Knifey-spoony (Simpsons)

[FlyingRon]

In Australia they donate these things to the Flying Doctors. You can buy some pretty nice knives at the Flying Doctors museum and the proceeds to back to the mission. Here it just advances the TSA mission.

A "glass breaking pen" is not necessarily prohibited. TSA only prohibits sharp things. A glass breaker just has a hardened point, but it's not like it's sharp enough to pierce/cut skin. Aircraft windows are plastic and the thing is going to have no effect on them whatsoever.

TSA is notoriously awful at finding things like that anyhow. I carry a cheap cigar lighter (cheap because I know it can be confiscated). They've never noticed it.

 

[xylene]

I successfully convinced the TSA agent my special Leatherman Micra on which I had removed the blade was compliant.
(It is compliant and I've flown it several times)

 

[Whoops2u]

I successfully convinced the TSA agent my special Leatherman Micra on which I had removed the blade was compliant.
(It is compliant and I've flown it several times)

I now carry a Gerber Dime Travel tool that is designed for flying. Once it took three TSA people looking at before they allowed it. Top men, I tell you.

 

[HRZ]

My cane has a heavy round brass ball handle similar to a brass door knob....because that's exactly what it is ....and no hidden dagger or sharp tip ....never had a fuss .

 

[PayrollHRGuy]

TSA is notoriously awful at finding things like that anyhow.

Really they are notoriously awful at finding anything.

 

[quincy]

Really they are notoriously awful at finding anything.

I have had problems only once at the airport and that was when traveling with wife and kids. TSA for some reason found suspicious the empty juicer cups we had packed.

And my wife somehow forgot she was carrying a "Boy Scout knife" in the diaper bag when we went to the Smithsonian once and it was confiscated. WHY my wife was carrying a Boy Scout knife in the diaper bag remains a mystery.

 

[FlyingRon]

Don't get me started on the Smithsonian security. My wife used to work there. I'm surprised they caught that.

 

[justalayman]

What is the name of your state? CA

In another thread, /u/quincy posted a case on knife definitions in the state and I have a question. I have a "tactical" pen I carry around with me all the time. It is the size of a thick but normal pen, has a Fisher Space Pen refill, and is made of machined aluminium with a pointed tip to break glass on one end and a knurled ridge "DNA collector" on the other.

I could certainly stab someone with it.

16470.
As used in this part, “dirk” or “dagger” means a knife or other instrument with or without a handguard that is capable of ready use as a stabbing weapon that may inflict great bodily injury or death. A nonlocking folding knife, a folding knife that is not prohibited by Section 21510, or a pocketknife is capable of ready use as a stabbing weapon that may inflict great bodily injury or death only if the blade of the knife is exposed and locked into position.

While I usually keep it in my shirt pocket, if the shirt is not well made (The pen is heavy and can make the pocket sag too much.) or if I don't have a shirt pocket, I'll slip it into my front pocket. Is that a crime?

Oh my God. I’ve just realized the pencil I carry means I’m breaking the law

At least I have an excuse for not picking up the fallen branches from my yard. I hate yard work anyway.


That statute is so ambiguous it should be repealed. Anything resembling a stick, including my finger, could be used t inflict great bodily harm. (there are multiple ways to kill a person using nothing more then your finger)

 

[Whoops2u]

Oh my God. I’ve just realized the pencil I carry means I’m breaking the law

At least I have an excuse for not picking up the fallen branches from my yard. I hate yard work anyway.


That statute is so ambiguous it should be repealed. Anything resembling a stick, including my finger, could be used t inflict great bodily harm. (there are multiple ways to kill a person using nothing more then your finger)

The problem is, it is hard to write a law that will cover all contingencies. Could a spoon (like the one in the cartoon clip) be a dirk or dagger? Yes. We might be able to argue a bit about an unmodified spoon but probably wouldn't debate it much if the spoon was sturdy and the person sharpened one end to a point. Screwdrivers and ice picks could be a dirk or dagger (At least some cases say in indicia.) unmodified.

Is a baseball bat an illegal club? Sometimes. Even though many cases indicate intent for carrying is irrelevant on if it will be considered a weapon, some don't and place great store on all the facts surrounding what the person might have intended when he placed his baseball bat under the seat.

I believe Godfather III had the Italian boss killed with his own glasses; ripped of his face and stabbed through the neck. Could eyeglasses be a dirk or dagger?

 

[justalayman]

Just about anything pokey in shape can be used kill a person.

And I could use any unmodified spoon as a lethal weapon.

The problem I see is in an intent to create a law intended to raise the level of crime, they have made it so ambiguous by including just about anything one picks up being defined as a weapon.


A knife is a weapon. Using that rationale my kitchen drawer is filled with weapons. I carry a weapon to work every day.

The problem is: those weapons are also tools so unless used as a weapon, they should not be considered illegal


Yes, it’s the intent that makes the difference but rather than writing a law that raises the level of the crime when one uses an item as a weapon, they attempt to list items that could be used as a weapon and criminalize the possession of them. It isn’t realistic to do that and not fall into the overly ambiguous class of laws.

 

[quincy]

Just about anything pokey in shape can be used kill a person.

And I could use any unmodified spoon as a lethal weapon.

The problem I see is in an intent to create a law intended to raise the level of crime, they have made it so ambiguous by including just about anything one picks up being defined as a weapon.


A knife is a weapon. Using that rationale my kitchen drawer is filled with weapons. I carry a weapon to work every day.

The problem is: those weapons are also tools so unless used as a weapon, they should not be considered illegal


Yes, it’s the intent that makes the difference but rather than writing a law that raises the level of the crime when one uses an item as a weapon, they attempt to list items that could be used as a weapon and criminalize the possession of them. It isn’t realistic to do that and not fall into the overly ambiguous class of laws.

Plastic knives are banned in schools. These at one time were allowed in children's lunch bags. I guess kids today know how to wield plastic knives as weapons?

I agree with xylene that some laws are vague enough to be left to the police to interpret, resulting in far more arrests of the poor and the brown.

 

[justalayman]

Plastic knives are banned in schools. These at one time were allowed in children's lunch bags. I guess kids today know how to wield plastic knives as weapons?

I agree with xylene that some laws are vague enough to be left to the police to interpret, resulting in far more arrests of the poor and the brown.

I can do as much with a plastic spoon or fork or pencil or pen or paintbrush as i could with a plastic knife. The prohibition is based on appearances rather than reality.

As to laws being applied unequally: if the law is so vague it cannot be understood, then somebody needs to go about seeking its repeal. A law is not intended to be interpreted by the police (although I’m not saying their perception of the law won’t affect the issue). It is interpreted by the courts.

 

[quincy]

Vague laws certainly should be clarified.

 

[HighwayMan]

Is a baseball bat an illegal club? Sometimes.

In New York it's a "dangerous instrument". Which basically means anything that can be used to cause an injury to another. It get's charged as "Criminal Possession of a Weapon" if it used used for that purpose, otherwise it's just a baseball bat and is perfectly legal.

 

[quincy]

In New York it's a "dangerous instrument". Which basically means anything that can be used to cause an injury to another. It get's charged as "Criminal Possession of a Weapon" if it used used for that purpose, otherwise it's just a baseball bat and is perfectly legal.

There was an assault incident in Detroit where the weapon was listed by police as "foot."

I'd like to see a law that bans feet.