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DA Rejects Charges Calls "office" hearing?

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outonbail

Senior Member
Carl, you have got to be the nicest, most patient person I have ever seen online.
I second that notion.

Carl can ride the Merry-Go-Round longer than anyone I've ever seen. I started to throw up a long time ago.

Carl, have you ever worked for animal control? It would explain why your putting forth all this effort to beat a dead horse.

Or in this case,,, You're leading him to spraying water, but you can't make him think!
 


CdwJava

Senior Member
I'm a cop - and an administrator/supervisor ... I am used to circular arguments. :cool:

But, I am also patient.

- Carl
 
Exilirating

No. I want F-117 Stealth Fighters. Please. On a more serious note, I know this is all moot I'm just enjoying a little debate exercise about evidence and testimony. The DA has indicated it's going to the office hearing and I'm all for it. We're arguing past each other and I simply wanted to feel you out about the "quality" of testimony. I have failed in my attempt to communicate that the Gargoyle statement was a personal revelation that corroborated. The video system was established last year in a complaint to the neighbor's Sheriff's Dept. Every person and organization stipulates to the existence and functionality of the video surveillance system. My point was that I would be crazy to tell the responding officers a lie knowing that the whole event had been recorded and that, in fact, the event was on tape and the responding and investigating officers FAILED to obtain this most important evidence. I am fully confidant that, if this went to trial which, we agree, it won't, the judge or, ultimately, the jury would actually or effectively throw this case out. The police have no business ignoring evidence. You folks may know the law, but I know people and I've been on a jury. People can see and feel the truth. They don't ignore it because of some perceived sense of arrogance. One may and that's why there are 11 others. To straighten the arrogant and confused out. In the hypothetical, I would make it known that there is a functioning video system with camera in plain view on the front of the garage in front and the neighbor would say my video is broken. What do you think 12 common people are going to think of the neighbor? On this forum, common sense is ability non grata. If my wife knows an intimate detail of my neighbor and his son, that is they play Gargoyle video games, the quality of the testimony is higher since she had no possible way of knowing that prior to the event. 12 common people inexorably understand that. You don't. It's really been fun and I appreciate your help. I've learned how to sharpen my arguments. Thank you.
 

CdwJava

Senior Member
Johnmelissa said:
I have failed in my attempt to communicate that the Gargoyle statement was a personal revelation that corroborated.
Corroborated for you, but by itself it is legally irrelevant. That's the point. Because YOU say it's relevant or proves something is entirely beside the point. To a court it proves only that your wife makes the claim he called her a gargoyle.

The video system was established last year in a complaint to the neighbor's Sheriff's Dept. Every person and organization stipulates to the existence and functionality of the video surveillance system.
That's wonderful. But it doesn't mean that it's free and easy to access. We have gang houses in my town that miraculously are recording when they are victims, but refuse to let us review tape when they are the suspects or claim the system was no working. Amazing how that works. Bottom line is that we cannot force them to turn it over, any more than the officers in your situation could have forced him to turn it over even if he had admitted that it caught the whole thing.

The bottom line, since it's the neighbor's arrest, if he wanted to prove his case in court HE could produce the tape. Absent that it would have come down to who claimed what in court. And over a great hosing incident, the judge would likely toss the whole thing anyway.

I am fully confidant that, if this went to trial which, we agree, it won't, the judge or, ultimately, the jury would actually or effectively throw this case out.
I doubt the DA would have taken such a piddly thing to trial ... and he didn't. And a judge likely would have strongly encouraged the parties to settle. Or, the judge may just find there to have been insufficient evidence to support the allegation at trial and drop the whole thing.

The police have no business ignoring evidence.
The police cannot just seize it because you say it exists. That nasty 4th Amendment again.

In the hypothetical, I would make it known that there is a functioning video system with camera in plain view on the front of the garage in front and the neighbor would say my video is broken. What do you think 12 common people are going to think of the neighbor?
They might reasonably conclude he is lying. Or, at least feel there was sufficient reasonable doubt.

On this forum, common sense is ability non grata.
Common sense, and what you "KNOW" to be true, are not the foundations of the US criminal justice system. If they were, then we would not need judges or juries.

If my wife knows an intimate detail of my neighbor and his son, that is they play Gargoyle video games, the quality of the testimony is higher since she had no possible way of knowing that prior to the event.
So YOU say. The counter argument is, "So what?" And, perhaps she made it up to SOUND like something he MIGHT say. It doesn't PROVE anything. It might intimate that he said something to her with the proper foundation, but it is doubtful that it would PROVE a darn thing.

You really need to understand the court process, and the concept of evidence and testimony a little more if you even think of trying to bring this into court at a civil OR a criminal trial.

Hopefully you and your neighbor can work this out ... though I suspect that the DA may find himself stuck between a couple of schoolyard know-it-alls that both have their chests shoved out convinced of their own superiority and righteousness. I hope I'm wrong, but I have a sneaking suspicion that at least you are not going to go into this meeting with the goal of resolution in mind.


- Carl
 
G

Gevalia

Guest
Although Johnmelissa is still reading this, he probably won't post again so this thread will undoubtedly fade into the archives now. Before it does, I just had to say that I've got this whole "West Side Story" thing going in my head with the Sharks and the Jets spraying water hoses at each other. Tony lying in Maria's arms, moaning "this shirt is silk!"

Utter absurdity.

You know, for pure entertainment value, sometimes you can really never overestimate the problems of our fellow human beings.
 
University

I am attending the University of Carl and I hope to be a good student and graduate. I will attend the DA's hearing and get on my knees to please him if that's necessary. I will agree to a bad decision and to never engage in any similar activity in the future. I will apologize. OK. Period. As for the argument of issues, I reiterate, I have failed to communicate. That I have learned here. I agree, "to a court" the Gargoyle point is simply a claim. To 12 common folks, if communicated correctly, it will irrefutably place the neighbor there through the revelation of a intimate detail that my 57 year old wife had no knowledge of. Question: how did my wife obtain the Gargoyle knowledge? Where did that come from? A lucky guess? When it dawns on you, you'll understand that the neighbor and his boy were spraying me and laughing as they do when they play Nintendo video games up in their second story "game room." When they play the video game they must be careful of the "Gargoyles." After they played their water spray game, they noticed the presence of a "Gargoyle" (my wife). This is evidence, if not to the court then to the 12 common folks in the box, of the "game" that was played that day by the neighbor and his son and corroboration that my wife (the "Gargoyle") was present and saw everything that happened and it is evidence that the neighbor ACKNOWLEDGED that he had been observed by my wife. On the video surveillance system, if you say the police and DA can have knowledge of video of an event and not obtain the video I guess that's the way the law directs the authorities. But if I were on a jury, I'd be SCREAMING at the judge to go get that tape and show it to us. If he didn't, I wouldn't have much of an opinion of the neighbor who had a video tape of what had occurred and would not and did not show it to me and the jury. Thanks, Carl for wasting so much time on my education. Really.
 

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