Where do I stand? Image issues, follow up.

[BustedBreaks]

What is the name of your state (only U.S. law)? MD

Okay this is a follow up to a previous post about the reproduction of an image:
https://forum.freeadvice.com/copyrights-trademarks-39/where-do-i-stand-image-issues-522078.html

I couldn't find the copyright owner of that image, so I went to WikiMediaCommons and found a bunch of public domain images of scientists to make this new banner:

http://img28.imageshack.us/img28/2922/scientistbannershirt.png

I was reading through the cafe press terms of service, and I was unsure of this clause, specifically #2:

If I took a photograph of a celebrity or a company logo can I use it to make merchandise?
Probably not, simply taking a photo of a person, company, brand, or logo does not afford you the right to sell merchandise featuring that photograph. There are two distinct intellectual property rights in a photograph: (1) the rights in the photograph itself and (2) the rights in the subject of the photograph, such as the product or person shown in it. For example, if you take a photograph of a Madonna, you only own the rights to the photograph, but not the right to use the photo to create and sell Madonna merchandise. In order to sell merchandise with the photograph, you will need to obtain explicit permission from the celebrity.

Am I covered because the images I used are in the public domain? I am not selling the image as Einstein, Galileo, etc merchandise, but as Scientifically Minded (my website) merchandise. Am I wrong to make that distinction?

Overall am I liable for selling shirts on CafePress with this image?

Thanks for your help!

PS I just read this on CafePress:

Can I publish a work if it is in the public domain?
Maybe, there are limited instances where you may use material which is in the public domain. For example, works that are created before 1922 are generally in the public domain unless otherwise noted. It is important to remember, that if a work which is in public domain, has been changed or altered from its original version, the new work may be protected by copyright.

This may answer my question, but can someone tell me how I can find out if my reproduction is protected?

 

[FlyingRon]

Please keep it all in the same thread.

The CAFE PRESS user agreement has nothing to do with whether you can be found infringing. As a matter of fact, CAFE PRESS will roll over and shutdown your stuff on their site as soon as someone asserting to be the copyright owner complains.

You are 100% liable for your infringement whether you're hawking these things on the street corner or through Cafe Press.

As I stated in your original thread, despite your protestations, I see nothing that indicates the image you want to use is public domain. FOUND ON THE INTERNET does not equate with public domain and the stylization of the figure looks quite modern to me.

And AS I stated before, short of finding some actual provenance that shows the picture was created sufficiently long ago to be in the public domain, or that has been so dedicated or was not eligible, you have to ASSUME it is protected and you will risk civil action by such infringement.

I'm sure there are verifiable public domain images of Galileo, but I guess you'd rather stick your head in the sand and steal a modern artist's rather than do any real work.

 

[justalayman]

This may answer my question, but can someone tell me how I can find out if my reproduction is protected?

find the artist and ask him/her.

 

[quincy]

BustedBreaks, I am afraid you have not only copyrights to deal with when using images, but also publicity, trademark and other related rights.

"Albert Einstein" and "Einstein," for instance, are registered trademarks held by The Hebrew University of Jerusalem, and you must obtain a license to use an Einstein image or use his name in a commercial manner. See http://einstein.biz/licenses and the Einstein official website for additional information. The Hebrew University vigorously protects their rights in the Einstein name and have brought several infringement suits against users of Einstein's name and image.

Whether you label your teeshirts "scientific" or not, the sale of your teeshirts is still a commercial venture. You must obtain a license to use any material that has intellectual property rights attached or obtain permission from the rights holder.

 

[BustedBreaks]

BustedBreaks, I am afraid you have not only copyrights to deal with when using images, but also publicity, trademark and other related rights.

"Albert Einstein" and "Einstein," for instance, are registered trademarks held by The Hebrew University of Jerusalem, and you must obtain a license to use an Einstein image or use his name in a commercial manner. See http://einstein.biz/licenses and the Einstein official website for additional information. The Hebrew University vigorously protects their rights in the Einstein name and have brought several infringement suits against users of Einstein's name and image.

Whether you label your teeshirts "scientific" or not, the sale of your teeshirts is still a commercial venture. You must obtain a license to use any material that has intellectual property rights attached or obtain permission from the rights holder.

Thank you, this answer was more helpful.

Just to respond to FlyinRon, the NEW images I used as a basis for the NEW banner I posted in this new thread are all in the public domain according to WikiMediaCommons. Please, I am trying not to infringe on anyone's copyrights. I genuinely want to follow all the rules and that is why I'm here. I don't see how you think I'm putting my head in the sand or that my questions are protestations.. I'm no artist and not terribly creative. I can't afford to hire someone to make me something so I'm just trying create something appealing that I can use for my website. Like I said I am trying to follow all the rules. I couldn't find the copyright information for the other image in my old thread so I created this new one and now I have other concerns which is why I'm back. I don't appreciate your implication that I'm trying to steal images. I'm just trying to do what is legal with images that are in the public domain. You haven't been very helpful.

Forgive me, but I just want to understand this completely. What am I allowed to do with public domain images of these figures? I can't use the images I linked to in this thread for commercial use because, although the pictures are in the public domain, like you said, there may be other rights attached.

I have advertisements on my website, so technically it may be considered commercial? Does this mean I can't use the banner in this thread on my website? If I took the advertisements off my website would I be able to use the banner?

I've used the banner in this thread in an intro to an educational video I made for YouTube, I'm under the impression that this falls under fair use. Is that right?

I am genuinely trying not to break any copyright, trademark etc laws and I appreciate anyone's advise to help me understand how not to.

Thanks again.

 

[quincy]

I think you are being extremely smart with your concern over the legalities involved with your website, BustedBreaks. Too often people will plunge ahead with plans without a thought to whose legal rights they may be trampling on - until they are sued, of course.

The safest material to use is always going to be material that you create entirely on your own. The next safest material to use would probably be rights-protected material where you have obtained express written permission from the rights-holder to use it (perhaps through a paid license).

These would be followed by material that is confirmed to be in the public domain and that has no lingering rights attached to it. Some old movies are in the public domain, but many of these films have been "recreated" - these versions of the films would NOT be in the public domain and cannot be used without permission. You must make sure with public domain material that you are using the original material and not a more modern re-creation.

Then, material that is protected by intellectual property rights can be used safely SOMETIMES without permission from the rights holder. This is called "fair use." This "fair use" of rights-protected material only applies to some very specific uses under very specific conditions (parody, news reporting, educational uses and research are often looked at as fair use). BUT, only a court can tell you for SURE if your use is a fair one or not (this after you are sued over your use), so the Copyright Office advises everyone to get permission. Permission avoids a lawsuit.

Researching what material you can safely use is not always an easy task, which is why some people would rather just take a risk and hope they won't "get caught." It can be an extremely expensive risk to take.

Wise people will do the research, or hire a "search" firm to do the research for them, or hire an IP attorney to review their plans prior to implementing them.

Good luck.

 

[The Occultist]

according to WikiMediaCommons

Do you know what the word "wiki" implies? It means that any random person on the internet contributed the information, and as such should not be trusted as a basis for any decisions you make that could put yourself into a liable situation.