Outdated will

[jolope]

What is the name of your state? New York
I am executor of my dad's will. He has only a few thousand dollars in his checking account. I just want to pay the funeral expenses out of that. There won't be anything left over. All the properties mentioned in the will have long ago been given to his children. There are trusts named in the will that no longer exist. There is a company in the will that no longer exists. There are goods in the will that have already been given to the recipients. I don't know what to do. Do I really have to fill out the small estate form with all the things that are no longer relevant? I just want to pay the funeral. Do I have to do this small estate form, because I will stand down as executor, if so.

 

[adjusterjack]

He has only a few thousand dollars in his checking account.

How many thousands is a "few"?

Is there a beneficiary listed on the account (pay on death)?

Do I have to do this small estate form, because I will stand down as executor, if so.

Who else is going to do it?

If you step down and nobody else steps up, the money eventually goes to the state.

I just want to pay the funeral.

You might have to pay it with your own money. If you arranged the funeral my guess is that you signed something where you personally guaranteed payment.

 

[AlmostThere]

While the NYS small estate forms seem to be designed to be handled in a DIY manner, you can hire someone to do it for you.

 

[adjusterjack]

you can hire someone to do it for you.

That would have to be a lawyer. At $300 to $400 per hour that would eat up that bank account pretty quick.

 

[zddoodah]

I am executor of my dad's will.

I assume what you mean by this is that your father made a will in which he nominated you to be executor. I assume you have not actually filed with the surrogate's court to probate the estate and been appointed by the court to serve as executor. Are those assumptions correct?

He has only a few thousand dollars in his checking account.

Is there a pay-on-death beneficiary named on the account? If so, is it you?

I don't know what to do. Do I really have to fill out the small estate form with all the things that are no longer relevant? I just want to pay the funeral. Do I have to do this small estate form, because I will stand down as executor, if so.

It sounds like your father's estate can be administered under the small estate procedure. If you don't want to do that, you're not obligated to do so. However, you won't get the money from the bank account unless you do so or you're the named pay-on-death beneficiary. By the way, the fact that the will mentions a bunch of stuff that your father no longer owned at the time of his death isn't relevant.

 

[Taxing Matters]

That would have to be a lawyer. At $300 to $400 per hour that would eat up that bank account pretty quick.

In NY there are a variety of fee structures that lawyers use for dealing with estate and probate matters. Very simple matters, like uncontested probate with few assets may be done on a flat fee basis, for example. For full estate administration of an estate with significant assets, the fees are typically charged (as allowed by NY) as percentage of the value of the estate. So if attorney help is needed here, it would be a good idea to shop around a bit to see what lawyer will best be suited for doing just what this matter requires, which might be quite limited, and what the fee will be for that.

 

[Taxing Matters]

What is the name of your state? New York
I am executor of my dad's will. He has only a few thousand dollars in his checking account. I just want to pay the funeral expenses out of that. There won't be anything left over. All the properties mentioned in the will have long ago been given to his children. There are trusts named in the will that no longer exist. There is a company in the will that no longer exists. There are goods in the will that have already been given to the recipients. I don't know what to do. Do I really have to fill out the small estate form with all the things that are no longer relevant? I just want to pay the funeral. Do I have to do this small estate form, because I will stand down as executor, if so.

First, ignore what the will says about any assets that your father no longer had when he died. A will only has an effect with regard to the assets that he had at death and that make it into his probate estate. Likewise, a trust that is not funded (known as a dry trust) is ineffective too. So if there aren't any assets to put in the trust, that's a non issue.

Second, how much are the funeral/burial/crematiom expenses and how much money does your father's account have? Funeral costs and related expenses and estate administrative expenses have top priority for payment from an estate (except for when the estate owes federal estate tax, and his estate would have to be worth millions of dollars for that). If there won't be anything left once the funeral and burial (or whatever method is used for taking care of the body) then realistically no one is going to bother challenging the estate because they'd get nothing anyway. There has to be something left in the pot for any creditors/beneficiaries to fight over for it to be worthwhile for them to incur the costs involved in that.

In short, dealing with this shouldn't require much work and likely won't run into any challenges if, for example, the estate only has enough to pay the funeral/burial costs and perhaps a few other small final bills that he may have had that didn't get paid before he died. Beyond that, you might find that consulting an attorney for just a half hour or hour of his/her time for some direction on how to handle the estate properly will be worthwhile.

 

[jolope]

First, ignore what the will says about any assets that your father no longer had when he died. A will only has an effect with regard to the assets that he had at death and that make it into his probate estate. Likewise, a trust that is not funded (known as a dry trust) is ineffective too. So if there aren't any assets to put in the trust, that's a non issue.

Second, how much are the funeral/burial/crematiom expenses and how much money does your father's account have? Funeral costs and related expenses and estate administrative expenses have top priority for payment from an estate (except for when the estate owes federal estate tax, and his estate would have to be worth millions of dollars for that). If there won't be anything left once the funeral and burial (or whatever method is used for taking care of the body) then realistically no one is going to bother challenging the estate because they'd get nothing anyway. There has to be something left in the pot for any creditors/beneficiaries to fight over for it to be worthwhile for them to incur the costs involved in that.

In short, dealing with this shouldn't require much work and likely won't run into any challenges if, for example, the estate only has enough to pay the funeral/burial costs and perhaps a few other small final bills that he may have had that didn't get paid before he died. Beyond that, you might find that consulting an attorney for just a half hour or hour of his/her time for some direction on how to handle the estate properly will be worthwhile.

That is what I thought. There is not enough in it to completely cover the funeral. So are you saying to forget about the small estate filing?

 

[jolope]

I assume what you mean by this is that your father made a will in which he nominated you to be executor. I assume you have not actually filed with the surrogate's court to probate the estate and been appointed by the court to serve as executor. Are those assumptions correct?




Is there a pay-on-death beneficiary named on the account? If so, is it you?




It sounds like your father's estate can be administered under the small estate procedure. If you don't want to do that, you're not obligated to do so. However, you won't get the money from the bank account unless you do so or you're the named pay-on-death beneficiary. By the way, the fact that the will mentions a bunch of stuff that your father no longer owned at the time of his death isn't relevant.

From what I've read, I can pay out the funeral costs as executor. I will see what happens. There is no probate under $50,000.

 

[jolope]

How many thousands is a "few"?

Is there a beneficiary listed on the account (pay on death)?



Who else is going to do it?

If you step down and nobody else steps up, the money eventually goes to the state.



You might have to pay it with your own money. If you arranged the funeral my guess is that you signed something where you personally guaranteed payment.

No, I don't think it goes to the state. If someone steps down as executor, then the court appoints one. The funeral is paid for already, I need to reimburse people from the account.

 

[jolope]

First, ignore what the will says about any assets that your father no longer had when he died. A will only has an effect with regard to the assets that he had at death and that make it into his probate estate. Likewise, a trust that is not funded (known as a dry trust) is ineffective too. So if there aren't any assets to put in the trust, that's a non issue.

Second, how much are the funeral/burial/crematiom expenses and how much money does your father's account have? Funeral costs and related expenses and estate administrative expenses have top priority for payment from an estate (except for when the estate owes federal estate tax, and his estate would have to be worth millions of dollars for that). If there won't be anything left once the funeral and burial (or whatever method is used for taking care of the body) then realistically no one is going to bother challenging the estate because they'd get nothing anyway. There has to be something left in the pot for any creditors/beneficiaries to fight over for it to be worthwhile for them to incur the costs involved in that.

In short, dealing with this shouldn't require much work and likely won't run into any challenges if, for example, the estate only has enough to pay the funeral/burial costs and perhaps a few other small final bills that he may have had that didn't get paid before he died. Beyond that, you might find that consulting an attorney for just a half hour or hour of his/her time for some direction on how to handle the estate properly will be worthwhile.

That is what I thought. There is not enough in it to completely cover the funeral. So are you saying to forget about the small estate filing?
The problem with the small estate filing, is that it asks for all the bequests and there are so many! And they are all gone anyway. So I would have to put all that stuff down and then search for the legal proof that they have been given away already and I do not want to do all that. It will drive me crazy.

 

[jolope]

I assume what you mean by this is that your father made a will in which he nominated you to be executor. I assume you have not actually filed with the surrogate's court to probate the estate and been appointed by the court to serve as executor. Are those assumptions correct?




Is there a pay-on-death beneficiary named on the account? If so, is it you?




It sounds like your father's estate can be administered under the small estate procedure. If you don't want to do that, you're not obligated to do so. However, you won't get the money from the bank account unless you do so or you're the named pay-on-death beneficiary. By the way, the fact that the will mentions a bunch of stuff that your father no longer owned at the time of his death isn't relevant.

I am the executor in the will. There is no beneficiary. There is no probate. The problem with the small estate filing, is that it asks for all the bequests and there are so many! And they are all gone anyway. So I would have to put all that stuff down and then I assume I would have to search for the legal proof that they have been given away already and I do not want to do all that. It will drive me crazy.

 

[adjusterjack]

Then say goodbye to the money.

The court isn't going to appoint anybody unless somebody petitions the court to be named representative of the estate.

The bank will leave the account alone until it reaches the bank's threshold for inactivity. The bank is likely to send letters to the accountholder from time to time. Eventually, if the money isn't claimed it will be sent to the state where it will be held as unclaimed funds until somebody claims it.

 

[Taxing Matters]

That is what I thought. There is not enough in it to completely cover the funeral. So are you saying to forget about the small estate filing?

You'd have to ask a NY probate attorney about what is best to do. In my state, which is not NY, if there aren't even enough funds in the account to fully cover the funeral, the funds could simply be used to help pay the funeral costs and no one would bother to insist on any kind of court action to wrap up the estate. Any challenger would lose because they'd not get anything even if a formal estate was open and probated. It'd be a waste of their money. Sometimes it's just better to do what is practical than meet every little requirement of the law -- in this kind of situation all that does is benefit the courts and the lawyers which is a waste when no one is going to care as long the money was paid as it should have been anyway.

 

[LdiJ]

You'd have to ask a NY probate attorney about what is best to do. In my state, which is not NY, if there aren't even enough funds in the account to fully cover the funeral, the funds could simply be used to help pay the funeral costs and no one would bother to insist on any kind of court action to wrap up the estate. Any challenger would lose because they'd not get anything even if a formal estate was open and probated. It'd be a waste of their money. Sometimes it's just better to do what is practical than meet every little requirement of the law -- in this kind of situation all that does is benefit the courts and the lawyers which is a waste when no one is going to care as long the money was paid as it should have been anyway.

Of course that is assuming that someone can actually access the money without opening probate.