17 year old needs records. Family won't release them.

[Mahmster]

What is the name of your state (only U.S. law)? Michigan

17 year old "unaccompanied youth" left her adopted home and moved in with me. They can do that in this state. She will be 18 in 4 months. I have talked with my Family Court judge's clerk who said I am her "caregiver" as it would not be feasible to pay for nor gain "legal guardian" status for the short time she has left until "adult" in my state.

My superintendent of the high school is going to admit her in the fall and I am her caregiver for that as well.

She has tried to contact her mother (as well as two other people here in town) and I have also called twice to try to get her records - birth certificate, shot records, social security card. Her mother refuses to return our calls. She is "withholding the records as punishment of her leaving home" - even though there is documented years of CPS being called there and of abuse in that home... just saying.

I know we can call the adoption agency that placed her in that home to try to get something from them (any records they may have) and can request her transcript from her old school be sent to this high school, but... BUT...

As far as I am concerned, those records are the DAUGHTER'S (not the mom's!) and the mom is just "safekeeper" of those records until her daughter wants and/or needs them - such as now - for medical (needs exam/physical), school, any job she wishes, etc. - and she should NOT, in my humble opinion, be allowed (?) to withhold them from her daughter. Can she?

In this day and age (after 9/11 terrorism, etc.), we can NOT just walk into the SS office and ask for a duplicate card without birth cert. and other documents... and she has no documents on her - she left home with just her purse. Her mom even took her debit card away from her before she left. Can anything be done to make her mom give her the documents or.. where to start helping her GET her identity established with no papers??? Thanks!!

 

[cyjeff]

Are you this child's guardian or lover?

If I were mom, I wouldn't give you anything either.

Please post the statute that allows a child to leave home at 17 to move in with someone else.

I believe the term you are looking for is "runaway".

 

[stealth2]

Legally, you can't do anything. You have no standing.

 

[justalayman]

Mahmster;2820235]n

17 year old "unaccompanied youth" left her adopted home and moved in with me. They can do that in this state. She will be 18 in 4 months.

You rally believe that? Please educate me and provide the statutes that allow that.

Now, since she is 17 you cannot get into trouble but everything I find states that a minor is under the control of their parent until they are 18.

I have talked with my Family Court judge's clerk who said I am her "caregiver" as it would not be feasible to pay for nor gain "legal guardian" status for the short time she has left until "adult" in my state.

You are legally nothing. Her parents are still liable for her until she is 18.

She has tried to contact her mother (as well as two other people here in town) and I have also called twice to try to get her records - birth certificate, shot records, social security card. Her mother refuses to return our calls. She is "withholding the records as punishment of her leaving home" - even though there is documented years of CPS being called there and of abuse in that home... just saying.

her parents are not required to give her anything as far as documents go whether she is an adult or a minor. If your minor friend wants documents, she needs to file for them with the appropriate state office.

I know we can call the adoption agency that placed her in that home to try to get something from them (any records they may have) and can request her transcript from her old school be sent to this high school, but... BUT...

but nothing. She is a minor and has not right or power to demand anything.

As far as I am concerned, those records are the DAUGHTER'S (not the mom's!) and the mom is just "safekeeper" of those records until her daughter wants and/or needs them - such as now - for medical (needs exam/physical), school, any job she wishes, etc. - and she should NOT, in my humble opinion, be allowed (?) to withhold them from her daughter. Can she?

No, those records are the parents. They were given to the parents. Your friend can file for a copy of whatever records she wants all by herself.

]

In this day and age (after 9/11 terrorism, etc.), we can NOT just walk into the SS office and

and when she is 18, she can file for a copy of ber birth certificate and SS card.

..

and she has no documents on her - she left home with just her purse

.so she ran away

Her mom even took her debit card away from her before she left.

well, her mother does have a right to the money in the account. In fact, until your friend is 18, the mother has a right to every penny your friend earns.

Can anything be done to make her mom give her the documents or..

No

where to start helping her GET her identity established with no papers??? Thanks!!

when she turns 18 she can start filing for copies of all the records. Until then, she waits.

 

[LdiJ]

You rally believe that? Please educate me and provide the statutes that allow that.

Now, since she is 17 you cannot get into trouble but everything I find states that a minor is under the control of their parent until they are 18.










You are legally nothing. Her parents are still liable for her until she is 18.



her parents are not required to give her anything as far as documents go whether she is an adult or a minor. If your minor friend wants documents, she needs to file for them with the appropriate state office.

but nothing. She is a minor and has not right or power to demand anything.

No, those records are the parents. They were given to the parents. Your friend can file for a copy of whatever records she wants all by herself.

]and when she is 18, she can file for a copy of ber birth certificate and SS card.

...so she ran away

well, her mother does have a right to the money in the account. In fact, until your friend is 18, the mother has a right to every penny your friend earns.

No

when she turns 18 she can start filing for copies of all the records. Until then, she waits.

I disagree with the bolded. Her parents can hold her money/earnings in trust until she is a legal adult, but they do not have the right to those earnings. The law on that was established decades ago...with some pretty famous cases.

 

[LdiJ]

You rally believe that? Please educate me and provide the statutes that allow that.

Now, since she is 17 you cannot get into trouble but everything I find states that a minor is under the control of their parent until they are 18.










You are legally nothing. Her parents are still liable for her until she is 18.



her parents are not required to give her anything as far as documents go whether she is an adult or a minor. If your minor friend wants documents, she needs to file for them with the appropriate state office.

but nothing. She is a minor and has not right or power to demand anything.

No, those records are the parents. They were given to the parents. Your friend can file for a copy of whatever records she wants all by herself.

]and when she is 18, she can file for a copy of ber birth certificate and SS card.

...so she ran away

well, her mother does have a right to the money in the account. In fact, until your friend is 18, the mother has a right to every penny your friend earns.

No

when she turns 18 she can start filing for copies of all the records. Until then, she waits.

I disagree with the bolded. Her parents can hold her money/earnings in trust until she is a legal adult, but they do not have the right to those earnings. The law on that was established decades ago...with some pretty famous cases.

 

[justalayman]

I disagree with the bolded. Her parents can hold her money/earnings in trust until she is a legal adult, but they do not have the right to those earnings. The law on that was established decades ago...with some pretty famous cases.

do you really need me to show you the law on that? A parent has the right to claim any money earned by a minor child as long as they do not fall under the Jackie Coogan laws.

and I believe it is the Jackie Coogan laws you are referring to. They only apply to certain situations and this isn't one of them.

Here you go.

722.2 Unemancipated minors; parental rights.
Sec. 2.

Unless otherwise ordered by a court order, the parents of an unemancipated minor are equally entitled to the custody, control, services and earnings of the minor, but if 1 parent provides, to the exclusion of the other parent, for the maintenance and support of the minor, that parent has the paramount right to control the services and earnings of the minor.


History: 1968, Act 293, Eff. Nov. 15, 1968
Popular Name: Emancipation of Minors Act

 

[CourtClerk]

Quite honestly, if this 17 year old wants to play grown up, move out and become independent, then this is the first step in that endeavor. Grown ups get their own paperwork.

 

[musicman654321]

So what? Go the hospital, contact SS, etc ... sounds like he thinks that the family even has the documents to give, maybe they dont.

 

[justalayman]

So what? Go the hospital, contact SS, etc ... sounds like he thinks that the family even has the documents to give, maybe they dont.

even if they do, the parents do not have to relinquish their copies of whatever documents OP's gf wants. Since OP's gf is not an adult, there is a great possibility she cannot get the documents from the issuing agencies until she is 18. She can always try though. The worst they can say is no.

 

[Mahmster]

even if they do, the parents do not have to relinquish their copies of whatever documents OP's gf wants. Since OP's gf is not an adult, there is a great possibility she cannot get the documents from the issuing agencies until she is 18. She can always try though. The worst they can say is no.

Grrr = I had a nice reply then my firefox froze and ate it!

I do want to thank each and every one who replied. I wrote just what I thought was bare minimum so as not to take up too much of your time but since some questions were asked, I will try to explain a tiny bit more.

I am NOT her lover, no. I am my son's mom - her fiance'. They have been engaged a month or so but thankfully I have managed to get them to realize they need to wait until he finishes his college and her high school/college.

I have not MET her family and this is honestly NOT the way I would want to have ANY kind of contact with/for them but when my son received a phone call from her at 2am recently telling him her mom told her to get out of the house, HE did not know what to do but to go get her for the night/time being. I ONLY told about the mom taking her debit card to show that she (mom) took all of her things - yes, even though, by law, she can "take all of her daughter's money" - she left her with nothing. My husband and I talked about what we COULD do - call the police, have her taken to a shelter, etc. - but we let her come here (in separate rooms!) as we TRY to work on helping HER get things worked out in her own life.

She is more than willing to fill out any paperwork but she knows even less than I do about where to even begin when she has NO paperwork to start with - no "identity". She HAS tried to call her mom several times - and yes, she DOES know her mom has all of the records she wants/needs as she has seen them many times in her mom's house.

The superintendent of our school is allowing her to enroll in our high school in the fall under the Mckinney-Vento act and, as I said, I am her caregiver for that. Document/form at http://www.michigan.gov/documents/mde/Caregiver_Authorization_Form_276676_7.doc if anyone wants/needs to see it. I did talk to him about her not necessarily being "homeless" as she DOES have adequate place to put her head at night but she does meet several of the requirements including the "unaccompanied youth" wording (again - please do not attack me for my lack of knowledge or "ignorance" in this - it's new to me - maybe not to you - but to me, yes).

I am NOT trying to "be her mom". Life just handed me this and said "deal with it" and so I am doing the best I can. I give her warm food, a good bed and a bath for her behind - and hugs. I am taking her places we need to go in town - as I said - the high school and ISD office - to get her the forms and things TO fill out so she can at LEAST establish herself here for the time being - AND I have also - on her behalf and with her permission TRIED to contact the mother as well to not only ask for her records but to TRY to talk to her (if at all!) on what, if anything, I can do to help in this situation. If her mom won't make contact with her then I do not know what else to do. (and yes, before you write me about this - she has a sister I DO talk to and have told her to have her mom call me - even collect if want/need - and have left a message on her mom's cell phone also). I am NOT calling them again - at all. I do NOT want it to seem like I am "bothering" them - but I will say this - as much as I would like to have them resolve their issues, the harder I have to "jump through hoops" to get her daughter the things she needs, the less likely I am going to want to be willing to help them later.

The girl is NOT a runaway, as was said. And I am, as I also said, only trying to give her "step one" of where/how to begin to establish her life. If I "have no right".... then I have some sort of obligation.... if only in my mind and morals. I/we care about her and want to help her when/how we can. Sorry if I did not include that before or if I need to add more later. I have my answer - she is not "entitled" to her OWN records that her mom has for her = that is her OWN "legal documents" - social security card, etc. I appreciate your time! Thank you! Be blessed.

 

[Mahmster]

Are you this child's guardian or lover?

If I were mom, I wouldn't give you anything either.

Please post the statute that allows a child to leave home at 17 to move in with someone else.

I believe the term you are looking for is "runaway".

I am not her lover. I did say the court clerk said it was not feasible for me to pay/go for legal guardian status in so far as she will be 18 in only 4 months and it would "not be worth the cost or time as she would be 18 by the time we went to court.

There are many instances (and websites) where 17 in the state of MI can leave home and the police do NOT list them as missing children, do NOT search one moment for them, do NOT make them return home, etc. I may have worded it wrong in saying it was legal - I do NOT think that is what I said in my first post! - but I am quite sure that, while the "age of majority" is 18 here, and that, probably, the "law" for 17 here was written so they could say that 17 was legal to prosecute as adult but as I said above - they do NOT make a 17 year old return home and they can leave for any old reason they desire... and parents here in MI have NO say - just the "legal" responsibility to pay for any damages they may cause! WAYYY stupid "law", yes. (ok - law is not right word but... wayyy stupid thing they allow to happen here - how's that?)

In THIS case, she did NOT "leave home" or "runaway" as you say - she is considered a term I do NOT like to use because it's a tasteless and demeaning term in my mind - "Throwaway" - like that is a good way to describe a kid? Not hardly. She was told by her mother not to come home... (kicked out?)

I did post a bit more as I tried to be as brief as I could on my first post but as questions - and comments - like yours - came up, I wanted to reply. Thank you so much for yours, btw!

 

[Mahmster]

Quite honestly, if this 17 year old wants to play grown up, move out and become independent, then this is the first step in that endeavor. Grown ups get their own paperwork.

Lol = I love your "location" post - I am sorry if I made you roll your eyes at my post. She is more than willing to "get her own paperwork" but if she does not know where to go for it (and I am just trying to help point her in the right direction)... and even *I* don't know what to tell her - I came running to you! Thanks for being there!

I do apologize to all where, in my first post I said she left home - I am not trying to leave things out - just not sure how much in depth or detail you all wanted/needed. She surely "planned on growing up, moving out, becoming independent" and all that good happy stuff but she is NOT doing it with the good send-off I was able to give to two of my children so far - with hugs, new set of dishes and sheets, any records they needed and moral support!

As I said, Life just handed me/she/us this and said, "Deal with it!" - don't you hate when Life does that?!? (grin)

 

[stealth2]

It would behoove you to remember that you have but one side of the story. It would be most interesting to hear Mom's side.

 

[Mahmster]

It would behoove you to remember that you have but one side of the story. It would be most interesting to hear Mom's side.

Absolutely agree, understood and I have no problem with that. I had even thought (before coming here and getting the answers I did) about sending a return-receipt letter (or certified?) not only asking for records but if there was anything we could do here.... as we were NOT getting calls returned to even begin to "hear mom's side", yes? If I can't MAKE contact, then what DO or CAN I know but "one side", yes again??

It's none of my business and I am trying to stay as far OUT of it as well as making myself available if they DO need me to be there for either of them at this time. (not sure if that made sense)...

I am through trying to call her. She has my number - she knows she can call and talk to her daughter, or even me if she is not ready/willing/able to talk to her daughter yet (at all? ever? don't know). I am just letting that part take care of itself - and trying my best to address the things I can see that are at hand here - she can't get a job and fill out the I-9 paperwork or anything else without the documents... but now, after talking here with you all, I know that we need to, as was told, start by talking to the state agencies about things (requirements and what she can do) and just leave Mom alone for these documents. She can call if and when she gets good and ready to and we will just keep on living life here as best we can. Thanks again all.