Land survey puts border in middle of drivway

[moonfairy56]

What is the name of your state? New Jersey

We just bought our new home 1 year ago. It is a 5 acre farm & when the land was sold it was subdivided into the 5 acre lot (ours with the house) & a 3 acre lot right next to it. This is our first home we bought & in all honestly, we thought we had gotten everything we needed done before making the purchase. Unfortunately the one thing that slipped through the cracks was getting a land survey.. everything has been wonderful untill just the other day

So fast forward to now! The 3 acre lot next door has been sold. The new owners got a land survey & the border, according to their survey lands right in the middle of our driveway. (picture below) I just got a message from the new owners real estate agent asking when we were planning to move the driveway. We were not expecting this at all & the driveway is about 300' long at least. We dropped every dime we had into this house so do have much to be able to move the driveway

My questions -
1 - Is their survey the legit end all border, or should I be getting a survey myself to compare to theirs?
2 - If this is the border & another survey wont be helpfull, is there any type of grandfathering for an easement agreement that would allow us to keep the driveway were it is but agreeing that half of it resides on their property since this is the driveway that has always been here (I'm assuming a real estate lawyer would be required here)
3 - If a grandfathered easement is not possible, should I get a real estate lawyer to handle discussions to request an easement, or should i just deal with the new owners real estate agent in working out an arrangement. I'm really not one to bicker about a couple of feet, but moving the driveway is not only a huge task, but a very expensive one to boot.
4 - Am I just boned & just need to suck it up & move my driveway!

 

[FarmerJ]

You may well want to have your own survey done , reason being , that if they are wrong then you will know, AS to your gravel driveway, IF the survey is true , you really wouldn't have to move your driveway BUT what you can do is if you know someone with a pick up truck and they are willing to help you that you go to the nearest gravel pit - dealer where you can have a big scoop load dumped into the back of the truck, drive it home , shovel some off, spread with iron rake , move truck up , shovel more off and repeat , and do something to mark the new lot line better (but say 2 to 3 inches into your side of the lot line and the other neighbor will have to decide if they want to just leave the gravel that is on their side of the lot line as it is or they can decide to have it removed up to the lot line and sodded or seeded or what ever they choose as long as they do it only to their side of the lot line. ( Ive been spot filling in my driveway and some softer spots going to the gravel dealer with my truck earlier this spring and soon to do it again , Also if you pay a gravel dealer to deliver it they can spread it for you then any so called evening out you can do with a iron rake or a snow blade on a tractor and again it wont be so bad cost wise) If you choose to accept the survey they had done you still don't have to do any thing to their side of the lot line.

 

[justalayman]

You may have a valid easement by implication, especially since the lots were conjoined at one point.

A second survey is not a bad idea but one hopes the first one is accurate. That’s your call.

Anything you do will cost you money whether it is accept the boundary line placement and moving your drive or hiring a new survey and a lawyer to fight this, and you could still lose.

You might start with speaking with a real estate lawyer who can review all of the facts known and give you an opinion of what s/he believes is the likely outcome.

 

[moonfairy56]

You may well want to have your own survey done , reason being , that if they are wrong then you will know, AS to your gravel driveway, IF the survey is true , you really wouldn't have to move your driveway BUT what you can do is if you know someone with a pick up truck and they are willing to help you that you go to the nearest gravel pit - dealer where you can have a big scoop load dumped into the back of the truck, drive it home , shovel some off, spread with iron rake , move truck up , shovel more off and repeat , and do something to mark the new lot line better (but say 2 to 3 inches into your side of the lot line and the other neighbor will have to decide if they want to just leave the gravel that is on their side of the lot line as it is or they can decide to have it removed up to the lot line and sodded or seeded or what ever they choose as long as they do it only to their side of the lot line. ( Ive been spot filling in my driveway and some softer spots going to the gravel dealer with my truck earlier this spring and soon to do it again , Also if you pay a gravel dealer to deliver it they can spread it for you then any so called evening out you can do with a iron rake or a snow blade on a tractor and again it wont be so bad cost wise) If you choose to accept the survey they had done you still don't have to do any thing to their side of the lot line.

Thank you, I think if we have to move it we will do the DIY method & just extend the driveway on our side so we are only have to expand half the driveway width.

 

[moonfairy56]

You may have a valid easement by implication, especially since the lots were conjoined at one point.

A second survey is not a bad idea but one hopes the first one is accurate. That’s your call.

Anything you do will cost you money whether it is accept the boundary line placement and moving your drive or hiring a new survey and a lawyer to fight this, and you could still lose.

You might start with speaking with a real estate lawyer who can review all of the facts known and give you an opinion of what s/he believes is the likely outcome.

Thank you for your response. I was wondering if there might be a reason for a valid easement given the situation. I may just set up an appointment with a local real estate lawyer. there are a couple that I found that will provide a free consultation, so that may be the best place to start.

 

[adjusterjack]

Whatever the lawyer tells you I think you would be better spending the money on putting some sort of barrier from the front stake to the rear stake, on your side, as cheaply as possible. You still have plenty of room to drive on your half of the driveway without getting in to an expensive legal hassle.

 

[moonfairy56]

Whatever the lawyer tells you I think you would be better spending the money on putting some sort of barrier from the front stake to the rear stake, on your side, as cheaply as possible. You still have plenty of room to drive on your half of the driveway without getting in to an expensive legal hassle.

The consultation is free with the real estate lawyer, so I think I'm gonna check it out just to see what they have to say.. Just to cover my bases.. But in all honesty, I would really like to work it out with the new owners on a friendly level & not start out with a fude over the border.. So I agree with you on avoiding expensive unnecessary fees.. But I feel it's nessessary to at least see what options are available & not go into the situation blind... For all I know... The new owners may be willing to work something out if it was a personal sale.. However if its a developer.. I'm sure they will want every inch they can get.

 

[Just Blue]

Really, for all you know, that survey they did was wrong and you are rolling over and gifting them land you paid for. Personally I'd spend the money and get a survey done.

 

[moonfairy56]

Really, for all you know, that survey they did was wrong and you are rolling over and gifting them land you paid for. Personally I'd spend the money and get a survey done.

Really, for all you know, that survey they did was wrong and you are rolling over and gifting them land you paid for. Personally I'd spend the money and get a survey done.

Thanks for the advice. That's one of my fears.. I made the mistake originally by somehow not getting one when we bought the property. And I'm Leary about facing this without the proper knowledge.

 

[bcr229]

I would get the survey before having the free consult with the attorney, as he or she will be able to give you better (free) advice if you have that in-hand, and if you don't have one, that's likely the advice the attorney will give you.

If that one boundary line isn't where you thought it was, then the others may be quite a ways off from what you thought as well.

 

[xylene]

You need a survey asap.

The realtor, let's be honest, that's just some person. They don't have any power to compel anything, so don't worry about their fancy title

They are doing the absolute least possible to make their client happy (ie go away) They know they made a mistake too...

 

[HighwayMan]

"Moving" your driveway, if it comes down to that, doesn't seem like a huge issue. I figured it was paved until I saw the picture.

As others have said, get your own survey (maybe your realtor knows if there was a survey that existed from when you bought the place and just forgot to give it to you - doubtful but worth an inquiry).

 

[FarmerJ]

BTW hauling rock in ( start with small rock ) small truck like my fakeford LOL 94 mazda small truck almost one full scoop =20$ in my area, if I could use my real ford truck that has the regular larger bed its 25$ but its a larger load,. start with about 3 inches of rock so you can drive it down by driving on it and then maybe next summer a layer of finer gravel opver it all ( this way if your creative and can make a home made drag to pull with a car / truck/ tractor down the driveway as needed. DO keep in mind If you get your own survey done and it doesn't agree with the neighbors survey you may have to plan on letting the courts settle it.

 

[justalayman]

With two very recent surveys there would be a decent chance of the two surveyors figuring out the mismatching surveys. If an error is found they should correct it.

Now, if the each claim error free surveys and they don’t match, then heading to court is the right direction.

 

[154NH773]

First, get your own survey. Without your own survey you have nothing to start with. As others said, if the two surveys don’t match, have the surveyors try and figure out why.

Secondly, have a title search done to see if there is any easement in place already. You can do this yourself if you know how.

If there is no easement in your favor, move your driveway. Do not try and get an easement by going to court, it will cost you way more than spreading some gravel. In my opinion you have little chance of getting a court to find in your favor.

You can waste your time getting “free” legal advice from a lawyer, but my experience has been they will promise you the world but back off the expectations once you get closer to a court date.

Try and work something out with the neighbor, but don’t expect too much; they are not obligated to grant you an easement, and may demand a large amount of money even if they are willing. Don’t feel “entitled” to an easement, only a court can grant one if they refuse, and courts can decide anything they want, regardless of how much you feel you are right.