Now What?!?

[RemitAdvice]

What is the name of your state (only U.S. law)? VA

My current employer announced a few weeks ago that the company has been sold.

I have been offered a position with the new company. Great, right? Not so much...

Come to find out the shifts are different (nights and weekends). The insurance benefits are so outrageous that i'm looking at $675/mo. for three people (employee plus two). And I will take a cut in my hourly wage.

(I am also going to lose the over $2k I have in FSA for Dependent Care since we close on 10/25)

Taking the increase in insurance and the decrease in wage into account...I'm going to be bringing home almost $2.50 less an hour. Averages out to $100/week.

I realize this doesn't sound like much, but everybody out there knows that every penny counts. I, like many Americans, am already struggling. I'm a single income family of three with little, to no, child support (yes, this includes insurance or help with childcare).

I can't afford to work there, as crazy as it sounds. I have been looking diligently for another job to supplement OR another job to replace, but have been unsuccessful thus far. Even crazier is with UCI and medicaid (yes, my family would qualify. We would ALREADY qualify if my job didn't offer coverage...but lucky me) and the loss of the childcare expense (to the tune of 600/mo) I would actually be breaking even to what I make now. No loss!

My point is that I'm better off unemployed THAN employed by these folks. At least until I can find another job. Is it possible for me to turn down these folks' offer of employment and receive unemployment comp???

 

[eerelations]

Only if the UI people don't find out...except they will.

 

[swalsh411]

I highly doubt you are better off without any job and collecting unemployment. For one thing your cost for health insurance through COBRA would be substantially higher. Secondly, you wouldn't be getting any other company benefits. Thirdly, potential new employers often look more favorably on candidates who are already employed.

 

[LeeHarveyBlotto]

My point is that I'm better off unemployed THAN employed by these folks.

I find that really hard to believe, apples to apples.

 

[RemitAdvice]

That's understandable, I didn't either at first.

But, not working would reduce my OOP expense almost $700/month by removing the need for childcare.

Going on unemployment would push me WAY below the poverty guidelines and I would receive Medicaid for my children and preventative health for myself, FOR FREE. Therefore reducing my insurance costs (at an estimated $675/mo)

I would also receive SNAP for nutritional assistance and TANF for my electricity.

I would qualify for 66% of my base pay, according to the VEC website.

And I am tax exempt, having no tax liability ALREADY due to the fact that I barely break poverty level and I have two kids and pay crazy childcare rates and ridiculous premiums for insurance.

Please understand that I am not a 'beat. I am young, only 27, and I am DESPERATE to figure out what the right/best thing to do for my family is. I am alone, with no family of my own to rely upon for financial assistance. I am IT for my kids. I have worked hard to provide them with the little that I am able and I am about to have it taken from me through no fault of my own. I love my job, truly, and would have worked it forever, were it possible.

 

[RemitAdvice]

I'm afraid that I'm not making myself clear. On employment I will be bringing home the same as right now. Pittance that it is.

I'm being forced (?) to take a job where I'll actually be going in the hole. I'll either be unable to afford insurance, or my mortgage. REALLY.

 

[LillianX]

Are you eligible for childcare assistance? I'm sure you've looked into it, but for completion's sake, I'm asking. Others might find this thread and not have thought of it. Also, there are quite a few daycares out there that do sliding scale payments.

Where is dad? Why isn't he paying child support? Does he owe arrears?

 

[Beth3]

Ok - but how are you better off with no insurance AND no job. Unemployment is only going to be a fraction of your take home pay, assuming the State even grants UC benefits which appears unlikely. You'll be even further in the hole.

I understand your financial predicament but it still seems you're better off keeping this job until you can find another with less expensive health benefits.

 

[commentator]

I'd say your chances are even that you could do this, turn down the new job offer, and still be able to get approved to draw unemployment. As I've often said, the company cannot sell the employees as they do the office furniture. You are being officially terminated from your old employer. The company is closing down and being sold out to another. You will be officially laid off from the old company. You will have to be offered the new job, would have to be re-employed, it's not a transfer or anything like that.

After the closure on the 26th, if you have decided not to accept the new job, you'll file an unemployment claim based on the old company closing down, which is an automatic approval. Provided you have the monetary eligibility, which means wages in the last 18 months from covered employers, this part of filing your claim should not be a problem. While this is going on, you will be asked about the offer of work with the new company, and you will need to go into this issue with them.

Regarding the job you are being offered with the new company, you will have to report it to the unemployment system, and tell them that you do not find it an offer of equivalent work -- with all the information about the pay cuts, changes in benefits and changes in hours. (though the hours change may or may not be a consideration factor, in some states it would, some not)

The unemployment system does not force someone to worsen themselves by taking a job that pays significantly less or has no benefits, especially at the beginning of the claim, when there is some genuine potential for you to find another job that has a pay rate, hours and benefits more to your liking. But as I always warn people, even if you do not have to accept this other job being offered to you, and you are able to draw unemployment benefits, do remember, this is not a career path.

Unemployment will end abruptly, regardless of whether you have a need for it or have another job or not. They do not care how low your income is or what your personal situation is. There is only six months of state unemployment in any state. The federal extensions that are in place now may or may not be in place in a few months.

And the definition of equivalent job you'd be required to take goes down with each succeeding week of unemployment; in fact, in most states by the time you are ready to begin the extension that is now in place, you must be willing to accept even minimum wage jobs. And at the time you are ready to take anything, there may not be any jobs at all to go to.

It is NOT going to be a factor that you will be able to do so much better because of the lack of child care expenses if you were not working. That is never a factor in determining whether or not you should accept another job or whether it is an equivalent job offer. Or that you would qualify for medicaid or any other type of public assistance if unemployed and that would be better for you. Do not try to use this as an argument against taking the job. Because unemployment insurance is in NO way needs based. They do not give it to you because you are poor or needy or desperate. And it's not going to look good that you sound so eager to get on all the other programs, because as they will rush to assure you, you must be able, available and actively seeking work all the time while you are receiving unemployment insurance.

But to sum it up, yes there is a chance you can get approved for unemployment if you turn down this job. Not a guarantee, but a fair chance.
Make sure you want to do it, and if you do, then don't hesitate to fly into an intense job search for other work, you're in a desperate situation, even if approved,your benefits are very temporary, it will take several weeks, more like well over a month to get the claim set up, the decisions made and the benefits started, and they will be much less income than what you were making working, AND they will be temporary.

Good luck to you, it's a big decision.

 

[commentator]

Okay, I have just re-read your additional postings. The same money, exactly? Then divide what I said, you have a much less than good chance that you will be able to be approved for benefits, having refused this job.

Because as I already pointed out, they will NOT consider anything like the cost of your child care, the amount of your insurance payments, the convenience of arranging work hours and child care because you're a single parent.....etc. These are not something they consider when you go into whether or not the proffered job was an equivalent job. Wages are a huge factor. The hours and benefits are somewhat less weighty. So your chances of being approved for benefits, when the wage is exactly the same, and the nature of the job is exactly the same, just the benefits and hours are changing, are a lot less.

All this said, I'd really advise you to take the new job, too, like everyone else here is doing. But you probably won't. It's just not smart to set yourself on the public assistance path. Believe me, it's a very hard one to get off of once you're on it. And in many cases, if you've quit a job, or refused a job, that is factored into whether or not you receive TANF or medicaid or some of these needs based assistances. All the state programs, including unemployment do cross match, so they will find out.

 

[Zigner]

No, I'd say your chances are even that you could do this, turn down the new job offer, and still be able to get approved to draw unemployment. As I've often said, the company cannot sell the employees as they do the office furniture.

That may not be entirely true. If the company is a corporation and the corporation is being sold, then the employees would still be employed by the same entity with no break in employment.

I understand that the OP refers to a "new company", but that may very well be just the laymen's way of saying it...

 

[RemitAdvice]

Are you eligible for childcare assistance? I'm sure you've looked into it, but for completion's sake, I'm asking. Others might find this thread and not have thought of it. Also, there are quite a few daycares out there that do sliding scale payments.

Where is dad? Why isn't he paying child support? Does he owe arrears?

No I do not qualify for childcare assistance. My gross pay is too high. My childcare is regimented by the County i reside in and is through the public school system. It's as reasonable as I could find in the county.

Oh, they're there. One is unemployed and has been ordered to pay the Commonwealth minimum of $66/mo. The other has several other children and our daughter is low-man on the totem. Yes, there are arrears.

We all know not to depend of the Support. And I don't.

 

[RemitAdvice]

That may not be entirely true. If the company is a corporation and the corporation is being sold, then the employees would still be employed by the same entity with no break in employment.

I understand that the OP refers to a "new company", but that may very well be just the laymen's way of saying it...

I'm with it. My current Corporation is being dissolved, and the assets are being acquired. Better?

 

[RemitAdvice]

Okay, I have just re-read your additional postings. The same money, exactly? Then divide what I said, you have a much less than good chance that you will be able to be approved for benefits, having refused this job.

Because as I already pointed out, they will NOT consider anything like the cost of your child care, the amount of your insurance payments, the convenience of arranging work hours and child care because you're a single parent.....etc. These are not something they consider when you go into whether or not the proffered job was an equivalent job. Wages are a huge factor. The hours and benefits are somewhat less weighty. So your chances of being approved for benefits, when the wage is exactly the same, and the nature of the job is exactly the same, just the benefits and hours are changing, are a lot less.

Well. No, not exactly. It's complicated. I do asset recovery and risk management currently. So my pay scale is odd. I receive payroll for three different reasons. The new position i'm being offered steps me down to an hourly wage that (at full time/40 hours a week) DOES NOT EQUAL my yearly salary with the 'old' company.

But your responses are exactly what I wanted to know (without knowing, I guess, or I would have just come out and asked). I just don't know what to do. For years I have scrambled, intermittenly gone without insurance, had at times gone hungry, let my car insurance go and took PT to work, including walking and riding a bike. I have finally gotten to where that doesn't happen anymore! And now I feel like I'm powerless to stop it from happening again.

 

[commentator]

I spent many years working with people who were involved in job closings, shut downs, relocations... what you are going through is perfectly normal, you're scared and stressed. It's called "catastrophizing" which means that your mind has gone immediately to the worst possible case scenario here, and you're panicked. But take a few breaths. This may not turn out as you think at all. For one thing, there is a possibility that new new situation may turn out to be much better than the one you used to have. There may be huge opportunities for advancement and promotion for you now that were not there for you before.

You DO have a choice. I don't think turning down the new job sounds like a very good choice, but it IS a choice. You hate the change, it's insecurity, and you are completely on your own.

If the medical insurance isn't as good, is there any possibility your kids can get on medicaid while you are on your own for a while? If there's a better job out there, you can find it while working at this new job just as easily as you can find it while drawing unemployment. I think you'll find that you and your co workers are scaring each other, that there are tons of rumors, and lots of wild threats and stories out there in your workplace. But everyone's situation is different. Don't let others worry you, things have a way of working out.

But I will say that one of the worst things I have seen people do is gallop wildly off making snappy decisions, quitting the job they have because it's closing, rushing to accept something else, not giving the new company any chance.

Please do not assume you'll qualify for all those government programs, either. If you do not qualify for child care assistance, you won't quickly fall into the category of qualifying for energy assistance, food assistance, etc. True, they're all on the websites, but believe me, they may not take you until you have been out of work for quite a while, they may not have funding at the particular time you need them...none of those programs is nearly like the assurance of an offered job.

It's true, if you take this new job and it turns out to be horrible and you hate it, you won't be able to draw unemployment benefits if you quit it. But as I said, you still have the option to be trying to replace it. And it might become a better job, who knows?

One thing that is interesting to me, and that I have a question about to the real HR pros here, is that part about your having $2000 in the FSA and the company closing, and you will lose the money. Won't that still be available for use till the end of the year? Does she just lose it totally if the company closes? Isn't it administered by someone who has to continue it somehow?