with the new violation code.

I have the CR-142 filled out
I am currently filling the CR-143 out which requires that I list the legal errors and how they harmed me.

After I get the CR-143 filled out I believe I have to serve them on the police officer and file them with the court. I should get an additional 20 days to get the CR-143 paperwork out. Of course I want to get them in as quick as possible.

Since it may come up that the change was made at the arraignment should I put it down as an error so they are made aware that I know they don't have this type of jurisdiction to change such a code without going through proper channels. I know I will be expected to serve my papers properly. They should be held to the same standards. I also see how they try to gloss over things when they make mistakes and not so much when I make a mistake.

 

[potsnpea]

The notice you received in the mail indicating the 21453(a) will likely be sufficient notice to inform you that the arraignment was for 21453(a). You may find that this was actually read out in court, too.

Maybe it should have been sufficient CdwJava, but did they have the jurisdiction to do that? Can they go ahead and make a change without even checking in with the officer.

Maybe as DD said, the clerk that made the change without the officer's approval did me a favor, especially since I have testimony of the police officer saying he did not even know about the error until after the courts made the change.

Is this all just technical stuff as the judge said that can be easily corrected on a whim by the court or does the court have to be compliant no matter how small the technical error is?

I am thinking how I describe the error and how it harmed me will be significant. I am thinking if I write with conviction and purpose it will help.

This is why I'd love some feed back on how to write the appeal as I have asked in the previous post.

 

[CdwJava]

Maybe it should have been sufficient CdwJava, but did they have the jurisdiction to do that? Can they go ahead and make a change without even checking in with the officer.

I believe so, yes. They certainly do not HAVE to check with the officer, but since the citation is the charging instrument, usually they notice the citing officer to amend the citation. Whether it is legally valid if simply changed by the court, I do not know. I know that DAs change arrest or requested charges all the time, whether the court can do this on a traffic cite I do not know ... I would think they can, but I do not have any spot on authoreity on that.

Maybe as DD said, the clerk that made the change without the officer's approval did me a favor, especially since I have testimony of the police officer saying he did not even know about the error until after the courts made the change.

Of course, it might just as easily rendered the officer's motion irrelevant and could make THAT argument moot on its face.

Is this all just technical stuff as the judge said that can be easily corrected on a whim by the court or does the court have to be compliant no matter how small the technical error is?

The judge has to follow the law. Amending the citation on the fly at trial should not be allowed. However, if he was basing his decision on the fact that you had already been arraigned on the correct charge, the judge may not have made any error.

I am thinking how I describe the error and how it harmed me will be significant. I am thinking if I write with conviction and purpose it will help.

Maybe. I have no real experience with appeals. Others here do.

 

[I_Got_Banned]

On my appeal paperwork there are spots in which I describe the error and then I have to describe how the error harmed me.

The first error I described like this


I was charged with a violation code that was written on my citation. The charge can not be changed after I entered my plea. The courts apparently changed the violation code on their own paperwork but they did not notify me that they were making this change or amendment until I was already in trial.

I'm only commenting on the bolded part above.... Earlier, you stated that you found the letter you received from the court (I'm assuming that was the "courtesy notice") and that it had the correct code (21453(a)) on it. If that is the case, then the correction was made BEFORE you were arraigned not after -i.e. before you entered your plea-.