Possible Unlawful Entry Issues

[Datman07]

What is the name of your state (only U.S. law)? Virginia

I have posted on here previously regarding issues with a shady landlord and things seemed to calm down until an incident that happened yesterday.

Background - I live in a condo that sits above two stores. They (store owners) have been complaining about a leak that they thought may have been originating from my place. I have done everything I could to accomodate them in trying to find the nature of the leak. Including taking time off from my job to work with a plumber (running fossets, flushing toilets, etc.) and could find nothing to cause the leak.

We had not heard anything else regarding the leak until Monday when I recieved a text from the landlord that the store owners wanted a plumber to come back into the house and try again to find the leak. I replied that I would be home at 6pm that day if they were able to get someone out. I recieved no response after that. Then yesterday I took my daughter to breakfast and then the mall and came home to a mess in my house! Somebody had come into the house and pulled all of my personal property out of a storage space that sits under our staircase in our condo. I immediately called my girlfriend (who also lives with me) to find out if anyone had told her about anyone needing to come into the house for anything. She had not recieved any notice either until after I called. She recieved a text that one of the store owners had called a plumber out and had a key to let them in our place. Mind you, this was AFTER the damage had been done!

I have a couple of issues with what happened and consider this a major breach of the lease agreement as we had NO advanced notice of WHEN the plumber was coming as well as the fact that a random person (to us) has a key to our place and can access whenever they feel like. What really irritated me was that instead of giving us notice of when the Plumber would be there, they tried to enter our place at a time they didn't think anyone would be home. Fortunately I had taken the day off and caught them right in the middle of their "plan". Once the store owner realized that I was home, instead of knocing on the door to tell me face to face what was going on, they instead went to the trouble of typing out a note and taping it to my door, which leads me to believe further that they had every intent not to deal with me in person.

It turned out that the AC unit condensation drain had gotten clogged and condensation was leaking on to the floor, it was a simple fix and there was absolutely no need to try and keep us out of the loop.

At this point, we are considering breaking the remainder of the lease (6 months) as we do not feel safe in our home. The landlord did not disclose to us in the beginning that multiple people have access to our place and no one seems to notify us before they enter. There have been a couple of other times this has happened (that we know of) where the only way we knew was if a light was mistakenly left on, but this was the first time we noticed other people had been handling and moving our property.

I am planning to put a letter of notice together to send to everyone that we know of (at this point) who has a key to our house with instructions to notify myself or my girlfriend beforehand if they need access to our house otherwise we will consider any unplanned entry as unlawful and notify the police, as well as hold everyone liable for any damages.

Is this the correct method, or should be doing more?

 

[Gail in Georgia]

If you attempt to break the lease, the landlord/management will likely argue that the text you were provided with on Monday was notification that a repair was going to be done in the rental unit.

As a general rule, a 24 hour notice must be provided (this can be exempt if the repair is an emergency) and, from your posting, it appears that this was provided. It is nice if the repair person can work around when the tenant is home but this is not always possible.

The good news is that it sounds as if the problem has been addressed. Contact the landlord with your concerns and make sure you ask if the key has been returned.

Gail

 

[Datman07]

If you attempt to break the lease, the landlord/management will likely argue that the text you were provided with on Monday was notification that a repair was going to be done in the rental unit.

As a general rule, a 24 hour notice must be provided (this can be exempt if the repair is an emergency) and, from your posting, it appears that this was provided. It is nice if the repair person can work around when the tenant is home but this is not always possible.

Gail

The problem is that although he mentioned the calling of a plumber, no notice was given as to if the plumber was called and if/when they were coming. They just came and went.

I wasn't expecting anybody to work around my schedule, I would just like to know if somebody was coming or not...and 24 hr notice was NOT given. He did not tell us that somebody was coming into our house until after they had already been in the house. There was no known repair to be made at the time, it was only "suspected" that they cause was coming from our place, just as condo next door was "suspected" as well.

As for the key. I do not expect them to return the key as the landlord gave them keys (probably long before we ever moved in) but never disclosed to us that they had keys). We still do not know the number of keys that are out there and who all has access to our place.

 

[Gail in Georgia]

"We had not heard anything else regarding the leak until Monday when I received a text from the landlord that the store owners wanted a plumber to come back into the house and try again to find the leak. "

Your notice regarding a plumber coming to address the leak issue. Again, it is not unusual that a landlord/management cannot guarantee a repair person will be present at a certain time. At most, you MIGHT get a six to eight hour time frame when they will show up.

If you disagree with this and wish to break the lease and move, do so and perhaps face the possible financial repercussions of this decision.

Gail

 

[Datman07]

"We had not heard anything else regarding the leak until Monday when I received a text from the landlord that the store owners wanted a plumber to come back into the house and try again to find the leak. "

Your notice regarding a plumber coming to address the leak issue. Again, it is not unusual that a landlord/management cannot guarantee a repair person will be present at a certain time. At most, you MIGHT get a six to eight hour time frame when they will show up.

If you disagree with this and wish to break the lease and move, do so and perhaps face the possible financial repercussions of this decision.

Gail

I'm not quite sure if you are reading in whole what I am typing. Yes, the landlord did text that the store owners WANTED to have a plumber come up and look. But no one let us know as to IF A PLUMBER WAS EVEN CALLED. It was only a suspicion at the time that it was a possibility that somebody had brought a plumber into the house. WE HAD NO PRIOR KNOWLEDGE THAT ANYONE WAS COMING until after the fact. I was about to call the police when I first saw the condition of the house.

One other thing of note, when I say that I had not heard anything in awhile regarding the leak. I mean a month or two...until I recieved the text on Monday. As mentioned, that was only to the possibility of calling a plumber.

I also want to clear up another possible issue of confusion. Our condo is a personally owned house which sits on top of two store fronts. The owner is an individual and NOT a management company. He lives 30mins away and there is no reason others WHO ARE NOT ON THE LEASE or having anything to do with the house. If they were regular maintenance people, then I could see a justified need. But who is to say that these people wont back a truck up to the house one day and clean us out completely?? With so many people having access, there is almost NO ACCOUNTABILITY. Does that make sense??

 

[Searchertwin]

I'm not quite sure if you are reading in whole what I am typing. Yes, the landlord did text that the store owners WANTED to have a plumber come up and look. But no one let us know as to IF A PLUMBER WAS EVEN CALLED. It was only a suspicion at the time that it was a possibility that somebody had brought a plumber into the house.

We are reading it but are you? If someone WANTS someone to come and fix a problem, than more than likely they will come. Unless that repair job gets done on its own.

Do you really think that the LL is obligated to you to be in his business when it comes to arranging a repair to be done? I don't think so.
His only obligation to you is to let you know when one will be there. Unless it is an emergency.
And he did that by texting you that the store owners "WANTED" a plumber. Which in the store owners eyes, they were expecting one. They made a request.
The only person who is angry is you and you have no cause. You are making it a bad situation all away around. Sorry, that is the downfall of renting. People coming and going if repairs need to done, with or without you being there.

You make a lot of sense in your eyes.. But whose to say that these same people won't back a truck up to house one day without a key and just break in a window and door? There is no guarantee that that won't take place with or without keys.

You state, "He lives 30mins away (irrevalent) and there is no reason others WHO ARE NOT ON THE LEASE or having anything to do with the house."
If you look outside the box, you know this is just plain dumb. If a plumber is not on the lease, than you say he is not allowed. If a electrician is not on the lease, he is not allowed. If a roofer.....do I need to go on?

You stated, "The owner is an individual and NOT a management company."
And that effects you how?

 

[Datman07]

Do you really think that the LL is obligated to you to be in his business when it comes to arranging a repair to be done? I don't think so.

I beg to differ...I have a lease agreement with the landlord. The lease states that I have to recieve 24hrs notice if somebody needs to come in to make repairs. A text Monday night, and somebody in the house Tuesday morning is NOT 24hrs. I may be giving the wrong visual, or you might be making assumptions, either way. The "plumber", or whoever was in the house, did not repair ANYTHING. Whoever was there just went through everything in the storage space in the house...that's it! Somebody actually came LATER to make repairs.

His only obligation to you is to let you know when one will be there. Unless it is an emergency.

I'm not sure how many time I can say that THIS WAS NOT DONE UNTIL AFTER THE FACT.

And he did that by texting you that the store owners "WANTED" a plumber.

WANTING and CALLING are two different things. If one had been called, I should at least have known that one was coming. Wouldn't you agree??

"The only person who is angry is you and you have no cause."

I have a cause when somebody I dont know comes into my house unexpected and spreads my personal property everywhere. If somebody went into your house and did the same i am pretty sure you would be just as upset, especially NOT knowing what happened. I guarantee you would NOT just say, "oh well, guess it's my problem". If you claim you would, then you are lying! You should send me a copy of your keys so I can come to your house and go though your things!

"You are making it a bad situation all away around. Sorry, that is the downfall of renting. People coming and going if repairs need to done, with or without you being there."

Again, I think you all are making assumption seeing as how you do not know what I have been through with this landlord whether it be his non-disclosures, or trying to trick us into paying bills that we do not owe. If you have questions, ask, do not make assumptions.

"You state, "He lives 30mins away (irrevalent) and there is no reason others WHO ARE NOT ON THE LEASE or having anything to do with the house."
If you look outside the box, you know this is just plain dumb. If a plumber is not on the lease, than you say he is not allowed. If a electrician is not on the lease, he is not allowed. If a roofer.....do I need to go on? "

Again, you didn't read what I typed....If they are a maintenance person, then that is justifyable, however the neighbors should NOT have keys to my house WITHOUT ME KNOWING.

 

[Datman07]

To be honest, I dont even know if it was a plumber that was there. I'm only going by the text, because an actual repair guy did not come until long after I had came home.

 

[Datman07]

Not to be rude, but I can't help but get the feeling I'm not going to get much legitimate advice on here seeing how many times i've had to explain the same points time and time again and the same people keep countering the with same point that I had JUST explained in the previous posts. Like talking into a black hole. Should probably stop wasting my time and get some REAL advice...

 

[Gail in Georgia]

What, exactly, are you hoping to accomplish from all of this?

Gail

 

[FarmerJ]

Yes you have a right to request reasonable notice for entry for repairs BUT leaks and the damage they create can be construed as emergency entries by LL , I would suggest you simply invest in a nanny cam that is triggered by motion that sends vid to your computer and let it moniter the entrance to your unit, If someone comes in with out notice then YES you have proof to work with when confronting your LL about entry with lack of notice. Until then I suspect you will be on losing end if you break the lease .

 

[Searchertwin]

You didn't understand what I wrote. LL does not have to tell about his arrangements when he is making appointment for repairs. Repairs in this meant him calling around seeking someone to fix what he needs fixed. Sorry, if it didn't come across that way.

You stated, "I'm not sure how many time I can say that THIS WAS NOT DONE UNTIL AFTER THE FACT."

No, you knew they were coming. LL sent you a text. He did what he was suppose to do. It may not been how you like it, but the fact is, he did send a message and you received it.

On matter of someone coming and messing my house up. No, I would not be upset. It happens about once every four days. It is call "Grandchildren"
You have every right to be upset, but that what goes with renting. You will have to accept it.

You stated, "Again, you didn't read what I typed....If they are a maintenance person, then that is justifyable, however the neighbors should NOT have keys to my house WITHOUT ME KNOWING."

I did read what you typed. Maintenance person and repairmen hired to do a certain job are two different work groups. You did not say neighbors.

 

[Datman07]

So anyways...to clear things up, since there seems to be a LOT of assumptions being made on this...

We called the landlord yesterday and he (supposedly) did NOT know of what happened. As I previously mentioned several times he did NOT call anyone to the house until AFTER THE FACT. According to our landlord, the store owners mentioned to him that they were calling a plumber to investigate the leak on THEIR end and that was it. Since the store owners had a key they decided to come up and try to investigate the leak for themselves without notifying ANYONE (not even the landlord). It wasn't until they pulled all of my stuff out of my storage closet and saw some water on the floor that they called our landlord to have someone come out to fix it. This was the repair guy that showed up AFTER we were already home!

I'm sorry if you all made the assumption that the landlord himself called somebody out, that would have been justifyable. But instead of assuming that he had called them, wouldn't it have made more sense to ASK the question of "Did the landlord call a repair guy to come out?". The store owners were not even authorized to have a key. I found out that it had been left with them by their landlord who had requested it from my landlord a couple of months prior. The store owners figured since they had the key they could come in and try to investigate while we were not home. This is UNLAWFUL ENTRY.

 

[Datman07]

Also, to clear things up even further. As mentiond, I still am not certain that any repair people had been in the house (basically making an assumption myself from the landlord's initial text), so please do NOT make the assumption that the landlord gave the keys to a repair guy. Any repair guy that came out would have been called to the house ONLY. Somebody would have needed to give them access to the house. And apparently the store owners did all of this on their own without nofiying anyone, including our landlord.

 

[John_DFW]

I would send ll a letter crr requesting change of all locks at his expense, due to the fact that an unknown number of keys are in possession by unauthorized and possibly unknown persons. State observations and reiterate your communication indicating entry without notice, and the section of the lease requiring 24 hour notice.

Depending on your state laws, ll may be required to do so at his expense.