Credit for mortgage payments made by myself after wife left?

[sprocket454]

Well thanks for all the advice and comments. I do appreciate it and although I could probably argue and nitpick some of the comments there is really no point. I believe the answer to my original question is that since I have use of the house, the value of the usage cancels out the mortgage payment. I possibly could argue that for several months she actually did use the house and also stopped paying for anything house related prior to separating. I would have to prove that though, and it isn't worth the time and energy.

I should just continue with my original plan and fill out all the forms I downloaded. If she then balks at what I think is fair, we then need mediation or I need a lawyer. One of the reasons neither of us had filed yet is because for awhile we were both so poor that neither of us had the $400 filing fee. You can imagine how hard it would be for me to hire a lawyer. Maybe the initial consultation is free though???

I do have another question so I will start a new thread. Let's see how long it takes for someone to call me an idiot.

 

[TheGeekess]

Well thanks for all the advice and comments. I do appreciate it and although I could probably argue and nitpick some of the comments there is really no point. I believe the answer to my original question is that since I have use of the house, the value of the usage cancels out the mortgage payment. I possibly could argue that for several months she actually did use the house and also stopped paying for anything house related prior to separating. I would have to prove that though, and it isn't worth the time and energy.

I should just continue with my original plan and fill out all the forms I downloaded. If she then balks at what I think is fair, we then need mediation or I need a lawyer. One of the reasons neither of us had filed yet is because for awhile we were both so poor that neither of us had the $400 filing fee. You can imagine how hard it would be for me to hire a lawyer. Maybe the initial consultation is free though???

I do have another question so I will start a new thread. Let's see how long it takes for someone to call me an idiot.

Please keep all your questions about the same situation in the same thread.

 

[sprocket454]

OK, so here's the next question:

While we have been separated I consolidated our joint marital credit card and loan debt into one loan in my name only...

It would be a long story to explain how we ended up with credit card and loan debt during our marriage but suffice it to say we had many, many medical bills for all members of the family. We really had some bad luck.

So anyway, my wife separated from me and moved all her banking into a different bank in her name only. She stopped contributing to paying down any of the debt. All the debt was in both our names. There was no way I could make the payments so I had to do something fast or watch my credit get destroyed. If that happened I could kiss goodbye the chance of getting the mortgage in my name only. She doesn't want the house; it has no equity.

I did what we should have done awhile ago. I had recently moved my own accounts into a credit union in my town. They actually allowed me to consolidate about $15000 in debt into one loan UNSECURED. This paid off the credit cards and a line of credit but now the loan is in MY NAME ONLY. My payment is about $400 per month.

So the obvious question: Is she off the hook for any portion of this marital debt? Did that marital debt cease to exist once I paid it off by taking out a new loan in my name only? If she is responsible for a portion of it, how would the court order her to pay it? She makes about 2/3 what I make in income.

Thanks for any help!

 

[not2cleverRed]

Until either of you file, marital debts/assets are marital debt/assets, with a few exceptions. (Premarital assets remain personal assets until mixed with marital assets, for example.)

If it was debt acquired during the marriage, you refinancing it into your name does not change it from being marital debt, because neither of you have filed any papers. Manage as best you can, keep track of what you've been paying (and she hasn't), because although she won't pay you back, it's worth having these numbers when negotiating, to offset her complaints. (She will have complaints. If she thought you were Mr. Wonderfully Generously Fair Man she might still be living in the marital home.)

You have to go into this with some sort of strategy. A good lawyer will advise you that you can ask for things that you might a) have not considered or b) do not care about. These are things you ask for, but are willing to compromise on in return for her dropping some of her complaints (valid or not).

I would advise you to get an initial consult. In fact, get several initial consults, if you can get them for free. One of the initial consults I had when I was divorcing was with a divorce lawyer who advertised on the cover on the Yellow Pages. Enough information passed that when I did retain a lawyer, my now ex was unable to retain him. I later found out disquieting things that indicate that not having this lawyer representing either party saved both parties money. Pay attention to not only how much per hour, but in what sort of increments. You don't want to be charged a full 15 minutes for replying to a 1 sentence text message with "Okay", for example. You should be clear that you want to economize on your legal costs - if the legal costs exceed the material value of what you might gain, then yet another motion might not be in your best interest. Other than child support, getting money out of a party unwilling to pay it is going to be a pain. However, you need to go in asking for more, otherwise you have nothing to give up when compromising.

 

[sprocket454]

Thank you!

We agree on joint custody. I'm 95% sure of that. My rough draft states that I will pay all of the marital debt including outstanding medical bills with the exception of her own medical bills. I also will pay 70% of the family medical insurance and I will carry the insurance. I also will pay the great majority all of the kids expenses. In exchange she will not ask for child support, which I don't think she can get anyway with joint custody, and we each keep our own retirement accounts. I go into great detail in my draft.

If she balks at anything, particularly my retirement, then I can't promise any of the rest. That is why it was important to clear up that she still owes her portion of the marital debt. If she balks, then I will ask her to pay her share of that and also her share of the family medical bills.

I'm hoping this affair she is having will make her more motivated to just agree with my plan and get this over with. However, her dude apparently doesn't care if she is married and obviously she doesn't either, so maybe she will just hold out forever figuring I will cave first. Of course she has no money to hire a lawyer to fight. It's still in both of our best interests to settle this quickly.

Last question: Can I make her more motivated to settle by filing papers now that would force her to take immediate responsibility for her share of the marital debt? Can the court order her to pay her percentage of the loan payment? There is now way she could pay it so maybe that would motivate her to take my proposal.

 

[justalayman]

Yes, she could get child support even though there is joint custody. Child support is based on the incomes of the parties and the relative share of time physically with each parent.


Be aware, especially given your statement of the financial conditions of each of you:

If she has primary physical custody and she seeks welfare assistance, the state can institute child support actions regardless of your agreement.

 

[LdiJ]

Thank you!

We agree on joint custody. I'm 95% sure of that. My rough draft states that I will pay all of the marital debt including outstanding medical bills with the exception of her own medical bills. I also will pay 70% of the family medical insurance and I will carry the insurance. I also will pay the great majority all of the kids expenses. In exchange she will not ask for child support, which I don't think she can get anyway with joint custody, and we each keep our own retirement accounts. I go into great detail in my draft.

If she balks at anything, particularly my retirement, then I can't promise any of the rest. That is why it was important to clear up that she still owes her portion of the marital debt. If she balks, then I will ask her to pay her share of that and also her share of the family medical bills.

I'm hoping this affair she is having will make her more motivated to just agree with my plan and get this over with. However, her dude apparently doesn't care if she is married and obviously she doesn't either, so maybe she will just hold out forever figuring I will cave first. Of course she has no money to hire a lawyer to fight. It's still in both of our best interests to settle this quickly.

Last question: Can I make her more motivated to settle by filing papers now that would force her to take immediate responsibility for her share of the marital debt? Can the court order her to pay her percentage of the loan payment? There is now way she could pay it so maybe that would motivate her to take my proposal.

If she doesn't agree a judge isn't going to order what you want.

A child support calculation will be done including both of your incomes, health insurance for the children, and daycare costs if applicable. Generally the parent with the higher income ends up paying some child support, even with a true 50/50 timeshare. You can google an online child support calculator for your state and run the numbers.

The marital debt will generally be divided 50/50, and generally any retirement accounts will be divided 50/50.

Its ticklish to attempt to push an agreement that ties matters regarding the children to matters regarding marital assets and debts. Those are two separate issues legally.

 

[ecmst12]

Even if she agrees and the judge orders it, she can change her mind and file for child support at any time. Such an agreement is completely unenforceable.

 

[sprocket454]

OK then, I will proceed strictly by the state guidelines.

I was filling out the child support guidelines worksheet for MN and it asks for the "Monthly cost of health care coverage for the joint children". I wonder how I figure out what that amount is. Here's the facts:

1) I provide the coverage through my employer

2) The coverage is family coverage that includes myself and the children. It also includes my wife but won't after the divorce and the amount will be the same whether she is included or not.

3) The coverage includes my oldest son who will be over 18 at the time of the divorce. So he is not a "joint child".

4) The net cost of that coverage is less because it is paid will pretax dollars

So do I have to subtract a certain amount for covering myself because I am included in the family coverage? Would I find out what single coverage would cost for me and then subtract that? And do I use the gross amount or the net amount? For example, the cost of the coverage is $583 per month, but the impact on my paycheck after taxes is $444 per month.

There must be more to deciding child support than what is included in this worksheet. We obviously both have medical costs and other expenses for the kids that aren't listed on this worksheet.

 

[CJane]

OK then, I will proceed strictly by the state guidelines.

I was filling out the child support guidelines worksheet for MN and it asks for the "Monthly cost of health care coverage for the joint children". I wonder how I figure out what that amount is. Here's the facts:

1) I provide the coverage through my employer

2) The coverage is family coverage that includes myself and the children. It also includes my wife but won't after the divorce and the amount will be the same whether she is included or not.

3) The coverage includes my oldest son who will be over 18 at the time of the divorce. So he is not a "joint child".

4) The net cost of that coverage is less because it is paid will pretax dollars

So do I have to subtract a certain amount for covering myself because I am included in the family coverage? Would I find out what single coverage would cost for me and then subtract that? And do I use the gross amount or the net amount? For example, the cost of the coverage is $583 per month, but the impact on my paycheck after taxes is $444 per month.

There must be more to deciding child support than what is included in this worksheet. We obviously both have medical costs and other expenses for the kids that aren't listed on this worksheet.

This is a decent standard example of how to determine the insurance costs. It's what my state uses, and I've seen it used in other states as well. It'll give you a starting point, anyway.

Total monthly premium ($583) multiplied by number of children in this proceeding (2) divided by total persons insured by premium (5) equals monthly health insurance credit to include ($233).