Who owns the house?

[vscheer]

What is the name of your state (only U.S. law)? Pennsylvania

Grandfather dies and leaves house to 2 sons. One of the sons legally (deed changed) gives his half of the house to his mother and the other son keeps his 1/2 interest in the house.

1 year ago, Grandmother dies. Does the son with his name still on the deed own the house? The son that gave up his 1/2 wants to sell the house and wants 1/2? I don't think the son whoes name is on the deed has to sell the house. Am I right?

 

[Zigner]

What is the name of your state (only U.S. law)? Pennsylvania

Grandfather dies and leaves house to 2 sons. One of the sons legally (deed changed) gives his half of the house to his mother and the other son keeps his 1/2 interest in the house.

1 year ago, Grandmother dies. Does the son with his name still on the deed own the house? The son that gave up his 1/2 wants to sell the house and wants 1/2? I don't think the son whoes name is on the deed has to sell the house. Am I right?

Assuming there is no will, etc., then it would seem to me that the son who is on the deed will end up owning 3/4 of the house and the son who isn't on the deed will end up owning 1/4 of the house. This is a rough guess based on the basic info you provided and doesn't factor in debts of the estate, etc.

 

[Mass_Shyster]

What is the name of your state (only U.S. law)? Pennsylvania

Grandfather dies and leaves house to 2 sons.

As of this time, son one and son two own the house.

One of the sons legally (deed changed) gives his half of the house to his mother and the other son keeps his 1/2 interest in the house.

As of this time, son two and mother own the house as tenents in common. (If the two sons owned as joint tenants with right of suvivorship, that joint tenancy was destroyed when son one conveyed his interest)

1 year ago, Grandmother dies. Does the son with his name still on the deed own the house?

Grandmother owned no interest in the house. House is owned by Mother and Son Two.

The son that gave up his 1/2 wants to sell the house and wants 1/2? I don't think the son whoes name is on the deed has to sell the house. Am I right?

The son that gave up half (Son One) owns nothing. He gave his interest to his mother.

 

[Zigner]

Grandmother owned no interest in the house. House is owned by Mother and Son Two.

I suspect that "Mother" and "Grandmother" are the same person. If this is the grandchild posting, then when referring to the "Mother" of the "Sons", OP would be referring to his/her "Grandmother" - I could be wrong though

 

[vscheer]

Yes, Grandmother is the same person as Mother to the two sons.
Sorry.

 

[Ohiogal]

How was the deed written? Joint tenants with right of survivorship? It could be that the son on the deed owns the WHOLE house. How the deed is worded MATTERS!

 

[Zigner]

How was the deed written? Joint tenants with right of survivorship? It could be that the son on the deed owns the WHOLE house. How the deed is worded MATTERS!

What you say is correct...

However, since 1/2 of the ownership interest was transferred, I would lean towards the deed not being JTWROS.

(The original post is somewhat lacking in detail)

 

[Ohiogal]

What you say is correct...

However, since 1/2 of the ownership interest was transferred, I would lean towards the deed not being JTWROS.

(The original post is somewhat lacking in detail)

It still matters however. And without that information we cannot give good advice. It could be that it was not 1/2 the ownership interest but grandpa just transferred HIS interest to his sons and then son transferred HIS interest to his mother. tenants in common? Tenants in entirety? JTWROS? What was it?

 

[vscheer]

It reads : The grantor (Son 1) does hereby release and quitclaim to Grantee (Son 1 and Son 2's mother), her successors and assigns, all of Grantor's right, title and interst in and to the property located in **************..Said conveyance being made AS IS an without any representations as to title,liens,or other encumbrances on the described property.
AND the said grantor convenants, promises and agrees, to and with the Grantee, her heirs and assigns by these presents that the said Grantor has not done, commetted or knowingly, or willingly suffered to be done or committed, any act, matter dor thing whatsoever wheeby the premises herby granted, or any part thereof, is, are, shall or may be impeached, charged or encombered , in title, charge, estate, or otherwide howsoever.

Does this help?

 

[Ohiogal]

It reads : The grantor (Son 1) does hereby release and quitclaim to Grantee (Son 1 and Son 2's mother), her successors and assigns, all of Grantor's right, title and interst in and to the property located in **************..Said conveyance being made AS IS an without any representations as to title,liens,or other encumbrances on the described property.
AND the said grantor convenants, promises and agrees, to and with the Grantee, her heirs and assigns by these presents that the said Grantor has not done, commetted or knowingly, or willingly suffered to be done or committed, any act, matter dor thing whatsoever wheeby the premises herby granted, or any part thereof, is, are, shall or may be impeached, charged or encombered , in title, charge, estate, or otherwide howsoever.

Does this help?

nope. what interest was granted to son 1?I could quitclaim my interest in said property to Son 2 and Mother and they would be entitled to my interest (which is NONE) but it would still be a legal quitclaim. And it would be a deed that could be filed. What would it mean? Absolutely nothing.

 

[vscheer]

More info: This indenture made the ___day of ______ between, Son #1 as to an undivded one half (1/2) interest and His wife (collectively the Grantor)

AND

S_________(Mother of son 1&2), an individeual (the "grantee")

Where as , the read property being conveyed was originally conveyed to Son #1 as an undivided on half (1/2) interest and to Son #2, as to an undivided one-half (1/2) interest and

Whereas Son 1 desires to reconvey his undivided on half (1/2) interest in the propery described herein to _______(Mother of Sone 1 & 2) and ____________(son 1's wife) hereby joins in this conveyance.

Does son #1 still have 1/2 interest in the house?

 

[Zigner]

How does the TITLE read?

 

[vscheer]

I'm sorry I don't have the Title information. I the information I put in here from the Deed Search. I will have to do some more research and get back to you. I will be making appointment with my Estate Attorney. I don't know alot about Deeds, Titles, ect... I'm sure my attorney can find that info for me. Thanks for all the info everyone has given. I know its a sticky situation but I need to get this settled.

 

[latigo]

I'm sorry I don't have the Title information. I the information I put in here from the Deed Search. I will have to do some more research and get back to you. I will be making appointment with my Estate Attorney. I don't know alot about Deeds, Titles, ect... I'm sure my attorney can find that info for me. Thanks for all the info everyone has given. I know its a sticky situation but I need to get this settled.

For your pocket book’s sake, hopefully it won’t take the same number of visits to the lawyer’s office as it took you in here to trickle bits and pieces of information. It’s like giving birth.

From which we still do not know whether “grandfather/father’s“ interest in the home was marital or non-marital - or what connection, if any he had with ”grandmother/mother” (married, divorced, girlfriend) - nor whether at the time of her death “grandmother/mother” held a vested interest in the home and if so, whether or not she died testate or intestate, what was included in her estate and if distributed, then to whom and how.

As matter of fact you haven't made it distinctly clear as to whom survived whom; “grandfather/father” or ”grandmother/mother”.

And certainly not a smell of a clue of whether these “grandfather’s sons” are your uncles, siblings, one your father, or how this “sticky situation” has any legal consequences effecting you!

So what is it you need to get settled and why and how are you a real party in interest in whatever it is that needs to be settled?

You can go on with your deed searching until the cows come home, but it won't supply all of the missing pieces of the puzzle.

Let your "estate (?)attorney" sort it out. Blindly scratching away in here may be cheaper, but it won't get it done.

 

[justalayman]

this is all presuming there are only the 2 brothers that were both children of g-ma AND g-pa and there are no other children of either g-ma or g-pa. That g-ma and g-pa were married at the time of g-pa's death and g-ma did not remarry. There is no lien on the property that needs to be dealt with. G-ma had no will. the house was held separately by g-pa (g-ma having no titled interest)

Grandfather dies and leaves house to 2 sons. One of the sons legally (deed changed) gives his half of the house to his mother and the other son keeps his 1/2 interest in the house.

the first thing you have to find out is how g-ma and g-pa held title. Was it only in g-pa's name at the time of his death? If not, g-pa could not give 100% of the house to anybody because he didn't own 100% of the house.


Now, since he "gave" the property to his sons, that means there was a will. Even with a will, a widow has a right to an elective share of the decedents estate (1/3) so, one needs to know if g-ma expressly consented to allow g-pa to give the home, in its entirety, to the sons. If she did and presuming g-pa owned 100% of the home, that would mean each son now owns 50%.


now, son 1 gave g-ma back his share. son 2 and g-ma own equal shares. When g-ma dies, barring a will stating otherwise and presuming the property is not required to be dealt with in some other way, her share (1/2 of the whole) would be equally split between her sons (each receiving 1/4 of the whole). That means son 1 now owns 1/4 and son 2 owns 3/4 of the whole.


now, to go further, we need to know where in the administration of g-ma's estate this is. Regardless of that, son 2 does still own his prior 1/2 interest so whatever happens, unless he agrees to sell his 1/2, it isn't getting sold. As to the remaining 1/2, if probate is still open, it can be sold (if you can find a buyer for 1/2 of a house shared with a stranger) or simply transferred to the heirs. That results in the 1/4-3/4 interest division.



what they decide to do at that point is up to them. They would both have possessory rights and they would both be liable for their share (1/4 to one, 3/4 to the other) of taxes and maintenance.

if son1 wants to sell, he would have to sue to partition the property (which usually gets real ugly with the owners of the property getting a bad deal but at least there is closure)

there are myriad other possibilities if any of the basic facts vary.