Copyright, trademark, patent infringement

[acuity2103]

Where is the line drawn for copyright, trademark, patent infringement?

For example, lets say i make a board game based on monopoly. The idea of the game is the same, but I change some rules, board game pieces, and basically so it looks like a different game, but the goal of the game is the same. is it infringement?

how about video games? obviously some games are based on the same idea as other games, where is the line drawn then? halo was a FPS, but there are many other FPSs out there. where is teh line drawn?


thank you

 

[quincy]

Where is the line drawn for copyright, trademark, patent infringement?

For example, lets say i make a board game based on monopoly. The idea of the game is the same, but I change some rules, board game pieces, and basically so it looks like a different game, but the goal of the game is the same. is it infringement?

how about video games? obviously some games are based on the same idea as other games, where is the line drawn then? halo was a FPS, but there are many other FPSs out there. where is teh line drawn?


thank you

At its most basic, copyright law protects original creative expressions, and trademark law protects business identifiers (trademarks, slogans, logos, etc), and patents protect inventions from use and sale by others.

A game can involved all three types of intellectual property.

You can create a game using the same ideas or facts of another game (the game play). You cannot express the game play in the same or similar way without the potential for infringing on the rights of another. For a very simple example, the appearance of your game (its characters and design) must not copy another game, and the names used in your game (to identify either characters or the game itself) must not lead anyone to confuse your game with that of another, and any process or machine used for game play that is patented cannot be used - without permission from the game rights-holder (with permission granted usually in the form of licenses).

The best way to tell if your game is going to cross any legal line is to have your game ideas and drawings personally reviewed by an IP attorney in your area.

Good luck.

 

[LucasChalmers]

(Please correct me if I'm wrong)Even if you have the same goal, for as long as the utility/function, design and name of the game is different, I think you are not violating any copyright or patent laws.

 

[FlyingRon]

(Please correct me if I'm wrong)Even if you have the same goal, for as long as the utility/function, design and name of the game is different, I think you are not violating any copyright or patent laws.

Independent effort would thwart many copyright issues. Monopoly is still protected by copyright. You'd have to show you didn't copy the monopoly creative embodiment (making it a derivative work) in deriving your game. There was a "parody" game called Ghettopoly created to be sold at Urban Outfitters. This raised some copyright issues, but UO ended up pulling the game for other reasons before the copyright issues ever made it to court.

There are a whole pile of trademark issues if you use any of the names or logos that Monopoly uses. Oddly while the court kind of weakened the use of the name Monopoly itself as the trademark, various visual logos, etc... still stay in force.

Making a game that works like Monopoly would have been an issue with the patents (there are at least two) on the game, but they have expired long ago.

 

[quincy]

(Please correct me if I'm wrong)Even if you have the same goal, for as long as the utility/function, design and name of the game is different, I think you are not violating any copyright or patent laws.

You sort of have it right.

The GAME PLAY can be the same as another game as long as you express the elements of the game differently (the design, characters, names, board appearance, card appearance, etc.). Using Monopoly as an example again, you can create a game where players have the opportunity to purchase whatever shows on the space they land on with a roll of the dice, and the winner is the player who accumulates the most or knocks other players out of the game. You cannot have a Get Out of Jail Free card, or a Park Place and Boardwalk, or anything that resembles the Monopoly game, as these are all rights-protected elements.

I recommend you have your game idea and game design reviewed by an IP attorney in your area. This is the best way to ensure your game does not infringe on any rights, be they patent rights, trademark rights or copyrights.

Good luck.

 

[FlyingRon]

You sort of have it right.

The GAME PLAY can be the same as another game as long as you express the elements of the game differently (the design, characters, names, board appearance, card appearance, etc.). Using Monopoly as an example again, you can create a game where players have the opportunity to purchase whatever shows on the space they land on with a roll of the dice, and the winner is the player who accumulates the most or knocks other players out of the game. You cannot have a Get Out of Jail Free card, or a Park Place and Boardwalk, or anything that resembles the Monopoly game, as these are all rights-protected elements.

That is true for copyright and trademark aspects, but if there was still a monopoly patent in force (there isn't), but if there were, you using your own expression of the patented invention is not going to free you from the patent obligation.

Here for your own amusement is the latest (to my knowledge) on the Monopoly patents: http://www.google.com/patents/US2026082

 

[quincy]

That is true for copyright and trademark aspects, but if there was still a monopoly patent in force (there isn't), but if there were, you using your own expression of the patented invention is not going to free you from the patent obligation.

Here for your own amusement is the latest (to my knowledge) on the Monopoly patents: http://www.google.com/patents/US2026082

Right. Patents need to be considered when creating games, as well as trademarks and copyrights. That is one reason why having an IP attorney review game ideas and designs can be important. It can be easy to infringe on another's rights.

It is often hard for a game creator to envision a game with the same game play that does not resemble in a potentially-infringing way another rights-protected game (just as it is hard to envision a fairy tale character that does not resemble a Disney version of the character ). It is harder than it might seem.

Thanks for the link.

 

[single317dad]

For a little further reading, a case I remember from many years ago. I seem to remember someone else trying this in the late 1990s too:

http://boardgamegeek.com/boardgame/15884/hometown-monopoly-bloomington

http://boardgamegeek.com/boardgame/15884/hometown-monopoly-bloomington

http://www.apnewsarchive.com/1985/Game-Company-Sues-Competititor/id-1b0c6afc0039ae3f36681195061e13f5

http://www.apnewsarchive.com/1985/Game-Company-Sues-Competititor/id-1b0c6afc0039ae3f36681195061e13f5

http://news.google.com/newspapers?nid=1368&dat=19851220&id=F14bAAAAIBAJ&sjid=6E4EAAAAIBAJ&pg=2665,6290035

http://news.google.com/newspapers?nid=1368&dat=19851220&id=F14bAAAAIBAJ&sjid=6E4EAAAAIBAJ&pg=2665,6290035 (I hope that links dieectly to the articls "Game Maker Won't Fight Suit".)

 

[quincy]

For a little further reading, a case I remember from many years ago. I seem to remember someone else trying this in the late 1990s too:

http://boardgamegeek.com/boardgame/15884/hometown-monopoly-bloomington

http://www.apnewsarchive.com/1985/Game-Company-Sues-Competititor/id-1b0c6afc0039ae3f36681195061e13f5

http://news.google.com/newspapers?nid=1368&dat=19851220&id=F14bAAAAIBAJ&sjid=6E4EAAAAIBAJ&pg=2665,6290035 (I hope that links dieectly to the articls "Game Maker Won't Fight Suit".)

Neither "The Milwaukee Sentinel" link nor the boardgamegeek.com link are working for me.

There are always going to be lawsuits threatened and/or filed over games that too closely resemble one another. A rights-holder must act to protect their own rights. It is always best (although not very easy) to come up with a creative, original, unique idea for a game that has no marketplace equal, in either rules of the game or play of the game. If someone needs to use another's game as the starting point for their own game, they really should have the game reviewed by a professional for areas that might cause legal challenges.

Sometimes looking to games played eons ago (like the game Mancala) can provide a jumping-off point for creating a new game that will avoid infringing on rights.

 

[single317dad]

Neither "The Milwaukee Sentinel" link nor the boardgamegeek.com link are working for me.

Interesting; I loaded this thread in a different browser on a different computer and they still worked for me.

 

[quincy]

Interesting; I loaded this thread in a different browser on a different computer and they still worked for me.

Hmmm.

I am still not able to access the material through those links but, admittedly, I have been having some difficulty with a few links on this site in recent days (and with this site in general) so they might work for others (and I had no problem with the AP link). Security updates on our computers could have something to do with it.

 

[single317dad]

Hmmm.

I am still not able to access the material through those links but, admittedly, I have been having some difficulty with a few links on this site in recent days (and with this site in general) so they might work for others (and I had no problem with the AP link). Security updates on our computers could have something to do with it.

I've edited my post to include the same links in a non-clickable format to copy and paste; maybe that will help. I used to do this for all links, but hadn't been recently.

 

[quincy]

I've edited my post to include the same links in a non-clickable format to copy and paste; maybe that will help. I used to do this for all links, but hadn't been recently.

Thanks, single317dad. That helped me. I will have to work on whatever computer security feature I now have that is messing with links on this site.

The history of the games is interesting. The sale of the trademark by Citigames to Parker Brothers and the subsequent licensing of rights by Parker Brothers to Citigames was a nice way to settle the IP issues that arose over the similar games.

And the notice in the game rules that state " ... consultation with attorneys representing Parker Brothers avoided patent and copyright infringement ..." is an important notice for game makers to make note of.

Discussing any potentially IP-conflicting areas with a rights-holder directly (to see what can be amicably worked out), or consulting with an attorney prior to marketing a game for a personal review of game ideas to avoid all areas of infringement from the outset, is smart.

 

[Just Blue]

(Please correct me if I'm wrong)Even if you have the same goal, for as long as the utility/function, design and name of the game is different, I think you are not violating any copyright or patent laws.

Lucas...Please look at the date of the thread before posting. Anything with a last posting date, by the OP, of more than 4 weeks is, to this forum, a "dead thread".

Stay with current threads.

Thanks!!
Blue

 

[quincy]

Lucas...Please look at the date of the thread before posting. Anything with a last posting date, by the OP, of more than 4 weeks is, to this forum, a "dead thread".

Stay with current threads.

Thanks!!
Blue

Just to clarify, LucasChalmers' post to THIS thread was fine, because the post was made to a newer thread.

I assume Blue Meanie is referring to comments added by Lucas to other, older, archived threads. That is a no-no on this forum for a whole host of reasons (e.g., laws can change in significant ways over time so what was applicable once is no longer applicable, the original posters have often long since disappeared so the comments are of no benefit to them, questions asked have generally already been answered, the issues addressed have already been dealt with ...). In addition, any additions to older threads are often reported and deleted, so it is a waste of everyone's time to revive old threads.