Are you legally required to the tip automatically added to your bill?

[amazontabletfire]

I'm surprised anyone would wait three hours - for lunch.

I did not really have any place to go afterwards, but still absurd amount of time to wait. The dishes were also dirty, and the food tasted like left over garbage. Probably my worst restaurant experience in the past 15 years but the real question is the legality of the paying the automatic tip.

I have seen 1 story a few years ago about a N.Y lawyer suing the restaurants for millions over the automatic tip and the restaurant told the news station that the customer was free to modify or even remove the automatic tip that was placed on the bill as a "convenience"

I have seen another story in which 2 people were arrested for not paying an automatic tip and the charges were all dropped by the prosecutor.

I think one story was from like 2009 and the other 2013. I don't know the current state of the law on this or if there is case law to draw from.

Thanks.

 

[amazontabletfire]

After 45 minutes I would have informed the manager and left.

We did inform a manager/supervisor but just got a dirty look and a shoulder shrug. In the US we have a culture of customer service and fairness however there are other countries where the attitude is like " take it or leave it" without consideration to making things right. This manager/ supervisor seem like they were foreign and maybe did not fully understand or cared what I was saying.

We actually did strongly consider just walking out after this incident and it was suggested several at our table.

 

[amazontabletfire]

You don't have to sign a contract to have a contract.



As long as it's posted (big sign or on the menu) you have notice even if you didn't bother to read it. It's called "constructive notice." (google it.)



Yes.



"Can" you? Of course. The word "can" denotes the ability to do something not whether it's right or wrong. Can you win a lawsuit against the woman who won't pose nude? Of course not.



3 hours? Well, that's on you, bub. You should have walked out after 15 or 20 minutes and complained to the manager on the way out.

Do you have any case law in which people have been sued or jailed for failing to pay a automatic tip.

I found 2 youtube video on news reports.
1. Case resulted in a class action lawsuit against the restaurant for added the tip to begin with and the restaurant told the news the customer was free to modify/delete the automatic tip if they needed.

2. Case in which the people were arrested but all charges immediately dropped.

So would this be considered a gray area of law?

 

[amazontabletfire]

Here is a link to Florida's automatic gratuity law: https://www.flsenate.gov/Laws/Statutes/2012/0509.214

"
509.214 Notification of automatic gratuity charge.—Every public food service establishment which includes an automatic gratuity or service charge in the price of the meal shall include on the food menu and on the face of the bill provided to the customer notice that an automatic gratuity is included.
History.—s. 1, ch. 86-24; s. 1, ch. 88-16; ss. 21, 52, ch. 90-339; s. 4, ch. 91-429.
"

So this is saying they have to post it in order to do it but does not address if refusing to pay the tip is the same as not paying the bill itself or if its the same as simple not tipping.

Is there such a thing as a mandatory tip?

If someone does not tip at a normal restaurant, it might make them a jerk but its not illegal.

Are automatic tips considered a tip or a bill? I honestly have no idea. I was hoping there might be caselaw on this or some generally accepted principals or standards.

 

[amazontabletfire]

WERE you notified BOTH on the menu and on the bill that a tip was automatically added? If not notified on both, the restaurant violated the law.

My issue is not with them adding the tip to the bill but rather with my ability to not pay that tip if I feel there is horrible service.

Also, where I'm from we have like a restaurant week( like in N.Y.) which they give you a special menu with specials on it along with the normal menu.

I did not see it printed on the special menu which is what we used but I did not even check the main menu. It may have been printed in the main menu.

Thanks.

 

[cbg]

Okay, since you appear to need to have it spelled out for you:

In your state - If you are given the proper notice required by the state, you must pay it, If you are not given the proper notice required by the state, you need not pay it.

What happened or might happen in other states has no bearing on what you must do in Florida. NY law is not binding on FL.

 

[amazontabletfire]

It's not illegal or improper to add the automatic tip so long as the restaurant has given you proper notice of it, which in your state means that the restaurant tells you of the fee on the menu and on the bill you are given at the end of the meal. That one incident with the African-American customer was not about adding tips automatically in general. It was rather that it was only added for him because of his race. Only adding the automatic tip for Black customers but not for White customers is illegal discrimination based on race. Nothing you've said here suggests something like that is at work in your situation.

The black customer had the tip added because the restaurant owner said that black people never tip.

I had a friend who worked as a waitress who told me she worked a table with like 6 black guys and they only gave her like .25 cents tip. I was very upset to hear this.

HOWEVER, my issue is not if they are allowed to add the tip rather is on my ability NOT to pay the tip if the service was horrible.

According to this news report " The automatic gratuity...is a convenience for our guests and a common practice at restaurants though Manhattan....Our guests always have the option of adding to, reducing or completely deducting the automatic gratuity before paying their check" . :


So again, my issue is not about adding the tip to the bill but rather if I have the option to reduce it or remove it if service is very bad.

 

[cbg]

You are not in NY. NY law is of no more meaning to you than the laws of Japan or Norway. ONLY FL law has any meaning for you.

 

[PayrollHRGuy]

I did not really have any place to go afterwards, but still absurd amount of time to wait. The dishes were also dirty, and the food tasted like left over garbage. Probably my worst restaurant experience in the past 15 years but the real question is the legality of the paying the automatic tip.

This should trigger a bad Yelp review. Not an illegal act or a lawsuit.

 

[quincy]

My issue is not with them adding the tip to the bill but rather with my ability to not pay that tip if I feel there is horrible service.

Also, where I'm from we have like a restaurant week( like in N.Y.) which they give you a special menu with specials on it along with the normal menu.

I did not see it printed on the special menu which is what we used but I did not even check the main menu. It may have been printed in the main menu.

Thanks.

If there was not proper notice of an automatic gratuity given you, the restaurant violated the law. Report the violation to the police and to the restaurant owner.

If there WAS notice of an automatic gratuity given you, you agreed to pay this automatic gratuity by staying in the restaurant and ordering a meal which you knew in advance would have an automatic gratuity added.

If you did not like the service and did not think a tip was deserved, you complain about the service, and having to pay the tip, afterwards.

In many restaurants, each tip will be split among several different restaurant workers (allowing these workers to make above minimum wage).

This really should not be too difficult to understand.

 

[Taxing Matters]

So again, my issue is not about adding the tip to the bill but rather if I have the option to reduce it or remove it if service is very bad.

When the restaurant properly notifies you on the menu and the bill that the automatic tip is added you don't have a choice not to pay it. That "tip" is part of your charge for the meal. You knew that was the case if you read the menu at the start and could have got up and walked out then if you didn't want to have that fee added to your bill. You of course need not provide any additional voluntary tip.

And if no automatic gratuity is added, then how much, if any, tip to give is totally up to you.

Now that you know how it works you can prepared for next time. Look at the menus going forward to see if it says an automatic tip will be added and under what circumstances (e.g. is it added to all bills, just for large parties, etc). If you'll be subject to an automatic tip and don't like that, then leave before you order anything and go someplace else. If you stay and order the food anyway and then don't like the service, you won't have the option to reject the automatic tip based on that poor dining experience. The fee will be part of the bill you agreed to pay when you ordered the food.

 

[quincy]

Gratuities that are automatically included on a bill generally are only 15% of the cost of the meal. Restaurant patrons generally will reward good service with tips of 20% or above. By not adding anything additional to an automatic tip, it could show your displeasure with the meal or the service.

It can be helpful to remember that the speed with which you receive your meal is not dependent on your server alone. Backups or mixups in the kitchen affects the speed of service.

The best way to deal with bad service or bad food in a restaurant is to never go to that restaurant again. A lawsuit is probably the worst way.