No will equals possible mess!

[tranquility]

When you write us in the future regarding what to do with sister, the answer is:

Sorry. There really isn't any recourse.

 

[softy515]

We really didn't have a choice. My brother said the only way he would agree to NOT being a representative is if BOTH me and sis were. You got to pick your battles.

 

[tranquility]

Do me a favor and, in a year or two when you start finalizing decisions, please post back and tell us if it worked for your particular dynamic or not.

Personally? I'd have fought the battle.

 

[softy515]

Another piece of the puzzle:

Just found my daughter is beneficiary of an IRA. It isn't a HUGE amount.

Will this have tax consequences for the estate or will that be all on her? We of course will present this to the attorney but don't meet with him again for a few days.

My daughter is young so she is most likely gonna cash it in. Yes, the tax will be huge. Sigh.

 

[anteater]

Will this have tax consequences for the estate or will that be all on her? We of course will present this to the attorney but don't meet with him again for a few days.

I don't recall you mentioning your father's age, but I assume that it was greater than 59-1/2. If so, then the IRA value will be subject to PA Inheritance Tax. (One of the other exceptions to the PA Inheritance Tax - the major one being life insurance proceeds - is retirement accounts where the deceased would have been subject to penalties for distributions.) You will have to look to the will to determine who has liability for the tax. Many wills state that any estate/inheritance tax is to be paid from the residuary probate estate (which might give your siblings heartburn). But that is not a sure thing.

I assume that the estimated value of the estate is still less than the $5 million exemption for federal estate tax purposes. But the value of the IRA would be included in determining that.

My daughter is young so she is most likely gonna cash it in. Yes, the tax will be huge. Sigh.

Try to talk her out of it. It is easy to take money out of a tax-deferred account. It's much harder to get money into a tax-deferred account.

 

[LdiJ]

Another piece of the puzzle:

Just found my daughter is beneficiary of an IRA. It isn't a HUGE amount.

Will this have tax consequences for the estate or will that be all on her? We of course will present this to the attorney but don't meet with him again for a few days.

My daughter is young so she is most likely gonna cash it in. Yes, the tax will be huge. Sigh.

The tax consequences will be on your daughter. That IRS is passing outside of the estate. If she rolls it over into an IRA of her own she can avoid the taxes consequences, at least in the short term. Make sure that your daughter understands that between tax and penality, she could be paying out nearly 50% of it in tax.

 

[anteater]

If she rolls it over into an IRA of her own she can avoid the taxes consequences, at least in the short term.

Just to clarify. It must remain an inherited/beneficiary IRA. She cannot make contributions to it. And she must take at least annual required minimum distributions (RMD's) based upon her life expectancy. And, unless it is a Roth or there were non-deductible contributions, those distributions will be subject to income tax.

...that between tax and penalty, she could be paying out nearly 50% of it in tax.

There is no early distribution penalty for inherited IRA distributions.

 

[softy515]

Gee things just keep getting more exciting.

The attorney bailed on us. Well, he didn't say for sure, he said "i have to do a little more research." But basically he didn't agree to take on the case because there are to many unfinished issues and not much money involved. He sort of wouldn't come right out and say anything though he did clarify he wouldn't bill us for what he has done.

However, he really didn't do anything outside of his own investigating. Well, he did get us appointed as admins for the estate but we didn't really need him to do that.

So my question is this: I know we have to put two ads in local papers to announce his passing so that anyone who has a debt can notify the estate. Will the local paper have a basic format for that? So that I can call them, give them the basic info and proceed from there? And how close together do the 2 local papers be? Should they be in the same city?

Thanks.

We do have another attorney in mind, someone who said he will just 'guide us'. That wasn't what I wanted but I have a feeling no attorney is going to take on this mess because there isn't no money in it for them.

 

[anteater]

Kind of odd. While I understood that it wasn't an exceedingly large estate, it still sounded like it was substantial. Business for attorneys must be good there.

The PA Code on advertisement:

§ 3162. Advertisement of grant of letters.
(a) Notice generally.--The personal representative,
immediately after the grant of letters, shall cause notice
thereof to be given in one newspaper of general circulation
published at or near the place where the decedent resided or, in
the case of a nonresident decedent, at or near the place where
the letters were granted, and in the legal periodical, if any,
designated by rule of court for the publication of legal
notices, once a week for three successive weeks, together with
his name and address; and in every such notice, he shall request
all persons having claims against the estate of the decedent to
make known the same to him or his attorney, and all persons
indebted to the decedent to make payment to him without delay.

I would think that the personnel at the paper could help. It is also probably something where the clerks at the Register of Wills office would give guidance.

Some counties in PA have pretty good websites, with a fair amount of information/forms concerning probate.

Keep in mind that some of the info at the link below might be might be specific to Philadelphia. But it is still good background material. It comes from the Probate and Trust Law Section of the Philly Bar Association.

http://www.peph.com/

 

[tranquility]

But basically he didn't agree to take on the case because there are to many unfinished issues and not much money involved.

The "unfinished issues", from everything I've seen in this thread, is the OP and family not trusting each other. ALL estates can be profitable for an attorney, no matter the size. It is probably the family dynamics, partly shown as the number of administrators, which caused the attorney to feel he can't make money if the estate paid per percentage rather than time.

Time to buy some books on self-probate. Nolo has a good one.

 

[softy515]

I can't get into many details about the oddities. Sorry. I doubt business is that good but the attorney stated he went by the property here and he doesn't think it would sell at an action for over $40,000. I think he is wrong. We know we won't get a high amount for it but the land alone is worth over that. The other properties are out of state so doesn't fall under his contract.

Speaking of the house here, the house he lived in before passing:

Could we, acting for the estate, rent it out, even for a 6 month lease? There is no way we can get things suitable for selling until next spring, maybe even summer. Trust me, the amount of 'stuff' is large. We were kicking around renting one floor of the home. The house is actually two dwellings, the basement had been converted into an apartment years ago. Seperate kitchen, bathroom, ect.

 

[softy515]

The "unfinished issues", from everything I've seen in this thread, is the OP and family not trusting each other. ALL estates can be profitable for an attorney, no matter the size. It is probably the family dynamics, partly shown as the number of administrators, which caused the attorney to feel he can't make money if the estate paid per percentage rather than time.

Time to buy some books on self-probate. Nolo has a good one.

No, we didn't go to the attorney with 'our' issues. We went in as a team. We didn't waste his time, we had things settled just fine before we met with him. He in no way discouraged the two of us as co-reps either.

 

[anteater]

Speaking of the house here, the house he lived in before passing:

Could we, acting for the estate, rent it out, even for a 6 month lease?

Sure. As a general statement, the personal representative has a duty to maximize the value of the estate. There is some common sense applied to that general principle. Most personal representatives don't sign up for the job of voluntarily becoming a temporary landlord (as opposed to having to become one because the estate contains pre-existing rentals). But, it is fine to do so.

Be sure to have a tax pro familiar with estate income tax returns lined up.

 

[tranquility]

Uh huh.

I can't get into many details about the oddities.

As I wrote:

The "unfinished issues", from everything I've seen in this thread, is the OP and family not trusting each other.

Because, there do not seem any ministerial legal issues which are hard listed in the thread. The only difficulty is what the heirs are going to fight about.

 

[softy515]

Apparently there are some weird legal things that the attorney just found out. It might be something, it might be nothing. But without knowing, I am not really going to discuss it here.

So I understand it appearing that the siblings are the problem but again, we didn't go into the attorney's office fighting. We worked it out before hand. Will things continue to run smooth? Probably not. But right now I just want to get this ball rolling.

Why we have considered renting part of the house is because to be frank, there isn't a lot of assets without selling things. I worry about keeping the out of state properties going as they entail monthly HOA fees, electric, gas, upkeep. Not to mention the possible legal crap there due to work the county required be complete and hasn't been. Those issues I haven't even touched.

Nothing is going to sell quickly. No way. Nothing in MD and surely not the house here. And in the meantime I see more bills.

We are trying to sell cars but there is a road block at every turn. I am about to scrap them all and be done with it but financially that would be stupid.

Folks..... all I can say is if you have an elderly parent who hoards..... be prepared for madness.