New with basic questions

[Jackson4879]

What is the name of your state (only U.S. law)? Ohio

Hello to all. Been married almost 25 years with a son 19 in freshman college. Divorce before he was not an option as I wanted to raise my son in a sound home. My wife is a good person and I'm not looking to rip her off. We just are not compatiable day to day life or in the bedroom. Looking back she showed little physical interest when we were first married and zero the last 15 years. I can't imagine the rest of my life this way.

That said, here's some data. I'm 4 yr college educated, she is 2 year college. This year I'll gross about 175K in the private sector, she will gross about 45K in gov sector. Next year all going well I will be at 210K or so. All of her income she is free to do with as she wants.... yet she says she needs help with her bills at $300+ a month that I give her. She pays her car note of $500 a month. House has about 156K left on it with a value I would guess around 200-210K or so. Home is in both names. Home equity, about 5K is in my name and was used on the house. All her credit cards, how many I don't know, are in her name as are mine. I owe maybe 5k on my cards. My 401k is around 150K. I pay for my son's college at 22k a year via 529 I fund and out of my pocket.... no grants / no scolarships.

Is half down the middle pretty much the rule here? Debt and equity? Are bills in her name ie credit cards completely her responsibility? I bailed her out 15 years ago to the tune of 10K-12K or so and I thought that problem was solved...apparently not.

What are each of our rights to live in the home till we get through this? Im not looking to throw her out but she might me via some trumped up domestic assult charge. If I leave on my own to an appartment am I basically giving her a payday? What kind of alimony am I looking at?

Some typical and worst case scenarios would be appreciated. Also some tips on how to protect myself. Like I said, just looking for a fair deal (that may be a a stupid thought) and to get on with my life, either alone or with a nice bird dog.

Jackson

 

[LdiJ]

What is the name of your state (only U.S. law)? Ohio

Hello to all. Been married almost 25 years with a son 19 in freshman college. Divorce before he was not an option as I wanted to raise my son in a sound home. My wife is a good person and I'm not looking to rip her off. We just are not compatiable day to day life or in the bedroom. Looking back she showed little physical interest when we were first married and zero the last 15 years. I can't imagine the rest of my life this way.

That said, here's some data. I'm 4 yr college educated, she is 2 year college. This year I'll gross about 175K in the private sector, she will gross about 45K in gov sector. Next year all going well I will be at 210K or so. All of her income she is free to do with as she wants.... yet she says she needs help with her bills at $300+ a month that I give her. She pays her car note of $500 a month. House has about 156K left on it with a value I would guess around 200-210K or so. Home is in both names. Home equity, about 5K is in my name and was used on the house. All her credit cards, how many I don't know, are in her name as are mine. I owe maybe 5k on my cards. My 401k is around 150K. I pay for my son's college at 22k a year via 529 I fund and out of my pocket.... no grants / no scolarships.

Is half down the middle pretty much the rule here? Debt and equity? Are bills in her name ie credit cards completely her responsibility? I bailed her out 15 years ago to the tune of 10K-12K or so and I thought that problem was solved...apparently not.

What are each of our rights to live in the home till we get through this? Im not looking to throw her out but she might me via some trumped up domestic assult charge. If I leave on my own to an appartment am I basically giving her a payday? What kind of alimony am I looking at?

Some typical and worst case scenarios would be appreciated. Also some tips on how to protect myself. Like I said, just looking for a fair deal (that may be a a stupid thought) and to get on with my life, either alone or with a nice bird dog.

Jackson

Since you have a long term marriage and a very significant disparity in income, you might be looking at having to pay alimony.

All of the debts that accrued during the marriage are marital debts. Martial debts will be divided between the two of you. You both have the right to remain in the home unless or until the judge orders that one of you have exclusive use of the marital home while the divorce is pending. However no, if you move to an apartement you would not be given her a payday.

 

[Radia]

Ohio calls alimony spousal support, and no one is going to be able to give you a good answer on how much... Ohio, last I looked, has no spelled out method for determining amount of spousal support.

With a 25 yr marriage you are probably looking at permanent spousal support, but with a really good lawyer you might get out of that.

If you dont have a lawyer, get one NOW.

 

[Ohiogal]

Ohio calls alimony spousal support, and no one is going to be able to give you a good answer on how much... Ohio, last I looked, has no spelled out method for determining amount of spousal support.

With a 25 yr marriage you are probably looking at permanent spousal support, but with a really good lawyer you might get out of that.

If you dont have a lawyer, get one NOW.

Not permanent spousal support. Normally 1/3 to 1/2 the length of the marriage. Most counties throw all the income into a pile and divide in half. Next year that would be 255k according to him. She would be entitled to 127.5k a year. Which means several thousand a month in spousal support from him to her. Apparently there are no minor children so no child support.

College expenses don't come into play. Wife is entitled to half the equity in the house as well as half the 401k and half the marital debt.

 

[xylene]

Is your wife filing for divorce or are you?

My wife is a good person and I'm not looking to rip her off.

orly? (and would that be bad?)

You should consult with a therapist for you own sake to help you through this time.

Your post is riddled with cognitive dissonance and the decades of resentment is streaming off it as well.

To that end, you want her to be your ex-wife. Therefore you owe her only what the court will decide and there is no reason why you should not desire that come out as favorably, for you, as possible. You do not have to be apologetic and being that way in your thinking is a mental trap at a time when you need all of your personal power as you will be tested.

You make far and away enough money to be introspective about your mental patterning to realize you have substantial de-patterning work to do.

Good luck.

 

[mistoffolees]

Not permanent spousal support. Normally 1/3 to 1/2 the length of the marriage. Most counties throw all the income into a pile and divide in half. Next year that would be 255k according to him. She would be entitled to 127.5k a year. Which means several thousand a month in spousal support from him to her. Apparently there are no minor children so no child support.

College expenses don't come into play. Wife is entitled to half the equity in the house as well as half the 401k and half the marital debt.

OP, keep in mind that you are entitled to 1/2 of the value of her retirement, too. Since she's working for the government, it's more likely to be a traditional pension rather than a 401K (or whatever the government equivalent is). Putting a value on that will be tough, but make sure you're considering ALL assets.

 

[Nevergrowup]

It always makes me extra sad to see long term marriages disolve. OP, have you tried marriage counseling? Does your wife KNOW that you feel this way?

 

[Jackson4879]

Do I resent the treatment over the years you bet. But the fact is I felt I owed my son a stable home with two parents despite our issues. I passed the time woodworking and remodelling two homes myself. We tried the therapy thing once as I think I said. Bottom line; looking back it was a disaster and today; I just don't lover her anymore nor can I rekindle the fire.

On the alimony topic would payments I make for her car (in my name only) car, insurance and other items be part of that? What about if I took all her credit debt? I can't see paying her 125K a year for 12 years + 1/2 my 401K as someone suggested. What is the down side of filing for seperation and never doing a divorce? What is her recourse then? She has no $ for lawyers.

 

[Just Blue]

Do I resent the treatment over the years you bet. But the fact is I felt I owed my son a stable home with two parents despite our issues. I passed the time woodworking and remodelling two homes myself. We tried the therapy thing once as I think I said. Bottom line; looking back it was a disaster and today; I just don't lover her anymore nor can I rekindle the fire.

On the alimony topic would payments I make for her car (in my name only) car, insurance and other items be part of that? What about if I took all her credit debt? I can't see paying her 125K a year for 12 years + 1/2 my 401K as someone suggested. What is the down side of filing for seperation and never doing a divorce? What is her recourse then? She has no $ for lawyers.

OhioGal is a Ohio Attorney. Please listen to her advice.

 

[xylene]

Do I resent the treatment over the years you bet. But the fact is I felt I owed my son a stable home with two parents despite our issues. I passed the time woodworking and remodelling two homes myself. We tried the therapy thing once as I think I said. Bottom line; looking back it was a disaster and today; I just don't lover her anymore nor can I rekindle the fire.

On the alimony topic would payments I make for her car (in my name only) car, insurance and other items be part of that? What about if I took all her credit debt? I can't see paying her 125K a year for 12 years + 1/2 my 401K as someone suggested. What is the down side of filing for seperation and never doing a divorce? What is her recourse then? She has no $ for lawyers.

You are a relatively wealthy man.

You need to talk to a lawyer about your best options.

Ohiogal is an expert family law attorney and she was not advising you on what to offer your wife, she was informing you of likely court outcomes regarding support guidelines and how marital assets are divided under the laws of your state.

 

[mistoffolees]

On the alimony topic would payments I make for her car (in my name only) car, insurance and other items be part of that? What about if I took all her credit debt?

Certainly payments made on her behalf can be considered in alimony. If you're ordered to pay $2 K per month, there's no reason that can't be $400 car payment plus $100 insurance plus $1500 cash per month. Just make sure that whatever you do is spelled out in the order - anything you work out between yourselves is not binding and you could end up double paying.

I can't see paying her 125K a year for 12 years + 1/2 my 401K as someone suggested.

That's not what OG said. She said that stbx would take home $125 K per year. She's earning $45 K, so your alimony would be $80 K.

I'm not going to second guess OG on that, but would ask you to talk with your attorney about several things:

- Alimony will typically be based on earnings history, not prospective future earnings, so the figure you use should be $175 K, not $210 K if you file soon. That would reduce the alimony to $65 K using OG's figures.
- Judges do have discretion in setting alimony. OG's figures are a good guideline and might cover the majority of judges, but there will be exceptions. Your attorney will know your particular judge's habits and biases, so it's far better to ask your own attorney than to rely on generic advice.
- Regardless of how you do it (paying her cash or making payments on her behalf), make sure your attorney insists on wording that allows you to deduct your alimony payment on taxes. In your tax bracket, that will make a big difference in the out-of-pocket cost.

What is the down side of filing for seperation and never doing a divorce? What is her recourse then? She has no $ for lawyers.

If you file for legal separation, the same things could apply. It really doesn't gain you much - except that you're still married.

Besides, I thought you weren't looking to rip her off? Oh, that was before you found out that alimony would be expensive.