Yard damage from accident

[not2cleverRed]

By the way, did you file a police report about the property damage made by the unlicensed, uninsured driver who was texting while driving?

 

[ricksam83]

I agree but would add that estimates for repair should be obtained first (preferably from 3 different companies) to support any demand that is made.

In addition, I would not invest TIME in repairing the damage. Material can be purchased and receipts saved but any time ricksam spends on repairing the damage himself is not compensable.

Why wouldn't it be not compensable? When this happened back in 2013, I received a check for $1200. I didn't have to submit any receipts or anything. I also asked and made sure I can do the work myself and he said I could do whatever I feel necessary with the funds. I ordered 10 yards of soil, bought some grass seed, straw, mailbox, etc. Spent a weekend fixing it all. I think the total I had spent on this stuff was around $600, the other $600 I kept for my time.

As far as the grass seed, mailbox, etc I was planning on doing all of this. Plus we live in the country and have to travel 15 minutes to our post office every day to pickup mail, already spent hours on the phone with the insurance company, the time I need to invest in getting multiple quotes and making sure everything is done right. Plus I'll want to take a day or two off work when they do this. I'll have plenty of hours into the project. If I did get quotes for lets say just $800 excavating, I can do the mailbox and seed for $300 material only. That's 1100 then tack on another few hundred for the time/hassle I already have invested or will have invested. Even if I hired it out 100%, I would still have to pick up my mailbox, have to meet companies for quotes, take a day off to make sure it's graded right, plus all my time I've spent with the insurance company.

I can do anything until I get a quote... those numbers are just for illustration.

 

[ricksam83]

By the way, did you file a police report about the property damage made by the unlicensed, uninsured driver who was texting while driving?

A report was filed. Also, I got the phone call while I was at work so I came home. The cop let him go. You would think he would have been detained for a little while for being unlicensed, uninsured, who admitted to texting.

 

[ricksam83]

I think you are second guessing mom's reaction to the damge estimate WAY to soon. I also think you may be selling yourself short by basing your estimate on an previous accident that happened YEARS ago. Equiment rental and material costs are way up.

Mom seems keen on protecting the kid, you should ask her for 1500, maybe even 1800 and tell her if she doesn't pay you ASAP you'll take the kid to court and get a judgement. And that won't help when they are sure to be already dealing with the car rental people who will want repair and deminished value of their property...

That's what I'm guessing... but I don't want to be to harsh lol. Although I did google the number his mom called from. He is a DR and owns his own practice the next town over. I appreciate them reaching out to me and willing to cover the cost. But I don't think they know the actual "cost" of what it'll be until I tell them. Maybe she's just trying to offer me the check and maybe she even already offered to pay to fix the vehicle... I'm not sure. Just to try to lessen the burden with court costs. So maybe she doesn't really care what it costs to fix, maybe 1200 to her is pocket change? Or maybe she's expecting me to call and say $200.

 

[quincy]

Why wouldn't it be not compensable? When this happened back in 2013, I received a check for $1200. I didn't have to submit any receipts or anything. I also asked and made sure I can do the work myself and he said I could do whatever I feel necessary with the funds. I ordered 10 yards of soil, bought some grass seed, straw, mailbox, etc. Spent a weekend fixing it all. I think the total I had spent on this stuff was around $600, the other $600 I kept for my time.

As far as the grass seed, mailbox, etc I was planning on doing all of this. Plus we live in the country and have to travel 15 minutes to our post office every day to pickup mail, already spent hours on the phone with the insurance company, the time I need to invest in getting multiple quotes and making sure everything is done right. Plus I'll want to take a day or two off work when they do this. I'll have plenty of hours into the project. If I did get quotes for lets say just $800 excavating, I can do the mailbox and seed for $300 material only. That's 1100 then tack on another few hundred for the time/hassle I already have invested or will have invested. Even if I hired it out 100%, I would still have to pick up my mailbox, have to meet companies for quotes, take a day off to make sure it's graded right, plus all my time I've spent with the insurance company.

I can do anything until I get a quote... those numbers are just for illustration.

You apparently were paid by an insurance company before. The insurer determined the amount of damages and you were issued a check for that amount.

If you sue for the damages yourself, you must show damages. Time is not compensable.

 

[ricksam83]

You apparently were paid by an insurance company before. The insurer determined the amount if damages and you were issued a check for that amount.

If you sue for the damages yourself, you must show damages. Time is not compensable.

I hope it doesn't come to that... right now she just reached out to me wanting to know my personal estimatated cost and she said she would send me a check. But I'm not sure if she's hoping for a very low figure (mailbox and some grass seed) or if she's really willing to pay for the equipment or even knows I need equipment. If I tell her 1,500 and she pays it. I can spend $800 for the equipement work (pending quote) The other $700 use for my mailbox, grass seed, dirt, time, etc. I wouldn't give her a price until I get the quote though.

 

[quincy]

I hope it doesn't come to that... right now she just reached out to me wanting to know my personal estimatated cost and she said she would send me a check. But I'm not sure if she's hoping for a very low figure (mailbox and some grass seed) or if she's really willing to pay for the equipment or even knows I need equipment. If I tell her 1,500 and she pays it. I can spend $800 for the equipement work (pending quote) The other $700 use for my mailbox, grass seed, dirt, time, etc. I wouldn't give her a price until I get the quote though.

Don't give her your personal estimated cost. Get professional estimates so you can support the amount demanded.

 

[adjusterjack]

Allow me to summarize:

1 - The rental company is not liable. That's been explained correctly in several responses.

2 - The driver of the car is liable for your damage. He is the one that was negligent.

3 - The driver's mother is also likely liable for the damage under Ohio's negligent entrustment law:

http://codes.ohio.gov/orc/4511.203

(See why we ask for your state?)

4 - Your labor is compensable (contrary to a previous response) but if you get bogged down in the argument about the how much, you will never get paid. So be smart and get professional estimates including labor and submit the middle one to her for payment (along with a copy of the statute, if you like). Then if she doesn't pay you either sue her in small claims court or have your homeowners insurance pay (your choice).

 

[quincy]

... Your labor is compensable...

Please explain. Thanks.

 

[adjusterjack]

Because the cost of repair includes the cost of labor regardless of who performs the labor. The person who performs the labor is to be compensated. Cost doesn't necessarily mean dollars. It also means the value of time spent on repair that could have been spent doing some other activity, whether it be income producing or not.

Insurance companies routinely pay insureds and claimants for their own labor because it is well recognized that the labor is a part of the cost of repairs.

In Martin v. Design Construction Services (2009) the Ohio Supreme Court makes it clear that (regarding damage to property) "If the injury is susceptible of repair, the measure of damages is the reasonable cost of restoration..." (Paragraph 14.)

And goes on to say "that the fundamental purpose of law was "to afford to the person damaged compensation for the loss sustained."" (Paragraph 19.)

https://scholar.google.com/scholar_case?case=14674504981048103686&q=reasonable+cost+of+restoration&hl=en&as_sdt=4,36

In Munn v. Stapleton (2003) the Court of Appeals quotes the following jury instruction with regard to compensation for property damage:

"If you find that the Defendants' negligence proximately caused Plaintiffs to suffer damages, then you will determine from the preponderance of the evidence an amount of money that will reasonably compensate the Plaintiffs for the actual injury and damages proximately caused by the negligence of the Defendants unreduced by any payments already made. In determining this amount you will consider the nature and extent of the losses incurred by the Plaintiffs, including the Plaintiffs' loss and enjoyment of their home." (Paragraph 18.)

http://www.supremecourt.ohio.gov/rod/docs/pdf/6/2003/2003-Ohio-5606.pdf

Let's take the mailbox, for example.

A professional mailbox installer charges $100 for the mailbox, $50 for the labor and takes 2 hours to do the job.

I do it myself, pay $100 for the mailbox and it takes me 2 hours to do the job. That 2 hours is part of "the nature and extent" of my loss for which I am entitled to compensation. The Defendant doesn't get to reduce his liability just because I don't hand the $50 over to somebody else.

I don't know where anybody gets the idea that the homeowner shouldn't be compensated for his/her own labor to repair damage caused by a negligent party.

I do agree, however, (and mentioned it earlier) that there could be an argument as to just how much the homeowner's labor is worth which is why I suggested getting the professional estimate, getting paid, and then doing whatever she wants. Avoids that argument.

 

[quincy]

Thank you.

I agree that getting professional estimates is smart.

 

[ricksam83]

Thanks all. I did talk to my neighbor up the road that owns his own landscaping company today. He said he could excavate the ditch and replace that culvert pipe for 600. (Labor and machine only, pipe extra).

600 excavate ditch and replace pipe
200 for the pipe
100 mailbox
100 limestone
100 seed
300 my labor to pick up and install mailbox, help spread gravel and grass seed. Plus I'll be using a vacation day from work which this will help compensate.

We are going to call her tomorrow at noon to see if she accepts the 1400 quote. He said we might be able to reuse my limestone if he's able to keep it clean so I might be able to keep that 100, but I'm still adding it to the quote just in case I decide on fresh limestone

Hopefully she agrees. Beats the alternative taking them to court and pushing this out a month or two.

Does that sound reasonable? Again, shes the one that said let me know how much and I'll pay. I don't think it's to unreasonable for me to ask for 300 on top of his quote and all the material just to help pay for my time picking up and installing mailbox, day off, seeding, plus the hours on the phone with insurance company.

 

[quincy]

Thanks all. I did talk to my neighbor up the road that owns his own landscaping company today. He said he could excavate the ditch and replace that culvert pipe for 600. (Labor and machine only, pipe extra).

600 excavate ditch and replace pipe
200 for the pipe
100 mailbox
100 limestone
100 seed
300 my labor to pick up and install mailbox, help spread gravel and grass seed. Plus I'll be using a vacation day from work which this will help compensate.

We are going to call her tomorrow at noon to see if she accepts the 1400 quote. He said we might be able to reuse my limestone if he's able to keep it clean so I might be able to keep that 100, but I'm still adding it to the quote just in case I decide on fresh limestone

Hopefully she agrees. Beats the alternative taking them to court and pushing this out a month or two.

Does that sound reasonable? Again, shes the one that said let me know how much and I'll pay. I don't think it's to unreasonable for me to ask for 300 on top of his quote and all the material just to help pay for my time picking up and installing mailbox, day off, seeding, plus the hours on the phone with insurance company.

You should get the landscaper's estimate in writing, with each item listed with cost.

I recommend you get more than the single estimate. Three is best.

What is looked at is the "reasonable" cost to repair the damage.

You can ask for your out-of-pocket costs but these should be supported.

Good luck.

 

[HighwayMan]

You would think he would have been detained for a little while for being unlicensed, uninsured, who admitted to texting.

Violating someone's rights by unlawfully detaining them longer than is necessary could cause many problems for the police officer and his employer.

Punishment is handed out by a court - not on the side of the road.

 

[adjusterjack]

200 for the pipe
100 mailbox
100 limestone
100 seed
300 my labor to pick up and install mailbox, help spread gravel and grass seed. Plus I'll be using a vacation day from work which this will help compensate.

Does that sound reasonable?

No.

The $300 for your labor and a day off from work to justify it is BS and you wouldn't be able to justify it in court.

As for the other items, you obviously don't have a professional estimate for them so you are talking out of your hat.

If I were her, I wouldn't pay it.

Get a professional written estimate for ALL the items, not just talk. It still might come to $1400 (though I don't think so) but it will eliminate any argument that you are gouging her.

Or, you can just ask for $1400 and see how it goes. Be sure to let us know.