Trouble with landlord not fulfilling original promises

[s10sleeper]

What is the name of your state (only U.S. law)? KS

Back in November, I moved into a house after having some issues with the previous landlord. Due to having to do all of the work of cleaning the other house and all of the moving my father, who lives with me as I take care of him, found a different house in a different town. When I saw it, I found out that it was a work in progress, or so I thought. It was originally a 1 bedroom home, however they decided to do an add on of 3 more bedrooms, which more than doubled the size of the house. When I was there to discuss the lease, they seemed to be working on it, as at the time it only had sheathing on the side but the siding was setting out on sawhorses and he had tools with him. Of the 2 back doors, only one had stairs, which were poorly thrown together, which he said "were only temporary" he said this about all of it. Along with this, it turned out they did not finish the HVAC ducts to the add on as they did not think about the fact that the furnace was too small. Instead he brought us space heaters. When I read the lease, I did not agree with it as it was bluntly stating that I was waiving all liabilities, so I asked that we redo the agreement, he never showed to do that so we have been on a month to month rental agreement according to the KS landlord tenant act.

It is now April and nothing has been completed, the wiring hanging out of the house I found out is hot and has no caps on it, the panel was never bonded, too large of breakers for the gauge of wire used, the sheathing is run all the way to finish grade and is now rotting, the eaves were never closed up so insulation has been blown out, my bedroom has been so drafty that at times the warmest it was was 55 degrees.

I also know that they are at least 2 months behind on the mortgage as we get notices posted each month. I am looking for a different place, but due to the extremely high electric bill, cost of cleaners, and pest control, have not been able to save the money. Every promise made by the Landlord were done in front of about 7 people, but I am worried about losing a house, or somewhat of one, to live in. I am wondering if in this situation if a landlord could be required to reimburse rent as I am preparing to send a certified letter to him.

 

[sandyclaus]

What is the name of your state (only U.S. law)? KS

Back in November, I moved into a house after having some issues with the previous landlord. Due to having to do all of the work of cleaning the other house and all of the moving my father, who lives with me as I take care of him, found a different house in a different town. When I saw it, I found out that it was a work in progress, or so I thought. It was originally a 1 bedroom home, however they decided to do an add on of 3 more bedrooms, which more than doubled the size of the house. When I was there to discuss the lease, they seemed to be working on it, as at the time it only had sheathing on the side but the siding was setting out on sawhorses and he had tools with him. Of the 2 back doors, only one had stairs, which were poorly thrown together, which he said "were only temporary" he said this about all of it. Along with this, it turned out they did not finish the HVAC ducts to the add on as they did not think about the fact that the furnace was too small. Instead he brought us space heaters. When I read the lease, I did not agree with it as it was bluntly stating that I was waiving all liabilities, so I asked that we redo the agreement, he never showed to do that so we have been on a month to month rental agreement according to the KS landlord tenant act.

It is now April and nothing has been completed, the wiring hanging out of the house I found out is hot and has no caps on it, the panel was never bonded, too large of breakers for the gauge of wire used, the sheathing is run all the way to finish grade and is now rotting, the eaves were never closed up so insulation has been blown out, my bedroom has been so drafty that at times the warmest it was was 55 degrees.

I also know that they are at least 2 months behind on the mortgage as we get notices posted each month. I am looking for a different place, but due to the extremely high electric bill, cost of cleaners, and pest control, have not been able to save the money. Every promise made by the Landlord were done in front of about 7 people, but I am worried about losing a house, or somewhat of one, to live in. I am wondering if in this situation if a landlord could be required to reimburse rent as I am preparing to send a certified letter to him.

Please clarify - did you or did you not sign a lease for the property?

If you signed it, then you agreed to the terms, whether or not you read them through before signing. If you DIDN'T sign it, then you would be correct in that you would be considered a month-to-month tenant.

Understand that verbal promises are unenforceable for the most part, because unless it's in writing, it can be extremely difficult to prove. That's why it's EXTREMELY IMPORTANT to get all promises that a LL makes IN WRITING. That way, you have something to back you up, especially in a situation such as what you are describing.

Last, but certainly not least, why would the LL even be willing or required to reimburse you for any rent? You continued to live there for 5 months, despite all of the serious issues you keep having. It obviously wasn't bad enough for you to give your 30-day notice and move out. You lived there, and continue to live there, so there will be no reimbursement of rent for a property you inhabited despite your concerns about the ongoing repairs and disrepair.

If you do not like the fact that the LL hasn't finished the repairs (and under the circumstances, especially given the status of his mortgage payments, it's unlikely that he will finish anytime soon), then your recourse is to give your notice and move out. Perhaps you can save some money on the cleaners (how is it that cleaning costs are that high?) and pest control (seriously, if there is a vermin problem, that's the LL's responsibility to take care of, unless YOU are causing the problem with inadequate sanitation).

 

[Gail in Georgia]

It is unlikely the landlord would agree to reimburse you for any rent.

In addition, if they are two months behind on the mortgage, they may not have the funds to reimburse anyone for the rent (which may also explain why no further work has been done on the house).

Are you willing to go to court over this matter? If so, what would you sue over (as has been pointed out, you have nothing in writing to show as evidence) and even winning a judgement is no guarantee you'll ever see a penny of this money (as many a landlord has found out).

Sometimes it's just better to cut your losses, find a better place to live, give your notice and move out.

Gail

 

[s10sleeper]

I refused to sign the lease, as I told him after looking it over that I did not agree with it and that we needed to rewrite it. One thing I am absolutely certain of is that caveat emptor is not permitted in the state of Kansas for residential leases. Also, as with most other states, there is an implied warrant of habitability. In Kansas, verbal contracts are legally binding, of course proving it is the hard part, but with multiple people present, should not be too hard.

Many of the issues with the house are a severe hazard, such as no means of egress other than the front door, no smoke detectors, exposed wiring, undersized wire, and the mouse problem was due to their negligence of the house. I have taken every step to prevent wood roaches and mice and in fact am getting a private applicators license for pesticides. The problem with this town is that if I call for an inspection, if it fails, they just condemn the house as they do not have someone committed to doing inspections.

I have more than fulfilled my duties as a tenant, as there was no rail on the front stairs which due to the number of stairs was required, I actually built a wrought iron rail and did not charge him. I tried every measure to reduce the drafts throughout the winter. We only took on the house as he said it was getting finished. As the supplies are all here and I have the necessary tools, I even offered to contract with him to work on the house, which he was not willing to do, or at least not pay for my labor.

I am also well aware that space heaters are not a fixed source of heat and not permitted to be used that way under residential codes.

You may very well be correct, however I am certain this would fall under negligence, if not gross negligence as he is well aware that if there is a fire there is no way out. Oh, plus I have informed him long ago that as my father is on oxygen, according to the company that delivers it and also according to the doctors, that space heaters are absolutely not permitted in the rooms with oxygen tanks.

 

[sandyclaus]

I refused to sign the lease, as I told him after looking it over that I did not agree with it and that we needed to rewrite it. One thing I am absolutely certain of is that caveat emptor is not permitted in the state of Kansas for residential leases. Also, as with most other states, there is an implied warrant of habitability. In Kansas, verbal contracts are legally binding, of course proving it is the hard part, but with multiple people present, should not be too hard.

Many of the issues with the house are a severe hazard, such as no means of egress other than the front door, no smoke detectors, exposed wiring, undersized wire, and the mouse problem was due to their negligence of the house. I have taken every step to prevent wood roaches and mice and in fact am getting a private applicators license for pesticides. The problem with this town is that if I call for an inspection, if it fails, they just condemn the house as they do not have someone committed to doing inspections.

I have more than fulfilled my duties as a tenant, as there was no rail on the front stairs which due to the number of stairs was required, I actually built a wrought iron rail and did not charge him. I tried every measure to reduce the drafts throughout the winter. We only took on the house as he said it was getting finished. As the supplies are all here and I have the necessary tools, I even offered to contract with him to work on the house, which he was not willing to do, or at least not pay for my labor.

I am also well aware that space heaters are not a fixed source of heat and not permitted to be used that way under residential codes.

You may very well be correct, however I am certain this would fall under negligence, if not gross negligence as he is well aware that if there is a fire there is no way out. Oh, plus I have informed him long ago that as my father is on oxygen, according to the company that delivers it and also according to the doctors, that space heaters are absolutely not permitted in the rooms with oxygen tanks.

The problem with your argument is that the conditions were good enough to live in for over five months. If you KNEW that the conditions were so sub-standard, you should never have accepted the property and moved in, let alone STAYED for many months afterwards, ESPECIALLY when you realized that the LL wasn't finishing the work as he allegedly promised.

Since it was good enough for you to live there and CONTINUE living there for five months and counting, you aren't going to be able to make any kind of valid argument to get your rent refunded to you. You CHOSE to accept the property, despite the substandard conditions. You CHOOSE to continue living there, under the guise that you can't afford to move out. You could call code enforcement, and you may well find that they will cite the LL for many of the issues you have brought up. If they are as bad as you claim they are, they might even write it up to condemn the property, which would require you to vacate very quickly.

Bottom line is that you can't have it both ways. The LL isn't evicting you, but you aren't in any hurry to leave, either. You seem to be implying that if you could live there free, you wouldn't be complaining about the conditions. You certainly AREN'T getting back the rent you've already paid to live there - PERIOD.

 

[s10sleeper]

The problem with your argument is that the conditions were good enough to live in for over five months. If you KNEW that the conditions were so sub-standard, you should never have accepted the property and moved in, let alone STAYED for many months afterwards, ESPECIALLY when you realized that the LL wasn't finishing the work as he allegedly promised.

Since it was good enough for you to live there and CONTINUE living there for five months and counting, you aren't going to be able to make any kind of valid argument to get your rent refunded to you. You CHOSE to accept the property, despite the substandard conditions. You CHOOSE to continue living there, under the guise that you can't afford to move out. You could call code enforcement, and you may well find that they will cite the LL for many of the issues you have brought up. If they are as bad as you claim they are, they might even write it up to condemn the property, which would require you to vacate very quickly.

Bottom line is that you can't have it both ways. The LL isn't evicting you, but you aren't in any hurry to leave, either. You seem to be implying that if you could live there free, you wouldn't be complaining about the conditions. You certainly AREN'T getting back the rent you've already paid to live there - PERIOD.

Your accusations are COMPLETELY wrong. I asked about rent refund, after the points were made, I have not disputed that at all. I never implied that I want to live anywhere for free, in fact, the last thing I want is a free ride at all, which from what I gather is what you are implying. Unlike many people these days, I do have ethics, regardless of another party failing to meet their contractual obligations, I continue to meet mine until I am no longer legally obligated. Of course the LL isn't evicting me, an actual eviction is a legal process, when all he would have to do since I am on a month to month is give me thirty days notice, just like I am required to give him before moving out. I don't believe he is aware of it though, as he is not in it for the business, just to make the mortgage payments.

As far as continuing to live here, it is not at all that I have not been looking for a place, however, some people do not have the ability to fork out a deposit, nor have the privilege, nor ability, to drive due to uncontrolled circumstances which limits being able to move. If I had the funds to move and hire help, I would, and am attempting to save for that, hence the reason for being here for so long. As I ORIGINALLY stated, I am concerned about not having a roof over my head, but actually am even more concerned for my father to have somewhere to live as his health is failing. You seem to be taking offense to the fact that I asked that question. I never wanted it both ways, I was primarily asking advice as, at least I believe, this is an advice forum. The certified letter I am sending is just a standard request for repairs. Anyone who has ever rented or been a landlord should be familiar with what that is.

 

[sandyclaus]

Your accusations are COMPLETELY wrong. I asked about rent refund, after the points were made, I have not disputed that at all. I never implied that I want to live anywhere for free, in fact, the last thing I want is a free ride at all, which from what I gather is what you are implying. Unlike many people these days, I do have ethics, regardless of another party failing to meet their contractual obligations, I continue to meet mine until I am no longer legally obligated. Of course the LL isn't evicting me, an actual eviction is a legal process, when all he would have to do since I am on a month to month is give me thirty days notice, just like I am required to give him before moving out. I don't believe he is aware of it though, as he is not in it for the business, just to make the mortgage payments.

As far as continuing to live here, it is not at all that I have not been looking for a place, however, some people do not have the ability to fork out a deposit, nor have the privilege, nor ability, to drive due to uncontrolled circumstances which limits being able to move. If I had the funds to move and hire help, I would, and am attempting to save for that, hence the reason for being here for so long. As I ORIGINALLY stated, I am concerned about not having a roof over my head, but actually am even more concerned for my father to have somewhere to live as his health is failing. You seem to be taking offense to the fact that I asked that question. I never wanted it both ways, I was primarily asking advice as, at least I believe, this is an advice forum. The certified letter I am sending is just a standard request for repairs. Anyone who has ever rented or been a landlord should be familiar with what that is.

No one said you weren't entitled to repairs. However, in your original post, you weren't looking just for repairs:

...I am wondering if in this situation if a landlord could be required to reimburse rent as I am preparing to send a certified letter to him.

You were looking for a refund of the rent you've paid.

When you fall upon hard times, you are looking for a break wherever you can find it, and you're willing to take on substandard living conditions because the rent price is right. My point is that these were substandard conditions when you moved in. They weren't so bad that you were forced to immediately demand repairs to make the property habitable, nor was it so bad you felt the need to move out immediately out of concern for your health and safety. You moved in, knowing exactly what you were getting into, and now you are expecting the LL to give you a refund of all your rent back because the property has habitability issues. That's simply NOT going to happen.

As has been stated, either live with what you're dealing with, or move out to a place that is safer and more habitable. Of course, you will also probably end up paying higher rent for better conditions. The lower rent you are paying is kind of a discount for dealing with the construction issues. Or, you could say that the property is dangerous and problematic, and head to the code inspectors, hoping to force the LLs to fix the habitability issues. With the owner's money issues, they will more likely watch you go before they fix what you're insisting get fixed.

 

[OHRoadwarrior]

Your recourse is to move. Otherwise, you continue to agree to the living conditions. If you had a lease, that would be different. Stupidity is making the same mistake time after time. Is that what you are saying you've done month after month? By all means, send him a certified letter demanding action, expect in response your letter of eviction.

 

[s10sleeper]

The question about reimbursement of rent was merely out of curiosity. I am just looking for suggestions, which I am not arguing any of them. The issue of the rental agreement being month to month was because he never showed back up to work out the lease. I have taken every measure possible to cover my end, hundreds of photos, walked through and documented the condition of the entire house, and have tried to discuss it with the landlord each month. That is the reason that I have been thinking about sending the letter, as I am just trying to follow the steps with the KS Landlord Tenant Act.

My plan is to move out ASAP. However, I have to make sure I have a place located, and so I have to try to come up with the money first. As far as the dangers in the house, for this reason I have made sure to have sufficient renters insurance. I do know he really can't afford to go without having tenants here as that is the only way he can pay the mortgage, he told me that himself.

The sad part is, he is a very nice guy, I think he is stuck in the middle, as the house is his son's, who lives a few states away and so he is acting as his agent, but also having to pay the mortgage on his own too.

Needless to say, I do have a meeting coming up on Monday and am hoping to try for a loan on a house as even figuring in maintenance costs, around here buying can be cheaper than renting if you plan to live in a house for a minimum of 5 years. Otherwise, I will try to find out about the new LL by speaking with previous tenants.