Proving Parental Alienation

[Buds Gurl]

You're far from the first parent whose ex has badmouthed them to the child/ren. It's more important to teach the child coping skills and "show the lie" by doing the exact opposite of what the ex claims you do. Without badmouthing the ex back. Really. It's not that hard.

ETA, now that I see the original post is back. Your responses were fine. You counteract her words by showing him that you do love him and always have his best interests in mind. You don't tell him that she kept him away from you, you "had" to take her to court (yeah - that's how it works when you're not married), etc. You tell him that it's okay to love both you and Mommy, and it's not his job to make either of you happy. You don't badmouth Mom in any way/place that he could hear it (i.e. not in front of the other kids, either - he *will* hear about it), etc.

Thank you, yes that's what I thought "show the lie by being the opposite of what she says about me". To reiterate - I do not talk negatively about his mother, it's all coming from her. Besides having to take her to court in order to be in my son's life, and once again a year later when she tried to withhold visitations, I consistently choose not to rock the boat, try not to engage her when she decides to be difficult and concentrate on raising my son, ride it out until she cools off again. I'm hoping that happens again this time, we'll see. I'm just very concerned about what she's been saying to our son.

 

[Buds Gurl]

You do not need to "get the judge to consider" what she is doing. It is something that judge has heard over and over and over if they've been in family court very long. They won't be unfamiliar with it, or have to see it proven yet again. That's why you should avoid the "parent alienation" term, though that is of course exactly what it sounds like she is doing. But it was used, overused, tried out to garner sympathy and make the user sound psychology-hep since its inception sometime in the 90's and it went out of style very quickly. It creates a slight gag response in everyone who hears it by now.

What I'd suggest, other than fully exercising your visitation to the letter, communicating with your ex only through the parenting message websites so you can't be sucked into any kind of fighting or arguing in front of the child, is that you maybe, in your time, have the child talk with a counselor to help him deal with his feelings and emotions, help him deal with his mother, who sounds like a tough person to be spending all his time with, someone who is manipulative and may have addiction issues. And if you are a recovering alcoholic, with issues of your own, you might profit from working through your issues too. As in, "See, son, this is what grown ups do, they talk to counselors and get help for when they feel angry and sad."

This will also look great to the courts and lay you some groundwork for if the situation changes, if you have reason to do so in the future, you may, at some point, need to take her back to court due to some change in circumstances and go for more or full custody. You need to always, to your son and the courts eventually portray yourself as the 'better man' the one of the parents who makes it a practice to be the adult, to follow the law, to not give in to hating and trashing the other parent, especially not in the presence or hearing of your child. It is better to make a complete liar out of her than to win the arguments.

I agree, I'm sure they hear it all the time. It's so frustrating because only my son knows that in this case it's absolutely true. And neither me or anyone in my family speaks bad about his mom in his presence, has been a rule from day one - (when he's not here is a different story ;-).

 

[stealth2]

when he's not here is a different story ;-).

You DO realize that the other children in your family may repeat what they hear, yes?

 

[Buds Gurl]

You DO realize that the other children in your family may repeat what they hear, yes?

Absolutely. It's not a habit of ours to have adult conversations in front of the children. Just trying to keep it real here.

 

[not2cleverRed]

I'm not "blathering," just stating facts. I'm using the 'alienation' term because that's what it's called. I realize that you don't know me, you don't know if I'm telling the truth or badmouthing my ex. All I can give you is my word which obviously means nothing to you because, like I said, you do not know me. I was shocked when my son told me this, I am sick for my son to have to listen to this but I'm also sick that I have to tip toe around it because for some reason in family court stating facts can sometimes make you look like the bad guy so this puts me in a damned if you do, damned if you don't situation.

Avoid the phrase "parental alienation" in court. Or anywhere, period.

Since your ex thinks she's entitled and in the right, she will likely show her true self without you doing anything to help.

 

[stealth2]

Absolutely. It's not a habit of ours to have adult conversations in front of the children. Just trying to keep it real here.

I know. However... kids hear the darndest things, even when you think they're nowhere near.

 

[Buds Gurl]

And now this...….Gave my son a nice little hair trim this weekend - not too short, just trimmed and evened out the scraggles - and dropped him off to school Monday looking like a nice, clean cut little boy. Monday afternoon she sends me a pic of him looking ragged (though not as ragged as when she drops him off, completely obvious that she had roughed up his hair for the picture) with an angry text that I am NOT to EVER cut his hair again without her permission as I do NOT have the right to decide his hair style....okay...not so sure about that. I believe that I have the right to do as I wish during my custodial time. I could see if I was shaving his head or giving him a mohawk or something but a trim?
Now the latest yesterday - I get a text saying that my son told her that I have a gun and that I let him touch it and hold it. 100% FALSE, but of course in her mind he had no reason to tell her that out of the blue if it's not true...
Also, I know that nobody likes to hear about alienation attempts but my son had a project at school to personalize his file holder and I was surprised when she texted asking for pics to add to the project. I had my son pic out a few pictures - him catching a fish, him with his half siblings - but she apparently asked just to have it in writing because none of the pics from my house made it onto the project. Just pics of her side of the family, even her most recent boyfriend (not quite 6 months) and his kids made it onto the project.
It is becoming more clear every day that she is trying to think of any and every angle to get our son away from me. I've been waiting to see if she's bluffing and just trying to harass and intimidate me into giving her her way but now I'm wondering if it would better for me to file first but then I have no idea to what lengths she will go.

 

[stealth2]

now I'm wondering if it would better for me to file first

File what?

 

[Buds Gurl]

A request for order to formally modify the custody agreement to reflect the schedule that we have been keeping for the last three years and to define the Joint Legal Custody to stipulate that she cannot keep me from being involved in our sons schooling, etc.
You see, our initial court order has a visitation agreement much different that what we have done. About 18 months ago we went to mediation and agreed to keep visitation to what we'd been doing, which has been basically 50/50 time for over three years now. This was never put into a new court order, just in the mediation notes. The only paperwork we both received was a statement that we had reached an agreement and that text messages showing agreement were valid. Since school started she's been demanding to go back to the initial court order and has been threatening to take me to court to lessen visitation and get sole legal custody.

 

[bcr229]

A request for order to formally modify the custody agreement to reflect the schedule that we have been keeping for the last three years and to define the Joint Legal Custody to stipulate that she cannot keep me from being involved in our sons schooling, etc.
You see, our initial court order has a visitation agreement much different that what we have done. About 18 months ago we went to mediation and agreed to keep visitation to what we'd been doing, which has been basically 50/50 time for over three years now. This was never put into a new court order, just in the mediation notes. The only paperwork we both received was a statement that we had reached an agreement and that text messages showing agreement were valid. Since school started she's been demanding to go back to the initial court order and has been threatening to take me to court to lessen visitation and get sole legal custody.

Yes, I would go back to court and have the status quo 50-50 visitation put into the court order since it isn't there now.

 

[commentator]

Got an attorney? Got your son in counseling? Do those two things. DO NOT rush off half ready, you will not get a whole lot of shots at this. Do it right the first time.

The attorney you hire will counsel you about what to say and not say, and we cannot stress enough that you need to avoid the pitty patty little whiney games of he said/she said, and "He's saying bad things about me, he's obviously a narcissist !" And "she's attempting to use parent-alienation to take my child from me" are not going to impress from either party.

 

[Buds Gurl]

Got an attorney? Got your son in counseling? Do those two things. DO NOT rush off half ready, you will not get a whole lot of shots at this. Do it right the first time.

The attorney you hire will counsel you about what to say and not say, and we cannot stress enough that you need to avoid the pitty patty little whiney games of he said/she said, and "He's saying bad things about me, he's obviously a narcissist !" And "she's attempting to use parent-alienation to take my child from me" are not going to impress from either party.

Sound advice. Thank you.