Request for production of documents/child support hearing

[bluesingincat]

What is the name of your state? Wisconsin
I am scheduled to appear in Tennessee court for a motion to collect back support for my son. My ex has not paid child support for 9 years. His attorney has filed a defendent's request for production of documents in which I am being asked to produce all bank account deposit slips, checks and bank statements to his attorney. The same document asks for me to submit all federal income tax returns for the years 1996 through 2004, and my last pay check stub. I have gladly submitted my tax returns and all of my pay check stubs, but I believe it is an invasion of my privacy to submit all my written checks, deposit slips and bank statements. Am I obligated to submit this information? Am I protected by any constitutional right to privacy?
I would appreciate any help in this matter.

 

[stealth2]

They're allowed to ask for pretty much anything they want. You'll have to explain to the judge why you wouldn't/couldn't produce them. Honestly? There's no way I'd be able to produce 10 years worth of deposit slips, bank statements, and cancelled checks.

 

[brisgirl825]

They're allowed to ask for pretty much anything they want. You'll have to explain to the judge why you wouldn't/couldn't produce them. Honestly? There's no way I'd be able to produce 10 years worth of deposit slips, bank statements, and cancelled checks.

I agree that 10 yrs is an awful long time to expect someone to have kept records. I only keep my statements for a year then they're shredded. You should do whatever they ask and get as much of the info as you can.

Good luck
Sarah

 

[stealth2]

Well, I, uumm..... records?

 

[bluesingincat]

Invasion of Financial Privacy

Thanks for the reply!
I honestly feel it is an invasion of my privacy. How do I know that my ex won't be given the information? He has been very physically abusive and has pulled some really crude pranks over the years. I have nothing to hide from the judge or the attorneys, but why would this information be asked for? I have submitted my income tax returns and all wages and earnings. I just wanted to know if there was any constitutional act that would protect my privacy in this matter. What should I tell the judge?

 

[VeronicaGia]

Thanks for the reply!
I honestly feel it is an invasion of my privacy. How do I know that my ex won't be given the information? He has been very physically abusive and has pulled some really crude pranks over the years. I have nothing to hide from the judge or the attorneys, but why would this information be asked for? I have submitted my income tax returns and all wages and earnings. I just wanted to know if there was any constitutional act that would protect my privacy in this matter. What should I tell the judge?

They want bank information to make sure you're not hiding income. Anything they can ask for you can ask for. While 10 years is too much, his and your privacy don't mean much in family court.

 

[LdiJ]

Thanks for the reply!
I honestly feel it is an invasion of my privacy. How do I know that my ex won't be given the information? He has been very physically abusive and has pulled some really crude pranks over the years. I have nothing to hide from the judge or the attorneys, but why would this information be asked for? I have submitted my income tax returns and all wages and earnings. I just wanted to know if there was any constitutional act that would protect my privacy in this matter. What should I tell the judge?

Actually, its somewhat of an intimidation tactic too. Example: Your check stubs are completely irrelevant if they have your W2s...The W2 is the identical information, added up. The deposit slips and cancelled checks are irrelevant also, because the bank statements reflect exactly the same information. They are hoping to scare you into either going through heck to attempt to supply the information....or intimidate you into settling for less than you are entitled to recieve.

When you go to court take a few months worth of bank statements with you....just in case. Otherwise, tell the judge that you don't have those records available. Odds are the judge wouldn't look at them anyway. If you are not self employed, then there really isn't any valid need to look at your bank statements.

 

[LdiJ]

Plain and simple it the info is requested you legally have to provide it. Chances are that they are just making sure that you really make what you are claiming you make.

No she doesn't. This isn't the judge asking for the information its the opposing council. She only has to provide what records the law requires her to keep....a judge won't ask or order her to produce anything she isn't required to keep....or can't obtain ( and only if truly needed) from another source.

For example: A taxpayer is required by law to keep tax records for only 4 years. (businesses 7 years). Therefore, she cannot be required to produce what she isn't legally required to keep. Even the IRS destroys the tax records after 7 years....(with some exceptions). Therefore, its unlikely that a judge would ever require her to provide more than 4 years, but could order her to provide up to 7 since the other years could be obtained from the IRS.

No law requires her to keep pay stubs, cancelled checks, deposit slips or bank statements for ANY period of time....therefore the opposing council can ask all he/she wants....but if those records aren't available, she can't be punished for not producing them......its POSSIBLE that a judge could order her to obtain them from the financial institution involved, but that would also be subject to the limitation of what the financial institution is required to keep by law (and that varies) and whether or not the cost of obtaining those records is reasonable for the purpose for which they are intended.

The bottom line is that most of these really broad demands for discovery are either intended for intimidation purposes or are "fishing expeditions"...in the case of a family law issue, its mostly intimidation purposes.

It is unreasonable for anyone to have those kinds of records available for a 10 year period. I am an accountant and I certainly don't. I do keep my tax records (and supporting documents) in perpetuity...but pay stubs and deposit slips get shredded as soon as I know that the bank has credited my account...I leave the storage of the cancelled checks up to the bank...(with certain specific exceptions) and bank statements (except year end statements) get shredded after one year.

 

[bluesingincat]

Bravo Ldij!!!

Thank you, thank you, thank you, Ldij. First of all, I have not been ordered to produce anything from any judge. This is a Request to produce documents from the opposing attorney. Secondly, I am trying to get back child support from my ex, not the other way around. I am not asking for the amount of child support to be figured by what income he made for each specific year. We had a flat amount per month which was, and is, way below the standard then and now. I wanted to know if I refuse to provide this information, can I confidently rely on the "Right to Financial Privacy Act" ? I believe my right to privacy would be violated because copies of written checks, deposit slips and bank statements reveal much more than numbers. These items tell a story of your comings and goings and detail a private aspect of your life. I have read the act and I am not an attorney, but Ljdi's reasoning runs parallel to what I can glean from the act. My original question posed this possibility. She or He, as it may be, is the first person on this board to address and answer my question. I am in your gratitude, Ldij.
Peace.

 

[TNBSMommy]

Uhhh well that's great that you are trying to get back child support from him.... he is trying to decide if you are indeed making what you claim to be making. That makes a big difference. If you claimed that you were making 30,000 a year but your banking statements show deposits around the 50,000 dollar range then you will have a bit to answer to. IF he is supposed to be paying you an amount based on your income and your income is not what you claim it to be then he might not owe you any money.

I personally don't see the reasons her history would matter one single bit. If the ex owes the money, then whether she made 30K OR 50K when he wasn't paying the COed CS that he apparently didn't bother to try to modify at any given time shouldn't matter. If he should have been paying based on her income, then he should have filed for a modification a long time ago, not now that he is being taken to court for arrears.

Why should she have to answer to anything regarding her passed finances? This isn't bankruptcy court, it isn't even a question of current CS. I have never been asked one time about my financial history in court while trying to get my ex to pay his CS or arrears. I can somewhat see the point if they are talking current CS, but not arrears, he is already indebted to pay them, what she made, and even what she did with that money should be a moot point.

 

[haiku]

well, whatever one party asks of the other party, that party can ask of them. If that makes any sense.

likely her lawyer may be asking for this information of her ex, and they are countering. Which is thier right to do, doesn't mean they will get it all though.

Anytime I have ever set in court for anything involving finances, both sides have to present financial affadavits, and both sides always have to present at least some bank statements, though actual cancelled checks for 10 years is a bit over the top, and will likely be seen that way, if you explain that like most people you don't keep 10 years worth of documentation.

 

[brisgirl825]

It does matter.... If I am paying 800 dollars amonth for my kids because my x claims that she is only making min wage and I go into arrears..... if she takes me to court for back support she needs to be able to prove that she was indeed making what she claimed she was making. The CP might not be legally obligated to inform the court every time that she gets a pay increase but if she is gonna take me to court for pack support then she needs to be prepaired to prove that I am paying her back support based on her correct income. It is impossible for the NCP to know what the CP is making unless they personally provide the info to them.

When I left my job to be a stay at home mom, I told my ex so that he could modify and get the cs reduced since there was no longer any daycare costs. He chose not to do that and when he finally went to court over arrears, I didn't have to provide proof of my income so he could get that extra money dropped. If he didn't want to pay it he should have gone to court, otherwise, it's a gift.
Now I also have to be the one to get cs increased, he has no obligation to do so.



Sarah

 

[stealth2]

It does matter.... If I am paying 800 dollars amonth for my kids because my x claims that she is only making min wage and I go into arrears..... if she takes me to court for back support she needs to be able to prove that she was indeed making what she claimed she was making. The CP might not be legally obligated to inform the court every time that she gets a pay increase but if she is gonna take me to court for pack support then she needs to be prepaired to prove that I am paying her back support based on her correct income. It is impossible for the NCP to know what the CP is making unless they personally provide the info to them.

Nice try, but no. The amount ordered for CS would have already been based on whatever documentation had been requested/presented. It was ordered and therefore owed. NCP does not get to go back a few years after no paying to say "well, it wasn't based on the right income!" She is going for arrearages, as I understand it - not a new order.

 

[LdiJ]

It does matter.... If I am paying 800 dollars amonth for my kids because my x claims that she is only making min wage and I go into arrears..... if she takes me to court for back support she needs to be able to prove that she was indeed making what she claimed she was making. The CP might not be legally obligated to inform the court every time that she gets a pay increase but if she is gonna take me to court for pack support then she needs to be prepaired to prove that I am paying her back support based on her correct income. It is impossible for the NCP to know what the CP is making unless they personally provide the info to them.

You missed an important point newguy. She isn't taking him back to court to attempt to obtain back support. She is taking him back to court to have an existing court order enforced. (read her last response to me) therefore her income for those years was and is totally irrelevant. There was an existing court order in place that he did not honor. (and which was apparently for less than the guideline amount anyway). Therefore he owes the arrearages..PERIOD.

The point is that they are asking for it. Legally right now she might not have to provide it but if they have half a brain they will know how to get it. I still say that if she has nothing to hide then I don't see what the problem is. In AZ both parties are legally ordered to do this each time that CS is brought up. She might be trying to protect herself but they are trying to protect themselves as well.

AZ does not require someone to go back and produce 10 years of those kinds of records....(that is guaranteed) and I sincerely doubt that AZ requires them to provide cancelled checks, paystubs, or deposit slips when W2s and bank statements provide the same information. Sure, if they can demonstrate to the judge that they REALLY NEED the information (highly unlikely) and she is unable to provide it, then certainly, a judge can issue a subpeona for the bank to provide the information.

However, that isn't what is going on here....what's going on here is an attempt to intimidate her into settling for less than she is owed. I also think that the judge is going to find the information that she has provided (tax returns for the entire period plus pay stubs) MORE than adequate.....AGAIN, because this hearing is for enforcement of an existing order...NOT an attempt to obtain previously unordered back child support.

All she has to tell the judge, is, "Your honor, I provided tax returns and pay stubs for the entire 10 year period, I am unable to provide all cancelled checks, deposit slips and bank statements...but I do have a few bank statements for the last few months if they are really needed."

 

[LdiJ]

Oh and for the record... when I subpoenaed my x's stuff all I had to pay for way the subpoena, the bank never charged me anything. On top of that my x had to reimburse me for the costs that I had to spend to get the info.

Your situation, and her situation, are completely different.