accidental fire?

[Frodoo]

I think you are grasping at straws. Now matter which way you slice it, this "neighbor" needs to be compensated. He was/is completely INNOCENT in this whole ordeal. The "neighbor" should not have to sit around and wait to be compensated while you are running around exploring all of your options to get out of paying.

Did the town fire department KNOW FOR FACT that there was no water pressure or were they just as surprised as you were?

If you feel that you have a legal leg to stand on with the town, then pay the neighbor, and then make your own claim against the town/city for reimbursement!

In the end...I don't think you have much of a case.

The neighbor was paid already by their own home owners insurance. The neighbor’s home owner’s insurance company is requesting the re-payment of the claim by me personally. The repairs are underway.

At the time the fire occurred the state of Virginia was in a draught emergency, and a band on camp fires was in effect.

The Fire Department was just as surprised there was no water. Public Works KNEW for a Fact.

If what you’re saying is true and I have no case, could you answer me this.

You visit grandmas for the holidays, and it cold so decide you to light a fire in the fireplace while she is out looking more cat food at the store. She’s stuck in traffic. When she comes back, the neighbor’s house is ashes. A draft sent a spark up the chimney. Grandma’s insurance company says “Well grandma, you’re not liable you we not even there.” Do you now owe the neighbor a new house?

 

[moburkes]

The neighbor was paid already by their own home owners insurance. The neighbor’s home owner’s insurance company is requesting the re-payment of the claim by me personally. The repairs are underway.

At the time the fire occurred the state of Virginia was in a draught emergency, and a band on camp fires was in effect.

The Fire Department was just as surprised there was no water. Public Works KNEW for a Fact.

If what you’re saying is true and I have no case, could you answer me this.

You visit grandmas for the holidays, and it cold so decide you to light a fire in the fireplace while she is out looking more cat food at the store. She’s stuck in traffic. When she comes back, the neighbor’s house is ashes. A draft sent a spark up the chimney. Grandma’s insurance company says “Well grandma, you’re not liable you we not even there.” Do you now owe the neighbor a new house?

Then sue your family member's insurance company. Better yet, ask your family member for a copy of the policy. Read it. Then sue them based on breach of contract.

The neighbor has no responsibility to repair damage to his/her home, that s/he did not cause. It was entirely within the rights of that insurance company to ask you to pay for damages due to your negligence. Since there was draught emergency, why did you start a fire? Next time don't be so helpful.

 

[Frodoo]

contact your homeowners immediately. They will hire an attorney to defend anything that may come up (i.e. including the lack of water). What you do not want is a denial of coverage because you did not put the carrier on notice in time.

That's exactly the problem. I was a just vacationing guest, in a relative’s home. I have no coverage. I was just cleaning up the yard when a misfortunate accident took place. My relative’s insurance company denied payment, because the relative was not present, therefore not liable. Is that how home owners insurance works?

 

[moburkes]

That's exactly the problem. I was a just vacationing guest, in a relative_s home. I have no coverage. I was just cleaning up the yard when a misfortunate accident took place. My relative_s insurance company denied payment, because the relative was not present, therefore not liable. Is that how home owners insurance works?

2 Things:
1. Read your family member's insurance policy. Potentially, they are not required to provide coverage due the someone else's negligence. I'm sure that will be the case when you read the policy. They are paid to provide coverage for the negligence of the policy holder.
2. File the claim with your insurance company or pay for it yourself. Are you saying that you don't have homeowner's insurance, nor do you have renter's insurance? Where do you live? In a house, apartment, what?

 

[Frodoo]

2 Things:
1. Read your family member's insurance policy. Potentially, they are not required to provide coverage due the someone else's negligence. I'm sure that will be the case when you read the policy. They are paid to provide coverage for the negligence of the policy holder.
2. File the claim with your insurance company or pay for it yourself. Are you saying that you don't have homeowner's insurance, nor do you have renter's insurance? Where do you live? In a house, apartment, what?

1. ) Maybe true. Why is a accident, negligence? it was a spark in the wind, we had a permit.
2. ) Live with my parents, 20 years old Didn't have a policy in force where I live. Regardless how would that have protected me spending the weekend some where else?

 

[moburkes]

1. ) Maybe true. Why is a accident, negligence? it was a spark in the wind, we had a permit.
2. ) Live with my parents, 20 years old Didn't have a policy in force where I live. Regardless how would that have protected me spending the weekend some where else?

Maybe it will make more sense if I give you an auto insurance example. 1. You are driving down the street, and you ACCIDENTALLY hit another vehicle. Your insurance will cover you for the damage that you have caused. 2. You are driving down the street, and you PURPOSELY hit another vehicle. Your insurance will NOT cover you for the damage that you have caused.

The spark was accidental. But if you had never started a fire in the first place, there would have been no spark.

Now you know what renters insurance is for. If you are covered under your parent's homeowners policy, which you may not be, as you are an adult (are you renting from them?), then file the claim with their insurance company.

 

[weenor]

I would imagine that the family member's insurer denied coverage because it does not consider you a named insured under the policy. However, if other policy language is broad enough, there still may be coverage. Same with your parents' home owners. Look into both.

 

[Frodoo]

Maybe it will make more sense if I give you an auto insurance example. 1. You are driving down the street, and you ACCIDENTALLY hit another vehicle. Your insurance will cover you for the damage that you have caused. 2. You are driving down the street, and you PURPOSELY hit another vehicle. Your insurance will NOT cover you for the damage that you have caused.

The spark was accidental. But if you had never started a fire in the first place, there would have been no spark.

Now you know what renters insurance is for. If you are covered under your parent's homeowners policy, which you may not be, as you are an adult (are you renting from them?), then file the claim with their insurance company.

1. I’m living with my Dad. He rent’s and didn’t have any policy enforce for renter’s protection at his apartment.
2. My uncle had home owners on the vacation house; they refused to pay the claim. How can I make an appeal to his insurance company?
3. I still don’t understand why I’m negligent. When the fire started to spread, we couldn’t put it out, there was no water.

 

[moburkes]

1. I’m living with my Dad. He rent’s and didn’t have any policy enforce for renter’s protection at his apartment.
2. My uncle had home owners on the vacation house; they refused to pay the claim. How can I make an appeal to his insurance company?
3. I still don’t understand why I’m negligent. When the fire started to spread, we couldn’t put it out, there was no water.

1. Unfortunately for you, then you will have to pay the claim.
2. They probably won't pay since the policy only covers the named insured. Read the policy if you are unsure.
3. Then sue the city.

 

[Frodoo]

1. Unfortunately for you, then you will have to pay the claim.
2. They probably won't pay since the policy only covers the named insured. Read the policy if you are unsure.
3. Then sue the city.

3. ) OK now how do start going about suing a city? Where do I start?

 

[moburkes]

3. ) OK now how do start going about suing a city? Where do I start?

Okay, I'm an insurance agent, not a lawyer. Maybe you should get a lawyer to take on such a HUGE endeavor.

 

[weenor]

You need a lawyer any suit against the city or any other third party- i.e. fire department would be an indemnity action that may or may not be permitted under state law. In addition any governmental entity enjoys a certain amount of immunity for its actions...Getting the picture?

 

[badapple40]

You need to lawyer up on this.

The people that say you have to pay are giving you a gut reaction on what they feel is right, not what the law is. Don't listen to them. Shell is especially notorious for this.

The homeowner's insurance company is bringing a subrogation against you. You need a lawyer.

They will have to prove that you breached a duty -- namely that of reasonable care. I am not aware that open burning is viewed as an ultrahazardous activity, and as such, there is no strict liability.

Furthermore, you complied with all permits. Therefore, they will have to show that the manner in which you conducted the burning was negligent or that you did not take steps that a reasonable person would take to minimize risks -- e.g. you placed the fire too close to the neighbor's home, etc.

If you placed the fire a reasonable distance away, took proper pracautions to prevent the fire from spreading, but it did so anyways, then they will have a hard sell.

Not all harm/damage is compensable, as much as people think it should be. Absent their showing that what you did was unreasonable (or that you could have taken simple, additional steps to prevent the fire but did not), they will not recover. This is a very fact based analysis.

To prove negligence, they will have to show that you a legal duty to do something (e.g. a duty to act reasonably), that you breached that duty, that the breach caused you harm, and that you were somehow damaged by the breach.

A fire, in an of itself, doesn't cut it. But, if your reasonable precautions were to have a hose out, etc, to suppress fires, and when you tried to use it, discovered that there was no water, then that might well be an issue for the City. Comparative fault issues seem present with respect to the city. There are, however, potential issues of immunity.

My point should be clear: there are complicated issues that an attorney will have to deal with. You need to hire one or have your insurance company do so. As another poster mentioned, not providing notice can bar you from coverage under prompt notice requirements typically present in insurance contracts.