Security Deposit

[harborcondo]

What is the name of your state (only U.S. law)? California

I rented a condo for 8 years and 2 months. I gave the proper 30 day notice to the landlord. I was not offered a walk-thru so on July 29th, requested one from the landlord, it was scheduled for July 31st, my last day there. The landlord had me sign the walk thru papers (I had a witness w/me as did she) and I disagreed with what she planned on charging me for and wrote next to the items on the paperwork that I disagreed.

She is planning on charging me for the closet door in the master bedroom, which came out of the hinges 3 days prior to moving out. She showed the place the week prior and opened and shut the door so she knew that it had been working the week prior. I disagreed with having to pay for this as the unit is infested with termites and the closet door frame is almost hollow from it, I did take pictures.

She also wants to charge me for a hole in the front closet that was chewed by a rat. I informed her that I had a rat problem the prior year and was not aware of the hole until I was moving out as there were shoes in front of it and I did not see it until the closet was empty. A friend took care of the rats as I was scared she was going to raise the rent if i reported anything as she had on numerous occasions (raised the rent). I informed her that a side yard that was maintained by her was a rat breeding ground (I have pictures of it). For 8 years and 2 months, she stored a refrigerator, washer, dryer and numerous other items. This side yard is gated and I did not have access to it. I personally saw 2 rats crawl from her side yard through the drainage hole that leads into my patio. She said I was still responsible for the rat damage.

She also wants to charge me for cleaning out the cupboards as she stated they were not in a condition to be painted. There were several stains and marks in the cupboards, but again, I was there 8 years and 2 months.

I signed the walk thru paperwork and wrote "disagree" next to the items that I disagreed about. It is now 2 weeks later and I have not received a copy of the walk thru. I received an email from the landlord yesterday stating that she is doing "many" repairs to the condo and waiting for invoices. She also stated that I would be getting "some" money back.

She never gave me the opportunity to fix anything and is charging me for several things that were not on the walk-thru paperwork when I signed it...What are my rights???

 

[Banned_Princess]

What is the name of your state (only U.S. law)? California

I rented a condo for 8 years and 2 months. I gave the proper 30 day notice to the landlord. I was not offered a walk-thru so on July 29th, requested one from the landlord, it was scheduled for July 31st, my last day there. The landlord had me sign the walk thru papers (I had a witness w/me as did she) and I disagreed with what she planned on charging me for and wrote next to the items on the paperwork that I disagreed.

She is planning on charging me for the closet door in the master bedroom, which came out of the hinges 3 days prior to moving out. She showed the place the week prior and opened and shut the door so she knew that it had been working the week prior. I disagreed with having to pay for this as the unit is infested with termites and the closet door frame is almost hollow from it, I did take pictures.

She also wants to charge me for a hole in the front closet that was chewed by a rat. I informed her that I had a rat problem the prior year and was not aware of the hole until I was moving out as there were shoes in front of it and I did not see it until the closet was empty. A friend took care of the rats as I was scared she was going to raise the rent if i reported anything as she had on numerous occasions (raised the rent). I informed her that a side yard that was maintained by her was a rat breeding ground (I have pictures of it). For 8 years and 2 months, she stored a refrigerator, washer, dryer and numerous other items. This side yard is gated and I did not have access to it. I personally saw 2 rats crawl from her side yard through the drainage hole that leads into my patio. She said I was still responsible for the rat damage.

She also wants to charge me for cleaning out the cupboards as she stated they were not in a condition to be painted. There were several stains and marks in the cupboards, but again, I was there 8 years and 2 months.

I signed the walk thru paperwork and wrote "disagree" next to the items that I disagreed about. It is now 2 weeks later and I have not received a copy of the walk thru. I received an email from the landlord yesterday stating that she is doing "many" repairs to the condo and waiting for invoices. She also stated that I would be getting "some" money back.

She never gave me the opportunity to fix anything and is charging me for several things that were not on the walk-thru paperwork when I signed it...What are my rights???

Sue this landlord, bring your pictures, you might possibly win. Wear and tear.

 

[Searchertwin]

Doesn't matter who asked for a walk-through, point is, it was done.
The reason for walk-through is for things that both parties agree and disagree upon, which you did.

Closet door - even if it was only minutes before vacating and you still are in possession of place it is still your place to maintain it.
At any time, did you send LL a letter informing her of the termites? If not, how do you expect her to take care of the problem? Pictures are good, but not good enough if you didn't inform LL of problem in writing.

The hole in front closet. Again, did you inform LL in a letter stating the problems with rats? Raising the rent is no excuse from you not to inform the LL of a problems with rats. Hole is consider damage.

If the rats were a problem, why did you keep renewing your lease for 8 years and not inform LL in letter about your problems? Also if you would have indicated the damages from rats in those letters you would have been covered.

Stains on cupboards are damages. Marks would be something else. If they can be just wiped down, wear and tear. If they are permanent, or deep scratches they are damaged.

Even after a walk-through and place is vacated, one can see things that are more visable when the furniture is gone. So yes, many things can be noted that wasn't noted at time of walk-through.

Your rights? Wait for final paperwork and your deposit that is going to be return if any. List the things you disagree with, send letter to her for your dispute. If this fails, take her to court. But make sure you know the difference between wear and tear and damages. Even if your friend saw this and took care of this, will not be of any help, unless YOU sent letters to LL informing of him of problems and damages caused by the problems , rats, etc. and gave him time to fix the problems. Good luck

 

[harborcondo]

Yes, a walk thru was done; however, it was only done because I requested it 2 days prior to the end of my lease.

California law requires the landlord to notify the tenant in writing of his or her option to request an initial inspection and of his or her right to be present at the inspection, she did not do this. It also states the landlord must do this within a reasonable time so that the tenant has time to make repairs themselves to prevent deductions from the security deposit.

I surely would have attempted to make the repairs myself to avoid deductions from my deposit.

 

[harborcondo]

"Even after a walk-through and place is vacated, one can see things that are more visable when the furniture is gone. So yes, many things can be noted that wasn't noted at time of walk-through."

The walk thru was done on July 31st, the condo was completely empty at that time and when the walk thru was done, I surrendered the keys and never went back.

 

[Searchertwin]

"Even after a walk-through and place is vacated, one can see things that are more visable when the furniture is gone. So yes, many things can be noted that wasn't noted at time of walk-through."

The walk thru was done on July 31st, the condo was completely empty at that time and when the walk thru was done, I surrendered the keys and never went back.

That day before you handed her the keys, you had the opportunity to fix the things that you listed: Cupboard, the hole, and the closet door. It would have taken maybe an hour to do all three. The hole, if it had to be sheet rock, mudded and painted, would have taken a few hours. Using a blow dryer would have sped up the mud drying. The thing is, you knew the damage that was there prior to moving. You could have fixed the problems at any time, but chose not to. So who do you want to have fix them? There was not one certified reg letter to LL for repairs, you were afraid to say anything. Each year, for 8 years, you could have highlighted the problems with a amendment to the lease. YOU chose not to. So who is at fault?

 

[harborcondo]

The hole in the closet was discovered 1 week prior to moving out as it was near the floor and a pair of boots was obstructing it. I DID notify her of the hole the very day I discovered it as she showed the place.

The closet door happened on July 28th, 3 days prior to my moving out and no, I did not tell her about that until the day of the inspection, I am at fault for that.

As far as the cupboards, there is no physical damage, just marks from my pans as the cupboards are painted white and I thought it would be considered normal wear and tear, apparently not according to you.

California law states the landlord has to give you "reasonable" time to fix the items (they suggest 2 weeks)....

Again, she added numerous things to the walk thru paperwork AFTER I signed it and had vacated the residence....this is legal??? Our walk thru took 2-1/2 hours, so it's not like she wasn't thorough when we did it.

 

[Searchertwin]

Hole in closet - Even if you did notify her, YOU are still liable for the damage. Again, you had time to fix it, YOU CHOSE not to. Whose fault?

Closet door -What is the difference of admitting this damage and not the above? Was it because you notified her? So what, it still is damage that YOU caused.

According to what I said? I said, "Stains on cupboards are damages. Marks would be something else. If they can be just wiped down, wear and tear. If they are permanent, or deep scratches they are damaged.'
If paint can hide the marks, why didn't you just paint. Problem solved. You seem to forget YOU have to make an effort to clean, and repair the place BACK TO CONDITION, you found it in.

"reasonable time" the word comes into play "SUGGEST" does not mean REQUIRED. You had weeks to do the repairs and YOU CHOSE NOT TO. The time when you were moving and notice things that needed to be painted, (cupboard), YOU CHOSE NOT TO. Common sense indicates that these needed to be done. But it is easier to argue than do the work. Tenants believe it is easier for LL to do the cleaning and repairing. But give back their deposit. Am I right?

2 1/2 hours is plenty of time to do a walk-through, but when one has to clean and do repairs, which in this case I believe they had to, you notice things that you did not see by just walking around and looking. For instance, I bet the stains under the cupboard was one. Am I right?

 

[harborcondo]

Hole in closet - Even if you did notify her, YOU are still liable for the damage. Again, you had time to fix it, YOU CHOSE not to. Whose fault?

Closet door -What is the difference of admitting this damage and not the above? Was it because you notified her? So what, it still is damage that YOU caused.

According to what I said? I said, "Stains on cupboards are damages. Marks would be something else. If they can be just wiped down, wear and tear. If they are permanent, or deep scratches they are damaged.'
If paint can hide the marks, why didn't you just paint. Problem solved. You seem to forget YOU have to make an effort to clean, and repair the place BACK TO CONDITION, you found it in.

"reasonable time" the word comes into play "SUGGEST" does not mean REQUIRED. You had weeks to do the repairs and YOU CHOSE NOT TO. The time when you were moving and notice things that needed to be painted, (cupboard), YOU CHOSE NOT TO. Common sense indicates that these needed to be done. But it is easier to argue than do the work. Tenants believe it is easier for LL to do the cleaning and repairing. But give back their deposit. Am I right?

2 1/2 hours is plenty of time to do a walk-through, but when one has to clean and do repairs, which in this case I believe they had to, you notice things that you did not see by just walking around and looking. For instance, I bet the stains under the cupboard was one. Am I right?

I understand that I am responsible for the rat hole and closet door, I accept that.

I should have not used "stain" to describe the cupboards, they were marks, which were caused by my pots and pans over the course of the 8 years and 2 months that I resided in the condo. There was no damage to the cupboards.

I thoroughly cleaned the condo and left it in as good of condition if not better than when I moved in. There were a couple of minor stains on the carpet; however, she had them removed and replaced them with "maple like" floors as she stated in her rental ad.

I received the remainder of my deposit back yesterday, which was within the 21 days, she kept just under $1,000 for repairs. She included an itemized list with 2 invoices. The invoices are from the same man (no business name) although the invoices are different. There are not invoices for 7 items. She is charging me a $200 cleaning fee even though the condo was as clean, if not cleaner, than when I moved in (I have numerous photos), no invoice for this. She is charging me $200 for a "flea bomb," there were no fleas in the condo the entire time I was there. I'm highly allergic to anything that bites (ie fleas, spiders, mosquito's, severe allergy to bees) and I would not have been able to stand living with fleas. I have a dog, but use frontline plus to prevent fleas and ticks.

Can she charge me $200 for cleaning a condo that was very clean??? As I stated earlier, there are marks on the cupboards from my pots and pans, but that was it. Can she charge me $200 for a "flea bomb" when there was never any fleas to begin with??? Is she required to included invoices and receipts for everything she charged? She included 2 invoices, but nothing for all of the other things. On the bottom of her itemized list, she stated, "Copies of invoices available upon request (2 copies included)."

 

[Searchertwin]

If you thoroughly cleaned as you stated, than the cupboard should have not been left with the marks of pots and pans. Using "I've been there 8 years", does not give you a reason to leave something like that not clean and/or not painted. What is clean to you is not clean to me.

An invoice does not have to be from a company. One can hire their neighbor to do the work. The LL can do the work.
There might not have been any fleas, I use front line also, BUT if a new tenant in that SAME apartment cries, "Fleas" guess who has to pay the bill?
Why should the LL pay it when the LL knew you had a pet and with a pet come fleas. It is in the best interest of the LL to use a "flea bomb". This way it comes out of YOUR deposit and not the LL pocket. If you didn't have a pet, there would have been no flea problem in the future. You being allergic to fleas doesn't prove anything to the LL that you do not have fleas.

The LL has sent you a itemized list within the time frame. Everything sound reasonable to me. Even stating "copies of invoices available", sounds like she got everything covered in case you sue. So good luck.

 

[harborcondo]

If you thoroughly cleaned as you stated, than the cupboard should have not been left with the marks of pots and pans. Using "I've been there 8 years", does not give you a reason to leave something like that not clean and/or not painted. What is clean to you is not clean to me.

An invoice does not have to be from a company. One can hire their neighbor to do the work. The LL can do the work.
There might not have been any fleas, I use front line also, BUT if a new tenant in that SAME apartment cries, "Fleas" guess who has to pay the bill?
Why should the LL pay it when the LL knew you had a pet and with a pet come fleas. It is in the best interest of the LL to use a "flea bomb". This way it comes out of YOUR deposit and not the LL pocket. If you didn't have a pet, there would have been no flea problem in the future. You being allergic to fleas doesn't prove anything to the LL that you do not have fleas.

The LL has sent you a itemized list within the time frame. Everything sound reasonable to me. Even stating "copies of invoices available", sounds like she got everything covered in case you sue. So good luck.

You are correct that an invoice does not have to be from a company, but it does have to be reasonable. I just spoke to the DA (handles landlord tenant laws in our area) and he said living in a place for 8 years and 2 months DOES have bearing on the situation, he stated she CAN NOT charge me $200 for cleaning nor can she charge me $200 for a "flea bomb." He also stated that since I had a separate pet deposit, she would have had to refer to that on the invoice regarding the flea bomb, which she did not. He also stated that she can not charge me $50 for 2 mailbox keys when they cost $6.00 each, the most she could have charged me is $12.00.

He recommended that I send a certified letter requesting this money back and if she doesn't comply with it within 14 days, take her to small claims court for the money as well as damages.

He also said that she should have notified me of my right for an initial walk thru, which she did not, the standard is 2 weeks prior to moving out...

 

[Searchertwin]

You stated, "I just spoke to the DA (handles landlord tenant laws in our area) and he said living in a place for 8 years and 2 months DOES have bearing on the situation, he stated she CAN NOT charge me $200 for cleaning nor can she charge me $200 for a "flea bomb."

Sorry, in my opinion, the DA is wrong in this. Living there for 8 years plus does not constitute you a free ride from not cleaning. And also for the "flea bomb"...if she used a professional company and charged you for this, she is entitled to the amount.

He also stated that since I had a separate pet deposit, she would have had to refer to that on the invoice regarding the flea bomb, which she did not.

I agree on the pet deposit and if she refer this amount to the pet deposit as the DA states, than you lose that amount from the pet deposit. Either way you lose the $200.00

You stated, "He recommended that I send a certified letter requesting this money back and if she doesn't comply with it within 14 days, take her to small claims court for the money as well as damages."

If a tenant feels that he has been "taken", the normal thing to do which DA suggested, is to send cert letter requesting money back. BUT, if it was me and I know this is just a "scare tactic" on the DA and your part, I would stand firm on my deductions.

 

[harborcondo]

You stated, "I just spoke to the DA (handles landlord tenant laws in our area) and he said living in a place for 8 years and 2 months DOES have bearing on the situation, he stated she CAN NOT charge me $200 for cleaning nor can she charge me $200 for a "flea bomb."

Sorry, in my opinion, the DA is wrong in this. Living there for 8 years plus does not constitute you a free ride from not cleaning. And also for the "flea bomb"...if she used a professional company and charged you for this, she is entitled to the amount.

He also stated that since I had a separate pet deposit, she would have had to refer to that on the invoice regarding the flea bomb, which she did not.

I agree on the pet deposit and if she refer this amount to the pet deposit as the DA states, than you lose that amount from the pet deposit. Either way you lose the $200.00

You stated, "He recommended that I send a certified letter requesting this money back and if she doesn't comply with it within 14 days, take her to small claims court for the money as well as damages."

If a tenant feels that he has been "taken", the normal thing to do which DA suggested, is to send cert letter requesting money back. BUT, if it was me and I know this is just a "scare tactic" on the DA and your part, I would stand firm on my deductions.

You are and have been implying that I didn't clean the place. Throughout my tenancy, I kept my place very clean....wouldn't have it any other way. When I removed all of my belongings, I thoroughly cleaned....scrubed all floors on my hands and knees, wiped down all the baseboards, scrubbed bathrooms, windows (inside and out), window sills, cupboards, closets...there were marks on the cupboards as I stated earlier from my pans, which were painted white 8 years and 2 months earlier. It is NOT reasonable to charge someone $200 to clean a place that is already clean.

It is also not reasonable to charge me $200 for a "flea bomb" when there weren't any fleas. The numerous friends I had over throughout my tenancy are willing to testify to this.

I will do as the DA suggested and report back after the results are in.

Clearly you are a very jilted landlord.....reading through your prior posts, an attorney you are not.

 

[jumac]

OP just so you know on the cleaning part. Some LL will call in a cleaning company to clean a aparment every time a tenant leaves. I had a LL who did this and even though Me and a few faimly members went through the house top to bottem and left it in better shap then when I moved in. When I talk to a lawyer bout fighting it was told that this was common and that courts would alow it to be charged to the SD. He said he had been a lawyer in a few states and it was common in everyone he worked in.

 

[Searchertwin]

You are and have been implying that I didn't clean the place. Throughout my tenancy, I kept my place very clean....wouldn't have it any other way. When I removed all of my belongings, I thoroughly cleaned....scrubed all floors on my hands and knees, wiped down all the baseboards, scrubbed bathrooms, windows (inside and out), window sills, cupboards, closets...there were marks on the cupboards as I stated earlier from my pans, which were painted white 8 years and 2 months earlier. It is NOT reasonable to charge someone $200 to clean a place that is already clean.

It is also not reasonable to charge me $200 for a "flea bomb" when there weren't any fleas. The numerous friends I had over throughout my tenancy are willing to testify to this.

I will do as the DA suggested and report back after the results are in.

Clearly you are a very jilted landlord.....reading through your prior posts, an attorney you are not.

What is clean to you is not clean to me. You just can't seem to understand that the place has to be return in the SAME condition it was when you rented. You stated, "there were marks on the cupboards as I stated earlier from my pans, which were painted white 8 years and 2 months earlier"
It doesn't take much to see that you NEVER cleaned that area or any other area ,for 8 years and 2 months. What part do you not understand? Ask the DA about that.
No, not a jilted LL, when I first started the rental business, came close and that was an eye opener. To many years and tenants that I can see right through them, like I can see through this. So can many others. Except for the DA. Still can't see how he said you don't have to clean after living there for 8 year plus. Good luck and when the results come back in from court, just don't tell us, show us the court documents. Any one can say they won.