How to deal with this housemate situation

[cipher20]

What is the name of your state? California

I live in a 3 bedroom house and share the house with 2 other people. In early 2019, 1 of them moved out. At that time the 3rd housemate asked if his girlfriend could take the now empty room.To be helpful , I agreed to it. They are getting married. My assumption always was they would get their own place when things get serious or after marriage etc. However , few months back I realized they plan to continue living in the house even after marriage. I let them know at the time that I would not be comfortable living with a married couple and asked them to start looking for a different place. They have decided not to move out until they want to and will soon be getting married. What legal options do I have to deal with this. The GF was never added to the lease of the house. Me and that roommate and 1 other former housemate (who does not live in the house ) are on the lease. Does this allow me to ask that the GF no longer live in the house. I suppose I cannot ask someone who is on the lease to leave. Even if they say they would add the GF to the lease, they would need my permission as well to change the lease, I think.

 

[eerelations]

The GF is a tenant of the LL now, whether or not she's on the lease. And only the LL can make the GF leave.

 

[cipher20]

eerelations - Thank you for the response. To clarify, the LL was not involved during this change of housemates / occupancy nor are the property managers who we actually interact with. The decision was made just among us housemates. The property managers nor the LL ever visit the property. Our rent payments are done online. As of now the other housemate who is on the lease pays it in full and I transfer my share to him. The property managers only created accounts for people who are on the lease, on this online portal.The only time property managers visit during an annual inspection mostly. As far as I can tell, the property managers / LL think the only people living in the house are the 3 people on the lease. As mentioned in my post the 3rd person on the lease whose room the GF took, is a former housemate and we had a couple of people occupy that room in between before the GF moved in, but we never updated the lease with any of the new occupants.

 

[bcr229]

What does your lease say about subletting?

 

[cipher20]

Our lease requires that we inform the the LL / property manager about house mate changes and they need to be approved by the property manager / LL. I will be honest here that our lease also enforces a lease change fee of $500 and so every change of house mate would have cost $500, which is why we did not update the property manager / LL about the new tenants.

 

[eerelations]

eerelations - Thank you for the response. To clarify, the LL was not involved during this change of housemates / occupancy nor are the property managers who we actually interact with. The decision was made just among us housemates. The property managers nor the LL ever visit the property. Our rent payments are done online. As of now the other housemate who is on the lease pays it in full and I transfer my share to him. The property managers only created accounts for people who are on the lease, on this online portal.The only time property managers visit during an annual inspection mostly. As far as I can tell, the property managers / LL think the only people living in the house are the 3 people on the lease. As mentioned in my post the 3rd person on the lease whose room the GF took, is a former housemate and we had a couple of people occupy that room in between before the GF moved in, but we never updated the lease with any of the new occupants.

As I said before, the GF is a legal tenant now, whether or not she's on the lease - and whether or not the LL/Property Manager know about her living there. Because she's a tenant, the only person who has any control over whether or not she lives there are her, the LL, and possibly also the Property Manager. You have no say in this.

Quick questions (not that the answers would change the situation, I'm just curious):

1. What did the couple say when you asked them (before GF moved in) what their intentions were about where they were going to live after they got married?

2. Why are you uncomfortable with them now that they're married? You were fine as long as they weren't married - what's changed?

 

[cipher20]

1. What did the couple say when you asked them (before GF moved in) what their intentions were about where they were going to live after they got married?

I never asked this specifically. And I realize that is my mistake. I should have clarified some of these things before I agree to let the GF take the room. It was just my assumption that no seriously committed / married couple would continue to live in a shared house. I just asked him, what his / their general plan was and he simply replied he has no idea.

2. Why are you uncomfortable with them now that they're married? You were fine as long as they weren't married - what's changed?

On one hand I would never want to be living with a couple ever. When I agreed to this , I was just trying to be nice to my housemate (the BF) . Again, admittedly , I assumed and if they get serious about each other they would get their own place.

About what makes me uncomfortable. I never wanted to live with another couple on a long term indefinite basis and I should have made sure the housemate was on the same page before agreeing let the GF occupy the room .

But then , there are some minor things where they re-arrange / buy more things that they keep in the common space , without talking to me about it. I understand these are part and parcel of sharing a house , and have ignored it. Recently I was confronted by them about use of refrigerator space as if I was infringing on their share of space and insinuated that I need talk to them before doing anything in the refrigerator. They quickly realized that they were in the wrong , since I accounted for all the space I was using and also let them know that I don't need any of their permissions to use space which is fairly mine. They have sine come to realize that they did not handle that situation correctly. Nothing like this had ever happened when there were 3 single people living in the house and I would not want such situations to keep occuring.

 

[eerelations]

I never asked this specifically. And I realize that is my mistake. I should have clarified some of these things before I agree to let the GF take the room. It was just my assumption that no seriously committed / married couple would continue to live in a shared house. I just asked him, what his / their general plan was and he simply replied he has no idea.


On one hand I would never want to be living with a couple ever. When I agreed to this , I was just trying to be nice to my housemate (the BF) . Again, admittedly , I assumed and if they get serious about each other they would get their own place.

About what makes me uncomfortable. I never wanted to live with another couple on a long term indefinite basis and I should have made sure the housemate was on the same page before agreeing let the GF occupy the room .

But then , there are some minor things where they re-arrange / buy more things that they keep in the common space , without talking to me about it. I understand these are part and parcel of sharing a house , and have ignored it. Recently I was confronted by them about use of refrigerator space as if I was infringing on their share of space and insinuated that I need talk to them before doing anything in the refrigerator. They quickly realized that they were in the wrong , since I accounted for all the space I was using and also let them know that I don't need any of their permissions to use space which is fairly mine. They have sine come to realize that they did not handle that situation correctly. Nothing like this had ever happened when there were 3 single people living in the house and I would not want such situations to keep occuring.

OK. I hope you understand that no space in this house belongs to solely to you. All of your room is yours, and one third of the rest of the house (including the fridge) is yours. But that's it.

About whether or not you can make one or both of them leave: you cannot. Only the LL and his/her agents can do this.

 

[adjusterjack]

Nothing like this had ever happened when there were 3 single people living in the house and I would not want such situations to keep occuring.

Well, they are likely to. This is why housemate/roommate arrangement can turn into nightmares.

I'm betting that they like the place enough and can afford it on their own and wouldn't care if you moved out, which may be your solution when the lease expires.

You're stuck with what you got yourself into when you allowed the GF in and concealed her presence from management.

You are welcome to report her unauthorized presence to the property manager and see what happens.

 

[Gail in Georgia]

"Our lease requires that we inform the the LL / property manager about house mate changes and they need to be approved by the property manager / LL. I will be honest here that our lease also enforces a lease change fee of $500 and so every change of house mate would have cost $500, which is why we did not update the property manager / LL about the new tenants."



You are welcome to report her unauthorized presence to the property manager and see what happens.


Which may mean management boots all your rear ends out for breach of lease and you all end up with an eviction on your credit record.

Gail

 

[cipher20]

Hi All,
Thank you for the responses. I am afraid that bringing this to the LL / property manager might make the situation difficult for me as well. Yes they like the house enough and don't plan to move out until they buy a house . I do not plan to move out right now either as this house is great for me in every which way. If more confrontational situation happen , I will deal with them, though would prefer not to have to. It is not really a problematic situation for me as of now and I guess it will just be a waiting game until 1 of us is in a situation that requires moving out.


There is another clause in our lease which says that any person not on the lease and staying for more than 15 days also needs approval.

Logically speaking ; can't it be argued that , without her being on the lease and without her making any direct payments to the LL; she is merely a guest in this house. It is not my concern as to what they do rent-wise among them. And so if I am not OK with any particular guest , I have the right to deny them entry into the house, being 1 of the lessee . I might sound like jerk , but I am just trying know my options if things keep getting worse for me. Can I try to deal with it at local police level by filing a complain of trespassing or something against her if I have to, or at least threaten to do so?
Will the police just ask me to deal with the LL directly ?

OK. I hope you understand that no space in this house belongs to solely to you. All of your room is yours, and one third of the rest of the house (including the fridge) is yours. But that's it.

Yes I completely understand that and I am personally mindful of not using more than my fair share. The case with the refrigerator incident , they should have inspected the fridge closely before confronting me. And in general I expect that they are courteous to ask before they move around things in the common spaces, just I would. None of the things have been a major incident and so I have just ignored such incidents.

 

[Gail in Georgia]

Listen; make a fuss on this and the landlord/property manager will become aware of what you have done and will either likely kick all of you out on your rear ends or make you pay the $500 you so cheaply attempted to avoid.

What's the easiest way to work this out? It would seem to be that all three of you live together in a somewhat peaceful existence until these two decide to buy a house together and move out.

Gail

 

[FarmerJ]

You didn't tell us if that roommate you permitted to move in pays you or the landlord. If that roommate pays the two remaining roommates and the two of you pay the landlord then you created a sublet where you and your roommate that are on the lease became landlords and you are the ones who can easily write a move out notice to your sublet tenant. If that roommate has been making her rental payments to the LL then you could have some room to argue that the LL cant fairly make the two of you pay that 500.00 fee because the LL created a new rental relationship outside of your current lease. Yes its possible the LL will take actions against those of you on the written lease for violating the lease by subletting but its just as likely the LL may choose to not help you get her out either. IN California if a tenant has been in one place more than a year they are entitled to a 60 day notice regarding changes and that includes notices to vacate , if they have been in a tenancy less than one year its a 30 day notice.

 

[eerelations]

Logically speaking ; can't it be argued that , without her being on the lease and without her making any direct payments to the LL; she is merely a guest in this house. It is not my concern as to what they do rent-wise among them. And so if I am not OK with any particular guest , I have the right to deny them entry into the house, being 1 of the lessee . I might sound like jerk , but I am just trying know my options if things keep getting worse for me. Can I try to deal with it at local police level by filing a complain of trespassing or something against her if I have to, or at least threaten to do so?
Will the police just ask me to deal with the LL directly ?

Legally she is a tenant. She pays rent (whether directly or indirectly, this is moot) and this is what makes her a legal tenant. Because she is legally a tenant, the only entity that the police will accept such a complaint from is either the LL or his/her agent. There is nothing you can do about her without involving the LL. Period.

I'm surprised at how this has evolved. First she was just another person living in the house, and now, within just a few hours, she's become the she-devil roommate from hell. How did this happen?

 

[Gail in Georgia]

" I'm surprised at how this has evolved. First she was just another person living in the house, and now, within just a few hours, she's become the she-devil roommate from hell. How did this happen?"

All this nonsense over space in the refrigerator.

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