CO Missreading

[sixstringdad]

What is the name of your state? VA

I have a little problem concerning my visitation with my daughter. I am a NCP with a common visitation agreement. The CO states that I have my daughter for Christmas as following; 3:00p.m. on DEC 25 to 3:00p.m. DEC 28. CP, however is saying that it's every other year that I get that visitation. I can't see what I'm missing from CO that says e/o year for Christmas visitation. So please read this and tell me what you think.Anyone.This is what the CO says word for word dealing with holiday visitation.

The parties agree to share the following holidays in the following manner:
A. The father shall have the child for 1/2 the summer beginning in 03.
B. Thanksgiving, July 4th, Easter and the childs birthday shall be alternated each year with the father having the child in even numbered years.
C. The father shall have the child for the Christmas holiday for the period of time he is off of work not to exceed 4 days after giving mother reasonable notice of his time off over the holiday.

CP made a motion to reconsider and that Consent Order states:

Christmas visitation shall be from 3:00 Dec 25 to 3:00 Dec 28, I made them put a time frame on it to avoid hassle and confusion....lol

I gave CP notice today and she wouldn't sign it for me saying I don't have her this Christmas. Any advice on how I can avoid missing my daughter over the Christmas Holiday. I know what to do after the fact if she doesn't comply. Thanks for any reply.

 

[ellencee]

sixstringdad
Unless I am misreading or misunderstanding the order, you no longer need to notify the mother when you will pick up your daughter for visitation. The court has done that for you--you pick up your daughter at 3PM on December 25 and you return your daughter at 3PM on December 28th, end of story.

Now is the time to do something so that the negative effects to the child will be lessened (I am speaking of mom's anger or your anger affecting the child).

You can 'have' an attorney review the order(s) and send the mother a letter that states the terms of the order and stating that you will pick up the child at 3PM on Dec. 25 and return her on Dec. 28 at 3PM and if the mother fails to have the child available for the visitation, then you have the right to seek remedy through the court (contempt of order).

Maybe the mother does not understand that by modifying the order to specifically state the dates and times for visitation, you are no longer required to provide her with notice and she has no option but to have the child ready.

Best wishes,
EC

 

[FJ1200guy]

I hate.. and I mean it, HATE... to tell you this, but in VA, as in most of the country, there is no visitation enforcement agency (but if you don't pay cs, you can bet they'll be right on your butt), and no effective penalties for interference of visitation... no matter what anyone tells you. If you don't pay CS, they can do all kinds of things to you, like take your liscense, garnish your checks, take your tax refunds... take your balls into custody. You name it.
What do they do if a female interferes with visitation? I quote one of my favorite posters in here: "PHHHHHHHHT"

If she doesn't let you take your daughter, you will have to file a Petition for a Rule to Show Cause. Then the mom will have to show justification for her actions, and then a judge can THEORETICALLY fine, imprison, or otherwise "sanction" her. This is not a quick process.

Tell ya what. In my opinion, you'd be best serving the daughter by letting her be with Mom this christmas, but still file all the court stuff you want to for future potential issues along these same lines. That way her behaviour is at least documented, if not corrected.

What, bottom line, is best for you daughter?

Hey, Good Luck. I hope someone else has some better info for you... Lyle

edit: hey, I was kidding about them taking your balls....

 

[stealth2]

I disagree on letting it slide this Christmas. Ellencee had the best suggestion - have an attorney review your order (just to be sure you haven't missed something), and then have him/her send her a letter stating that you intend to exercise your visitation rights for the Christmas period as stated, and that a refusal to have the child available will leave you with no option but to seek a legal remedy.

I'm on the flip side of the situation. We alternate Christmas, with one parent getting up to the 26th and the other 'til the 1st. I just found out that my ex has unilaterally decided he's taking a few extra days this year.

 

[kat1963]

Send her a letter of intent immediately, via certified mail, here is an outline, modify to your own situation:
http://www.deltabravo.net/custody/intent.htm
Police in VA aren't going to help enforce a visitation transfer unless precisely worded for them to execute the order by the courts. However, you can *try* to get them to go with you to *keep the peace* and therefore enable you to get a report (if nothing else then to document you were there). Depending on the officer, he/she might talk to her..but again, don't count on it. Whatever you do, do NOT make a scene (but you know that). In addition, VA is a one party state so you are free to tape the entire situation (including phone calls) as additional documentation for court.
Should she refuse, you send her a denial letter example:
http://www.deltabravo.net/custody/missed-visit.htm
Since this is also being mailed to the courts, don't be surprised if the judge calls you all back in. I've seen it 3 times so far this year by different judges.
If she denies visitation again, file a motion to show cause/contempt. You can obtain the forms are on line.
Interference with visitation is grounds for a modification of custody in VA. You did very good getting the exact dates & times into the order by the way!!
I hope you get to see your kids for the holidays!
KAT

 

[sixstringdad]

Thank you, KAT. That is excellent advice. I think its funny I got refered to the SPARC site in which I posted this in also...lol I should have known about those forms... Thanks alot, your always a big help.

 

[ellencee]

The parties agree to share the following holidays in the following manner:
A. The father shall have the child for 1/2 the summer beginning in 03.
B. Thanksgiving, July 4th, Easter and the childs birthday shall be alternated each year with the father having the child in even numbered years.
C. The father shall have the child for the Christmas holiday for the period of time he is off of work not to exceed 4 days after giving mother reasonable notice of his time off over the holiday.

CP made a motion to reconsider and that Consent Order states:
Christmas visitation shall be from 3:00 Dec 25 to 3:00 Dec 28

(sorry, I left out that part when I first posted!)

From the above quoted paragraph, I infer that this is the first Christmas to be included in the above order.

Don't you think it's just a little too aggressive to involve the police, the video cameras, the courts, and start taping phone calls?

EC

 

[FJ1200guy]

I agree with you EC (!). And let's get brutally honest here... ain't no way he's going to get every Christmas. Dude, I encourage you STRONGLY to follow my first post, and here's why. We all know that it is supposed to be every other Christmas... and trust me, it will be. She'll go in for a mod, and she will get it. Doubt this at your own peril. Now if you work this out with her without involving the police (who can't do crap anyways, except help develop resentment), and writing her denial letters, it will be alot better in the long run.

Good luck! Lyle

 

[stealth2]

I completely disagree. He has an order which states "Christmas visitation shall be from 3:00 Dec 25 to 3:00 Dec 28". He is entitled to that, and he should attempt to enforce it. I wouldn't bring the cops, etc in this time, but I wouldnt' just shrug and say "okay - you can have Christmas this time." Stand up and grow some balls, man! Expect the order to be followed and if it isn't - file against her for contempt!

 

[haiku]

I don't see anything weird or wrong about it.

Mom is getting every christmas eve and morning. SHE is getting the better deal every year anyway-she gets the christmas morning wake up! the OP's visits do not start christmas day until 3 pm. and he returns them the 28th, so she gets the hew year holiday.

this is almost exactly what my family does. we exchange around 4 or 5,only some years we may get them the day after christmas and then no matter what they spend the rest of the vacation with us.

the legal agreement is, they are supposed to alternate christmas eve and christmas day, with the change starting at 11:00 but we all decided that at least while the kids were young, one place for santa was better, and no one would have to rush through christmas morning to get to the others house. (we have a little one of our own)

I have to agree, using police and video, and taping, is not going to make christmas merry for the kids.

write an official letter and then if the kids are not there fo rchristmas file t enforce the order. Its simple, and the kids never have ot be involved.

 

[sixstringdad]

my 2 cents

I agree with just about everything, everyone is saying....however I said nothing about wanting my daughter every Christmas. But you damn right I will have atleast half of Christmas EVERY year.AND I plan to have what stands now, alternated e/o year...in the near future. Its all good advice but, some are better for different situations .......right.....I didn't go into detail to save yalls eyes. My daughter is 2 1/2. This order was in place when she was 9 months. I had to do everything in court to see my girl from dna to joint custody. They wouldn't let me start the CS.....lol thats wierd..ya think. CP is bipolar,(though I can't prove it) so every now and then...she gets kinda nuts. Threatened to take me to court like 8 times..but never did.And she told her dad that I called her a whore...lol....I wish I had. That went over real well with him.And other minor BS. This isn't really even about Christmas. This is about my daughter getting to spend as much time with her father as she can. Because she deserves the right to have her father in her life. I doubt I would call the cops but you better belive I'd be on her door step with a witness or 2. I think the 2 letters KAT posted are key to properly recording the whole thing incase problems start to accumilate in the future. Thats my 2 cent.