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Divorce help in LA

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SJLA

Junior Member
Please look at our agreement and give feedback

Ohiogal said:
Good for your friend for talking you out of the madness.
What you were suggesting is stupidity.
Agreements can work but they need to be spelled out.
Thank you for you supporting words and questions. It helped us come up with this plan. Would you be able to look at it and give me some feedback? We hope to get this all down and all paperwork filed no later than the end of this week. Please let me know if we are way off base and also is it possible that we can agree on everything and never had to stand in front of a judge. My friend said her boyfriend and is ex-wife divorced 4 years ago and they never went to court. They drew up paperwork and didn_t need to see a judge. Is that possible in LA County? Here is our plan so far:

CUSTODY: Father and Mother will have joint physical and legal custody of children, with children_s primary residence being Mothers home. Neither parent can remove children from L.A. County for change of permanent residence without the others knowledge and written permission. (Can we say this? Neither of us ever plan on moving any time soon as both our jobs and lives are here.) Both parties will split each child every year for tax purposes. Younger child will be claimed by Mother.

SPOUSAL SUPPORT: No spousal support will be paid to either parent at this time or ever. (We weren_t sure we could even say this)

CHILD SUPPORT: There will be no court ordered child support paid to either parent due to co-parenting plan devised and agreed upon by both parties. Both parents agree to co-parent as if they lived in the same household (i.e. pick up and drop off children around each other_s work schedules as well as watch children while each is at work). Father has separate written agreement with mother regarding monies directly deposited into a joint account for both parties from his current employer to help with extra expenses that children may need. Father agrees that as long as he is employed by Federal Express, he will continue this direct deposit. Mother also acknowledges, amounts directly deposited can be as little as $1 and will not dispute any amounts received. Copy of agreement is included following this agreement. (By the way, the $400 I_ve been getting every month from him has been through this direct deposit into our joint account. That is an average of what I_ve been getting since separation. I don_t even care about the money any more. I make a little more than he does currently)

Father will continue to keep children insured through his work health insurance policy as long as that is in force. Mother will also continue to be covered under his policy until divorce is final. At that time she will be responsible for her own health insurance coverage. Both parents will split co-payments and any medical costs for children 50/50. The parent who takes child to medical provider will be responsible to pay out of pocket and bill other parent within 30 days. The other parent has 30 days after receipt to pay their portion of the bill. At both parent_s discretion, a different payment plan can be negotiated if agreed upon in writing. Neither parent will take children to an out of network provider, unless it is an emergency that an in network provider cannot be reached to accommodate child. If either parent takes child to an out of network provider in a non-emergency situation, that parent will be responsible for the entire medical bill and other parent will not be held liable for any expenses from that visit.

Both Father and Mother agree to keep their new Primerica Life Insurance Policies in force with both parties listed as irrevocable beneficiary for the benefit of their daughters. Both insurance policies are in force through Primerica Life Insurance in the amount of $200,000 each for a 20 year term. Children are listed on each policy as riders. Each party will pay for their separate policies and these policies will stay in force no less than 20 years from the date it began, at which time both children will either be college aged, in college or already completed their college education. (Can this be in agreement?)

Both parents will pay for educational costs 50/50 until children graduate from high school or reach the age of 18, whichever occurs last. This includes cost of tuition and books at schools. Other activities are considered extra-curricular. Mother will pay out of pocket and bill father who will have 30 days from receipt to pay his portion. At both parent_s discretion, a different payment plan can be negotiated if agreed upon in writing. This will allow sensitivity to both parties budgets.

Each parent will pay for children_s necessities while in their care. If children are enrolled in extra-curricular activities, both parents must be in agreement to costs and if so, will split costs 50/50. Agreement must be in writing. If both parents are not in agreement to costs of activity, the parent who wants activity for children will bear 100% responsibility for the costs.

Child Care Costs: Both parents will take responsibility to watch their own children around each other_s work schedules. IF both parents work schedules overlap, both parents agree that whoever they choose to care for their children during working hours will be chosen by parent who would normally have them during that particular time. Child care provider must be known to both parents and if a paid provider, both parents agree to split costs 50/50. Parent who is responsible for children during this time will pay out of pocket and other parent will be billed and has 30 days to pay their portion. If non-licensed child care provider cannot be agreed upon, parent who would normally have children during time needed will employ a licensed child care provider of their choice, provide copy of license and information to other parent, pay child care costs and bill other parent within time frame. (Does this make sense?)

*If any shared costs is not billed to other parent within 30 days, the paying parent takes 100% responsibility for costs and other parents will not be liable. If parent who receives bill does not pay his or her portion within 30 days of receipt the balance can be subject to 10% interest charges and paying parent has option of turning the owed debt over to Department of Child Support Services to collect on.

-continued on next message-
 
Last edited:


SJLA

Junior Member
Part 2 of agreement continued...

SJLA said:
-continued on next message-

VISITATION: The approximate percentage of times is 47% Father and Mother 53%. Visitation will be as follows:

Father will have girls 6 nights a week-Sunday through Friday night. This is to accommodate mother’s overnight work schedule. Mother will drop children off every night Sunday-Friday @ 7:30pm and pick children up from father @ 7:30am. This will accommodate father’s work schedule. Every other Saturday children will spend entire day with father and mother will pick them up Saturday @ 7:30pm. On Mother’s Saturdays, she will pick children up @ 7:30am and return children to father Sunday @ 7:30pm before she starts work week. (Basically we figured that 12 hours spent every day with each of us except every other Saturday I have children for 24 hours would come out to percentage we calculated)

Grandparents visitation will take place when grandchildren are with their children (i.e. Maternal grandparents can visit children while children are with mother
and paternal grandparents will visit when children are with father. Long distance visits to either grandparents will be with parent accompanying children until both children are at least age 10 and after that grandchildren may visit grandparents without parents accompanying them during their respective parent’s visiting time frames. See Summer visitation rules which will apply here.

Holidays and Vacations will be spent as follows:

Summer: Both parents will bear primary physical responsibility for children every 2 weeks in the summer. This will start the first complete week after
children are out of school from Sunday through the 2nd week’s Saturday. Although the parenting plan shares children between both parties every day, this
summer 2 week allowance will be to accommodate any vacations either parent wants to take children on (i.e. If Mother or Father wants to take child on
vacation it must be during a 2 week period they have physical custody). Both parents are allowed to take their children on vacation up to 3 days long without the other parent’s permission until both children have reached at least the age of 10. Other parent must have knowledge of vacation at least one week in
advance and all contact rules apply here. This vacation cannot be out of the country or out of the continental United States region. After both children reach
the age 10, both parents can take children on vacation up to 10 days during their 2 week summer time frames without the other parent’s permission. The
traveling parent must furnish the other parent with all phone #s where children can be reached and addresses while on vacation. Copies of traveling itineraries
and/or agendas must be left with other parents. Both parents can use their own discretion and have a different agreement per trip in writing to accommodate
special circumstances. The agreement must be notarized. Children cannot travel out of the country with either parent between ages 10-18 unless both parents
agree in writing.

Thanksgiving: Mother-even years/Father-odd years
(Each parent will have child the entire day of Thanksgiving 7:30a-7:30p on their year. Time before and after this day will be spent per the regular visitation
schedule)

Christmas: Mother-odd years/Father-even years.
(Each parent will have child Christmas Eve @ 7:30pm through Dec. 26th @ 7:30pm. Regular visit schedule will apply here). If Christmas vacations are
planned, the parent who has children Christmas day is allowed to have entire week Christmas Day is included for a vacation. Same summer vacation rules
apply here.

Mothers Day will be spent with Mom, and Fathers Day with Dad. (Visit will start @ 7:30am and end at 7:30pm that day). Other arrangements can be made if
agreed upon by both parties in writing.

Birthdays: Both parties will see children during their times on their birthdates.

Other holiday weekends or school vacations including spring breaks will be spent with both parents according to visitation plans and any changes must be
agreed upon and in writing.

Please let me know as soon as possible if anything is missing or if we are too detailed or we have too much. We are both trying to agree for our daughters sake and want this to be as smooth as possible. I don't know what I was thinking before. Bad advice from other friends I guess. PLEASE HELP!!!
 

ceara19

Senior Member
I know you were directing your question about looking over the agreement to Ohiogal, but while just glancing over it, I did notice one item that you may want to consider changing.


Both Father and Mother agree to keep their new Primerica Life Insurance Policies in force with both parties listed as irrevocable beneficiary for the benefit of their daughters. Both insurance policies are in force through Primerica Life Insurance in the amount of $200,000 each for a 20 year term. Children are listed on each policy as riders. Each party will pay for their separate policies and these policies will stay in force no less than 20 years from the date it began, at which time both children will either be college aged, in college or already completed their college education. (Can this be in agreement?)
You may want to consider changing this so that each parent is the owner of the OTHER parent's policy. Even though you are both in agreement on the matter and it would most likely be approved as is, if one parent let their policy lapse, it is unlikely that the other would even find out unless that parent actually dies. Then it's would too late to bring the violation to the attention of the court.

There is also less likelihood that either parent would allow the policy to lapse because doing so would hurt them if the other parent were to die. If you are each paying your OWN policy, other then being in violation of the court order, allowing the policy to lapse doesn't have as much of an impact because if the policy would ever need to be paid by the insurance company, you would be dead.

That's just my opinion though.
 

SJLA

Junior Member
ceara19 said:
I know you were directing your question about looking over the agreement to Ohiogal, but while just glancing over it, I did notice one item that you may want to consider changing.




You may want to consider changing this so that each parent is the owner of the OTHER parent's policy. Even though you are both in agreement on the matter and it would most likely be approved as is, if one parent let their policy lapse, it is unlikely that the other would even find out unless that parent actually dies. Then it's would too late to bring the violation to the attention of the court.

That's just my opinion though.
Okay, I'll talk to our agent
 

Ohiogal

Queen Bee
SJLA said:
Thank you for you supporting words and questions. It helped us come up with this plan. Would you be able to look at it and give me some feedback? We hope to get this all down and all paperwork filed no later than the end of this week. Please let me know if we are way off base and also is it possible that we can agree on everything and never had to stand in front of a judge. My friend said her boyfriend and is ex-wife divorced 4 years ago and they never went to court. They drew up paperwork and didn_t need to see a judge. Is that possible in LA County? Here is our plan so far:

CUSTODY: Father and Mother will have joint physical and legal custody of children, with children_s primary residence being Mothers home. Neither parent can remove children from L.A. County for change of permanent residence without the others knowledge and written permission. (Can we say this? Neither of us ever plan on moving any time soon as both our jobs and lives are here.) Both parties will split each child every year for tax purposes. Younger child will be claimed by Mother.

You both live in L.A. County now? If so then yes you can do that. How are you going to split each child? You need to state that mother will oldest child and father will claim youngest child (use their names) or one parent will claim all children one year.

SPOUSAL SUPPORT: No spousal support will be paid to either parent at this time or ever. (We weren_t sure we could even say this)

Spousal support you can waive as it is considered part of the divorce settement unlike child support.

CHILD SUPPORT: There will be no court ordered child support paid to either parent due to co-parenting plan devised and agreed upon by both parties. Both parents agree to co-parent as if they lived in the same household (i.e. pick up and drop off children around each other_s work schedules as well as watch children while each is at work). Father has separate written agreement with mother regarding monies directly deposited into a joint account for both parties from his current employer to help with extra expenses that children may need. Father agrees that as long as he is employed by Federal Express, he will continue this direct deposit. Mother also acknowledges, amounts directly deposited can be as little as $1 and will not dispute any amounts received. Copy of agreement is included following this agreement. (By the way, the $400 I_ve been getting every month from him has been through this direct deposit into our joint account. That is an average of what I_ve been getting since separation. I don_t even care about the money any more. I make a little more than he does currently)

The separate written agreement means nothing. It is not enforceable. You need to spell out what those monies are and why you are getting them in this agreement. If they vary and he is doing it out of the goodness of his heart -- you don't want a court order then dont' mention it. Just state that both parents will cooperate in providing for their children's expenses and as each has equal time to parent both are already sharing in the expenses. You will both have to give full disclosure of your incomes to the court and each other.

Father will continue to keep children insured through his work health insurance policy as long as that is in force. Mother will also continue to be covered under his policy until divorce is final. At that time she will be responsible for her own health insurance coverage. Both parents will split co-payments and any medical costs for children 50/50. The parent who takes child to medical provider will be responsible to pay out of pocket and bill other parent within 30 days. The other parent has 30 days after receipt to pay their portion of the bill. At both parent_s discretion, a different payment plan can be negotiated if agreed upon in writing. Neither parent will take children to an out of network provider, unless it is an emergency that an in network provider cannot be reached to accommodate child. If either parent takes child to an out of network provider in a non-emergency situation, that parent will be responsible for the entire medical bill and other parent will not be held liable for any expenses from that visit.

This is a good clause. Does work health insurance include dental and vision?

Both Father and Mother agree to keep their new Primerica Life Insurance Policies in force with both parties listed as irrevocable beneficiary for the benefit of their daughters. Both insurance policies are in force through Primerica Life Insurance in the amount of $200,000 each for a 20 year term. Children are listed on each policy as riders. Each party will pay for their separate policies and these policies will stay in force no less than 20 years from the date it began, at which time both children will either be college aged, in college or already completed their college education. (Can this be in agreement?)

It can be in the agreement.

Both parents will pay for educational costs 50/50 until children graduate from high school or reach the age of 18, whichever occurs last. This includes cost of tuition and books at schools. Other activities are considered extra-curricular. Mother will pay out of pocket and bill father who will have 30 days from receipt to pay his portion. At both parent_s discretion, a different payment plan can be negotiated if agreed upon in writing. This will allow sensitivity to both parties budgets.


Tuition? Are the children in private school now? Do both parents have to agree to private school? Or does the decision belong to just one parent and then both have to pay -- I would NOT suggest that.

Each parent will pay for children_s necessities while in their care. If children are enrolled in extra-curricular activities, both parents must be in agreement to costs and if so, will split costs 50/50. Agreement must be in writing. If both parents are not in agreement to costs of activity, the parent who wants activity for children will bear 100% responsibility for the costs.

What if said activity disrupts other parent's parenting time? Then they don't get a say so? As in you sign the kids up for something that takes place entirely during dad's visitation but you pay for it. Or vice versa. That isn't right and isn't fair. If it takes place on times that both of you would have the chlidren you should both have to agree but incorporate activities that the children are currently in to be exempt. In other words if they participate in baseball now -- that can continue as it has been.

Child Care Costs: Both parents will take responsibility to watch their own children around each other_s work schedules. IF both parents work schedules overlap, both parents agree that whoever they choose to care for their children during working hours will be chosen by parent who would normally have them during that particular time. Child care provider must be known to both parents and if a paid provider, both parents agree to split costs 50/50. Parent who is responsible for children during this time will pay out of pocket and other parent will be billed and has 30 days to pay their portion. If non-licensed child care provider cannot be agreed upon, parent who would normally have children during time needed will employ a licensed child care provider of their choice, provide copy of license and information to other parent, pay child care costs and bill other parent within time frame. (Does this make sense?)

Why is a copy of the license important? YOu may NOT be able to get a copy of that actually. If a license is that important you don't allow non-licensed individuals EXCEPT family and household members to watch the children.

*If any shared costs is not billed to other parent within 30 days, the paying parent takes 100% responsibility for costs and other parents will not be liable. If parent who receives bill does not pay his or her portion within 30 days of receipt the balance can be subject to 10% interest charges and paying parent has option of turning the owed debt over to Department of Child Support Services to collect on.

-continued on next message-
Sometimes bills are not given to you within 30 days. State 30 days after receipt of bill. And is that just for child care bills? Department of Child Support services can NOT be made a party to this without putting them in the ENTIRE thing. They will not act as a PRIVATE collection agency. Understand?
 

Ohiogal

Queen Bee
SJLA said:
VISITATION: The approximate percentage of times is 47% Father and Mother 53%. Visitation will be as follows:

Father will have girls 6 nights a week-Sunday through Friday night. This is to accommodate mother’s overnight work schedule. Mother will drop children off every night Sunday-Friday @ 7:30pm and pick children up from father @ 7:30am. This will accommodate father’s work schedule. Every other Saturday children will spend entire day with father and mother will pick them up Saturday @ 7:30pm. On Mother’s Saturdays, she will pick children up @ 7:30am and return children to father Sunday @ 7:30pm before she starts work week. (Basically we figured that 12 hours spent every day with each of us except every other Saturday I have children for 24 hours would come out to percentage we calculated)

Grandparents visitation will take place when grandchildren are with their children (i.e. Maternal grandparents can visit children while children are with mother
and paternal grandparents will visit when children are with father. Long distance visits to either grandparents will be with parent accompanying children until both children are at least age 10 and after that grandchildren may visit grandparents without parents accompanying them during their respective parent’s visiting time frames. See Summer visitation rules which will apply here.

Holidays and Vacations will be spent as follows:

Summer: Both parents will bear primary physical responsibility for children every 2 weeks in the summer. This will start the first complete week after
children are out of school from Sunday through the 2nd week’s Saturday. Although the parenting plan shares children between both parties every day, this
summer 2 week allowance will be to accommodate any vacations either parent wants to take children on (i.e. If Mother or Father wants to take child on
vacation it must be during a 2 week period they have physical custody). Both parents are allowed to take their children on vacation up to 3 days long without the other parent’s permission until both children have reached at least the age of 10. Other parent must have knowledge of vacation at least one week in
advance and all contact rules apply here. This vacation cannot be out of the country or out of the continental United States region. After both children reach
the age 10, both parents can take children on vacation up to 10 days during their 2 week summer time frames without the other parent’s permission. The
traveling parent must furnish the other parent with all phone #s where children can be reached and addresses while on vacation. Copies of traveling itineraries
and/or agendas must be left with other parents. Both parents can use their own discretion and have a different agreement per trip in writing to accommodate
special circumstances. The agreement must be notarized. Children cannot travel out of the country with either parent between ages 10-18 unless both parents
agree in writing.


Allow a clause that lets out of country be possible IF both parents agree, the non traveling gives notarized permission, it is to a country that support the Hague convention and it is not on the United State's lists of terrorist countries, unfavorable countries, war-torn etcetera. You never know what could come up. Also are you going to see the children for even one day during the two week period? If the children are under two going two weeks without scheduled time with the other parent may prove difficult. You should schedule at least a Saturday or Sunday visit midway through the two week period for the kids.
Thanksgiving: Mother-even years/Father-odd years
(Each parent will have child the entire day of Thanksgiving 7:30a-7:30p on their year. Time before and after this day will be spent per the regular visitation
schedule)

What if you want to take the kids away for Thanksgiving? 12 hours may not be enough time. Make it Wednesday evening through Saturday -- if not Sunday -- evening. Its a holiday period. Christmas: Mother-odd years/Father-even years.
(Each parent will have child Christmas Eve @ 7:30pm through Dec. 26th @ 7:30pm. Regular visit schedule will apply here). If Christmas vacations are
planned, the parent who has children Christmas day is allowed to have entire week Christmas Day is included for a vacation. Same summer vacation rules
apply here.

Mothers Day will be spent with Mom, and Fathers Day with Dad. (Visit will start @ 7:30am and end at 7:30pm that day). Other arrangements can be made if
agreed upon by both parties in writing.

Birthdays: Both parties will see children during their times on their birthdates.

What does during their times on their birthdates? Spell out what that means.
Other holiday weekends or school vacations including spring breaks will be spent with both parents according to visitation plans and any changes must be
agreed upon and in writing.

Please let me know as soon as possible if anything is missing or if we are too detailed or we have too much. We are both trying to agree for our daughters sake and want this to be as smooth as possible. I don't know what I was thinking before. Bad advice from other friends I guess. PLEASE HELP!!!
Overall it is not a bad plan. But you need to be more detailed in some places. And there were just a few things that could come back to bite you.
 

Ohiogal

Queen Bee
ceara19 said:
I know you were directing your question about looking over the agreement to Ohiogal, but while just glancing over it, I did notice one item that you may want to consider changing.




You may want to consider changing this so that each parent is the owner of the OTHER parent's policy. Even though you are both in agreement on the matter and it would most likely be approved as is, if one parent let their policy lapse, it is unlikely that the other would even find out unless that parent actually dies. Then it's would too late to bring the violation to the attention of the court.

There is also less likelihood that either parent would allow the policy to lapse because doing so would hurt them if the other parent were to die. If you are each paying your OWN policy, other then being in violation of the court order, allowing the policy to lapse doesn't have as much of an impact because if the policy would ever need to be paid by the insurance company, you would be dead.

That's just my opinion though.
That is a very good point. They should cost roughly the same unless one party is drastically older or severely less healthy than the other.
 
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