Need quick answer re: GAL

[LdiJ]

I have a concern that you are overlooking issues that dad really does have, because you want to believe that its his/your religion that causes the apparent "symptoms", rather than acknowledge honest problems that he may really have. Counseling will not help the situation if dad cannot acknowledge problems/issues that he has.

I also have a concern that dad is going to fail, courtwise, if he cannot be more secular in outlook when dealing with the court and professionals involved with the court.

 

[casa]

Smom/Dad aren't a different religion than the daughter. I don't understand why this distinctions are being made that Dad's forcing his religious views on the daughter.

I'm privy to addtnl. info. on the Psych eval.

I also don't take her as a bigot at all. Wow, tough words. She was explaining how they have friends of different faiths than both of theirs and it's not an issue for them.

Yes, explaining how they have 'friends' who aren't in the same religion and they all get along fine.....even though they are all going to Hell

 

[wileybunch]

Yes, explaining how they have 'friends' who aren't in the same religion and they all get along fine.....even though they are all going to Hell

Those two things are not juxtaposed in that way -- she has friends, but it's on her mind that they're going to hell. By your definition, any Christian that has friends of other faiths or no faith that says this is the case is really a bigot.

But this is all beside the point because the stepdaughter's religion from both parents teaches that same thing about the need to be baptized. Actually, from what I've gathered, Mom is Catholic or Orthodox and Dad is Protestant so Mom's religion is stricter than Dad on this point.

 

[casa]

Those two things are not juxtaposed in that way -- she has friends, but it's on her mind that they're going to hell. By your definition, any Christian that has friends of other faiths or no faith that says this is the case is really a bigot.

No, someone who has friends of different faiths is not a bigot. Someone who believes that those who are 'different' than them (ie; different Religion/Sex/Race) are 'less than' or are going to Hell, etc., IS bigotry.

But this is all beside the point because the stepdaughter's religion from both parents teaches that same thing about the need to be baptized. Actually, from what I've gathered, Mom is Catholic or Orthodox and Dad is Protestant so Mom's religion is stricter than Dad on this point.

Listen...you can have a Church full of a thousand people...and they may all practice their Faith in their own ways. Some pray, some chant, some fast, some worship at certain times...some on certain days...etc. etc. etc. There are a thousand variations within a thousand different religions. So, to say that you are the ONE that knows the TRUTH, and other views are 'wrong' is arrogant. Arrogance is a hallmark for NPD.

Get it?

 

[LdiJ]

Those two things are not juxtaposed in that way -- she has friends, but it's on her mind that they're going to hell. By your definition, any Christian that has friends of other faiths or no faith that says this is the case is really a bigot.

But this is all beside the point because the stepdaughter's religion from both parents teaches that same thing about the need to be baptized. Actually, from what I've gathered, Mom is Catholic or Orthodox and Dad is Protestant so Mom's religion is stricter than Dad on this point.

Actually, Catholics are generally more tolerant of other religions. I attended a catacysm (spelling?) class with a friend in college, just to learn about it, and the priest taught us that anyone who kept their own personal covenant with god would go to heaven, and that included catholics, protestants, jews, muslims, hindus and anyone of any faith.

 

[Silverplum]

Actually, Catholics are generally more tolerant of other religions. I attended a catacysm (spelling?) class with a friend in college, just to learn about it, and the priest taught us that anyone who kept their own personal covenant with god would go to heaven, and that included catholics, protestants, jews, muslims, hindus and anyone of any faith.

THAT priest in YOUR city.

NO WHERE ELSE in MY experience.

So...your experience is your experience. My experience is my experience. Neither makes a 100% FACT EVERYWHERE.

 

[casa]

I have a concern that you are overlooking issues that dad really does have, because you want to believe that its his/your religion that causes the apparent "symptoms", rather than acknowledge honest problems that he may really have. Counseling will not help the situation if dad cannot acknowledge problems/issues that he has.

I also have a concern that dad is going to fail, courtwise, if he cannot be more secular in outlook when dealing with the court and professionals involved with the court.

That is my concern as well. I have seen NPD spikes in testing which involves those with strict religious views. It's ultimately very difficult to effectively co-parent when one or the other takes such a rigid stance.

 

[LdiJ]

THAT priest in YOUR city.

NO WHERE ELSE in MY experience.

So...your experience is your experience. My experience is my experience. Neither makes a 100% FACT EVERYWHERE.

I dunno, I been acquainted with quite a few priests in my lifetime, and they all had pretty much the same tolerance and teachings. Anyway, I was impressed with the idea that the important thing was to believe in God, not in the particular method you adopted for believing.

 

[wileybunch]

Actually, Catholics are generally more tolerant of other religions. I attended a catacysm (spelling?) class with a friend in college, just to learn about it, and the priest taught us that anyone who kept their own personal covenant with god would go to heaven, and that included catholics, protestants, jews, muslims, hindus and anyone of any faith.

Catholic teachings on baptism provide for much less leeway than Protestant ones so if one must needs to be a bigot for believing baptism is essential, Catholics are stricter that way.

P.S. I was Catholic for 37 years and I think it's all over the map what individuals believe, many don't really know the teachings of the church all that well in the first place. But, I'm not speaking of personalities, rather, of teachings on the requirement and essential needs for baptism in one denomination vs. the other. I'm neither Catholic OR Protestant, in the interest of full disclosure.

 

[TinkerBelleLuvr]

When I went to school in the Catholic school system, the NUNS taught us 'religions of the world.' In all my memories, I do NOT remember anyone going to HELL because they didn't believe in the Catholic way.

Now, if you were a Catholic who turned their back on Catholicism, that was a different story.

 

[wileybunch]

Listen...you can have a Church full of a thousand people...and they may all practice their Faith in their own ways. Some pray, some chant, some fast, some worship at certain times...some on certain days...etc. etc. etc. There are a thousand variations within a thousand different religions. So, to say that you are the ONE that knows the TRUTH, and other views are 'wrong' is arrogant. Arrogance is a hallmark for NPD.

Get it?

We're not talking about things each individual chooses to tailor for their life, rather, we're talking about church teachings.

OP only brought up that they have friends of other faiths and no faiths because she was challenged that she’s teaching stepdaughter to think less of other people and that's just not evidenced. Your evidence is that's a teaching of her religion. That's why I said the teaching of the denomination Mom's reverting back to is actually stricter in that regard.

OP’s husband should just keep religion out of his discussions as much as possible. He has to answer to the courts and evaluators on one level and he can answer for other things on another. He should just zip it as much as possible. Clearly the evaluator cannot be completely objective if he’s making an issue of Dad’s religion when that’s the child’s religion, was Mom’s religion (and still is but she’s apparently reclaiming her previous Catholic faith). And that is their choice to have this religion, whether any of us here believe in it or agree with it.

 

[casa]

We're not talking about things each individual chooses to tailor for their life, rather, we're talking about church teachings.

OP only brought up that they have friends of other faiths and no faiths because she was challenged that she’s teaching stepdaughter to think less of other people and that's just not evidenced. Your evidence is that's a teaching of her religion. That's why I said the teaching of the denomination Mom's reverting back to is actually stricter in that regard.

But that doesn't mean Mom is devout, does it? That's the point...no matter what Religion we refer to, people practice in a variety of different ways. No one way is better than the other...and if you teach a child that people who are not baptized or 'saved' or whatEVER will be going to Hell- you're teaching bigotry. It's really that simple.

OP’s husband should just keep religion out of his discussions as much as possible. He has to answer to the courts and evaluators on one level and he can answer for other things on another. He should just zip it as much as possible. Clearly the evaluator cannot be completely objective if he’s making an issue of Dad’s religion when that’s the child’s religion, was Mom’s religion (and still is but she’s apparently reclaiming her previous Catholic faith). And that is their choice to have this religion, whether any of us here believe in it or agree with it.

I agree. I think his focusing so strongly on the Religious aspects has truly damaged his case.

Evaluations involve much psych. testing. Dad has tested as having NPD, due largely to the fact of his rigid Religious belief/doctrine. That has nothing to do with bias on the evaluator's part. The evaluator uses various methods (in combination) to determine various aspects of behavior...Dad's is coming up NPD because those with very rigid Religious beliefs' behavior mimics NPD in many ways.

 

[proud_parent]

Careening off topic...

THAT priest in YOUR city.
NO WHERE ELSE in MY experience.

Much as it pains me to disagree with you, Silver, I must on this point. But...I have a link!

http://www.scborromeo.org/ccc/ccc_toc.htm


CATECHISM OF THE CATHOLIC CHURCH - SECOND EDITION
Paragraph 847:

847 This affirmation is not aimed at those who, through no fault of their own, do not know Christ and his Church:

Those who, through no fault of their own, do not know the Gospel of Christ or his Church, but who nevertheless seek God with a sincere heart, and, moved by grace, try in their actions to do his will as they know it through the dictates of their conscience - those too may achieve eternal salvation.

 

[wileybunch]

But that doesn't mean Mom is devout, does it? That's the point...no matter what Religion we refer to, people practice in a variety of different ways. No one way is better than the other...and if you teach a child that people who are not baptized or 'saved' or whatEVER will be going to Hell- you're teaching bigotry. It's really that simple..

I may have missed it, but I didn't see where Mom had a problem with Dad's beliefs on baptism. I saw where daughter feels she was baptized before she was ready and to that I think Dad should have daughter speak to their pastor or whatever his title is and explain how she's feeling now since that was between them in the first place (assuming he had to approve she was ready in the first place).

And, while I do not share the belief that hell is for the unbaptized, teaching that does not = bigotry. It's too easily disproved how much unconditional love and caring comes from people that have this belief to say ergo they are also a bigot. Remember that OP and those of her faith aren't condemning anyone in the first place.

 

[Silverplum]

You're cute, PP.

But what is declared ON PAPER is sometimes entirely different IRL, is it not?

I mean, what about all those COURT ORDERS and MARRIAGE LICENSES?