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Shared Custody, but barely??

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What is the name of your state (only U.S. law)? VA

I have a child support hearing coming up due to the request of a review by the NCP. (Our Custody CO states that I have primary physical with he having visitation, there is no shared/split custody plan and we do have joint legal custody)

He requests that, “The court hear the matter as to how much child support should be paid to ‘x’ pursuant to the applicable child support guidelines for the joint custody chart or shared custody chart, whichever is determined to be appropriate by the courts. I now have joint legal custody of ‘kiddo’ and have Physical Custody at least 90 days of the calendar year per CO dated Feb 17th, 2010”

For the following reasons: ‘Currently have another support case filed with the ‘same city’ and one with ‘another county’ which I have filed a motion to be transferred to the ‘same city’ For the purpose of having all cases held in the same court at the same time so that all four children receive the appropriate amounts of support by the court.”

#1) 90 days: I understand that VA code states that if a party has custody or visitation of a child for more than 90 days of the year than they use the ‘shared custody worksheet’ (and I get the ½ day, full day thing) My question concerns ‘custody share’ provision. NCP only has 93.5 days a year in visitation according to the most current CO, which includes three weeks of vacation and extensive summer visits…How will this affect my CS amount since the initial figure was based on ‘sole’ custody only? I also read that these are just ‘guidelines’ and the judge ultimately can make whatever decision he would like. NCP pays no health ins, no daycare costs (we are both f/t employed) and he recently began new employment approx. 90 days ago, (was previously employed at the same place for 15 years, so had 3 weeks of vacation time per year) so I highly doubt he will be able to exercise the vacation provision in the CO. (Not to mention I must be give at least 30 days advance notice and our hearing is in early Aug, unlikely he would be able to take 3 weeks in 3 months, but I guess that’s purely speculation). I would like to ask that the support continue to be based on sole custody guidelines since the max he would see kiddo is 3.5 days more than the cutoff.

#2) As of our first ever support hearing last year he had no other cases filed through DCSE. Mine was the first. How will having another CSE case the same city and one from another county added, affect the amount determined? Can he transfer from county to city like he says he has?

#3) I have also read that new statutes, or at least revised ones, are released on 7/1 of each year…Is there anywhere this would be readily available to me on the internet when it is released?

I've been told that there aren’t too many folks here familiar with VA CSE, but if you have any ideas or experience with similar issues, I would appreciate any help at all.
 


Alright, so I DON'T get the 'day, 1/2 day thing'

Definition of a day. For the purposes of this section, "day" means a period of 24 hours; however, where the parent who has the fewer number of overnight periods during the year has an overnight period with a child, but has physical custody of the shared child for less than 24 hours during such overnight period, there is a presumption that each parent shall be allocated one-half of a day of custody for that period.

1)What if the other parent sees the child for a few hours in the afternoon? Not overnight, just from 4:30 to 7:30 pm. Is this still considered 1/2 day??

2)'has an overnight period with a child, but has physical custody of the shared child for less than 24 hours during such overnight period' ...does physical custody literally mean WITH the other parent? What if they are dropped off at their child-care facility for 7+ hours that day...is that a full day or 1/2 day since the custodial parent is responsible for child-care costs associated with both folks working? Or are they saying if the child is picked up at 6pm on Monday and dropped off at daycare at 8 am Tuesday then that is a 1/2 day?

OG--I searched past posts and saw one from '07 that you responded to with the guidelines...but I still have questions, would you mind taking a look?

Also, our visitation CO's have changed once this year (FEB) and motion to amend has been filed for the school period, how will this effect the 'days' count if the second visitation hearing is not before the CS hearing? I don't believe it affects the count, but our current CO regarding summer visitation does not specifically state that it terminates at the start of school, hence the motion to amend.

I get turned around the more I read...

Anyone??
 
Continuance(?)

If I disagree with dad's assessment of shared time and his calculation of days placing him above the threshold do I need to file a response with the court as I would with a visitation hearing or would I be able to say so at the support hearing and present my calendar?

Also, I was served with visitation summons yesterday and the date is 45 days after the support hearing. Since this CS hearing is based upon 'shared time,' do I have the right (and would it be a good idea to...) file and request a continuance for the CS hearing until after the visitation hearing?

Will the courts/judge/CSE automatically request that he provide an earning statement or should I subpoena his?
 

nextwife

Senior Member
Why are you presuming he won't get the same amount of vacation now as before? When I changed jobs, I negotiated vacation comparable to what I had been getting, as I am sure many people do. I also got certain days off scheduled right off the bat for dates for which I had prior commitments. Have you checked, or are you merely presuming he won't be available for his days?

Most working parents do not actually have physical custody of their children during regular business hours. Their children go to camp, summer programs, school, etc during most weekdays. Just because dad, or you, may be working during the day, shouldn't mean you can't have those evenings together. My kiddo used to crash by 7:30, as would many younger kids, especially after a summer day at camp, so anything after 7:30 or so would be sleepy time anyway. Is 4:30 to & 7:30 really very different than a CP who works a full days sees their kid after work?
 
Why are you presuming he won't get the same amount of vacation now as before? When I changed jobs, I negotiated vacation comparable to what I had been getting, as I am sure many people do. I also got certain days off scheduled right off the bat for dates for which I had prior commitments. Have you checked, or are you merely presuming he won't be available for his days?

Yes, presuming...I thought I had stated this was speculation. I'm just trying to clarify things in my own mind.

Most working parents do not actually have physical custody of their children during regular business hours. Their children go to camp, summer programs, school, etc during most weekdays. Just because dad, or you, may be working during the day, shouldn't mean you can't have those evenings together. My kiddo used to crash by 7:30, as would many younger kids, especially after a summer day at camp, so anything after 7:30 or so would be sleepy time anyway. Is 4:30 to & 7:30 really very different than a CP who works a full days sees their kid after work?[/QUOTE

The CO states from 2 pm Monday to 8 am Wednesday. That's 1 1/2 days, correct?

So an hourly evening visitation is likely to be viewed as a 1/2 day, correct?

That point may be moot since the upcoming visitation hearing calls for an overnight, not just an evening hourly visit.

Support is likely to be based on the future visitation/custody share, not the past...right??

(thanks, btw)
 
Whether or not you like the cut-off, he passed it. Period. It's not "about 90 days, but if it's over that we'll still consider mom to have sole custody so she can have more money." Kiddo is his too. You happen to have the privilege of more time with Kiddo. You SHARE custody with dad. If your beed if that you don't think he has enough time to qualify as shared, then go to court and request a modification so he has more time with Kiddo so more expenses are directly put on him.

90 days is 90 days is share custody, whether he has exactly 90 days or 93.5 days.
 
Whether or not you like the cut-off, he passed it. Period. It's not "about 90 days, but if it's over that we'll still consider mom to have sole custody so she can have more money." Kiddo is his too. You happen to have the privilege of more time with Kiddo. You SHARE custody with dad. If your beed if that you don't think he has enough time to qualify as shared, then go to court and request a modification so he has more time with Kiddo so more expenses are directly put on him.

90 days is 90 days is share custody, whether he has exactly 90 days or 93.5 days.
Perhaps. But they are only 'guidelines' after all.
However, the shared custody worksheet calculates on a 'per diem' basis. I would rather have my own figure instead of relying on his.

Any thoughts on the continuance?
 
Since you're asking my thoughts, here you go:

Let it go.

If the tables were reversed and you got to see your kids just 93.5 days of the year, far fewer than you'd like to see them while the other parent for about 3x as much time, how you you feel if Dad was coming after you for more support because he has the privilege of the majority of the kids' time? How would you feel with him wanting you to pay more money because he gets what you want? If he feels you should pay for more expenses, he should give them to you so that you're directly paying more. He'd have fewer expenses and you'd have more time. This is fair, right?

So if you think he's not paying you enough, let's presume because of how much you're paying for things like food, give him more days with the kids that are equally his and let him provide for them.

Quit trying to make a big deal out of this. Don't add a bunch of stress. For your kids' sake, don't try to cause a big battle where one shouldn't be.
 
Since you're asking my thoughts, here you go:

Let it go.

If the tables were reversed and you got to see your kids just 93.5 days of the year, far fewer than you'd like to see them while the other parent for about 3x as much time, how you you feel if Dad was coming after you for more support because he has the privilege of the majority of the kids' time? How would you feel with him wanting you to pay more money because he gets what you want? If he feels you should pay for more expenses, he should give them to you so that you're directly paying more. He'd have fewer expenses and you'd have more time. This is fair, right?

So if you think he's not paying you enough, let's presume because of how much you're paying for things like food, give him more days with the kids that are equally his and let him provide for them.

Quit trying to make a big deal out of this. Don't add a bunch of stress. For your kids' sake, don't try to cause a big battle where one shouldn't be.
Well...

Our child is 5, turning 6 in Sept. The first time NCP had ever laid eyes on her was in Aug. of 09. Totally his choice. There was no support case until visitation commenced. We have gradually increased visitation over the past year as it is their right to know one another and I have always hoped he would decide to include her as a part of his family. To be perfectly honest I feel like he gets MORE than the normal share and the time is definitely at the cusp of what my daughter is comfortable with.

His salary is the quadruple of mine and I'm no millionaire, but I do okay. I am also single and raising another child at home so the struggle is still there...everyday. He does NOT pay support and is almost 7k in arrears. He's a sly cat...and has pulled some pretty impressive stunts when it comes to avoiding enforcement and punishments for non-payment. Since the initial support hearing he has been granted two reviews for various reasons and his support was subsequently lowered both times.

I'm not on some kind of vendetta. All in all I feel like I'm trying to stand up for myself and my family. This is for her sake. He and I don't even discuss support...It's not something worth speaking about, really. I want to talk about her and what she's done with him and the stuff that really matters.

Furthermore, I deal with financial burdens and collections of an entirely different sort and I realize that this is nothing more than a mathematical equation. I am simply trying to learn the variable values. There's no stress in that. I apologize if my post presents that way.

So, do you think I should petition for a continuance until after the visitation hearing so that all parties involved will have a more solid understanding of the actual shared time of kiddo? I really only have one shot at this for the next three years unless circumstances change drastically on either end.
 

stealth2

Under the Radar Member
I likely would petition for a continuance, with the understanding that the request may be denied.

And ignore QoE. It's a troll.
 
Geez, now I feel silly for responding.

Continuances are nothing more than a formal letter requesting the postponement of a hearing for *whatever* reason, correct? There's no special form I fill out?

Thanks S.
 
Continuance Denied

Apparently when DCSE is involved with a support hearing (as with this one), continuances are NEVER granted. The best I can do is state my request for continuance in court and see if the big J agrees.
 
On the shared custody child support guidelines worksheet there is a place to enter 'Monthly tax savings from child-care deductions or credit'...how is this figured?

I have sole physical custody, he is below the threshold for his support to be based on the 'shared' worksheet, but it's close, and I want to be prepared in case the J decides to rule in his favor.

Is this for a FSA where I wouldn't pay taxes on her childcare? Or is this for the child tax credit received at the end of the year or is this for the 'break' I receive at the end of the year for my childcare expenses?? Or a combo of the three??? Does anyone know?

Also, he voluntarily added her onto his insurance through his employer, probably b/c he works for a provider and has so many other children that adding one more doesn't cost any more. There's also a place on the worksheet for his insurance to be factored...since the CO states that I am to provide coverage, and he added her voluntarily ( I was thinking to protect himself as he is responsible for approx. 70% of uninsured costs) will he receive any credit for the insurance?
 

LdiJ

Senior Member
On the shared custody child support guidelines worksheet there is a place to enter 'Monthly tax savings from child-care deductions or credit'...how is this figured?

I have sole physical custody, he is below the threshold for his support to be based on the 'shared' worksheet, but it's close, and I want to be prepared in case the J decides to rule in his favor.

Is this for a FSA where I wouldn't pay taxes on her childcare? Or is this for the child tax credit received at the end of the year or is this for the 'break' I receive at the end of the year for my childcare expenses?? Or a combo of the three??? Does anyone know?
They are talking about the daycare credit that you get on your tax return. Just figure out how much credit you received for last year and divide it by 12. If you received no daycare credit for last year, then put 0.

Also, he voluntarily added her onto his insurance through his employer, probably b/c he works for a provider and has so many other children that adding one more doesn't cost any more. There's also a place on the worksheet for his insurance to be factored...since the CO states that I am to provide coverage, and he added her voluntarily ( I was thinking to protect himself as he is responsible for approx. 70% of uninsured costs) will he receive any credit for the insurance?
He shouldn't since it doesn't cost him anything, but if he tries to claim a credit, and the judge feels he should have it, then it should be no more than the cost of the family benefit divided by the number of children included on the plan.
 
Hey, thanks.

I pay child care on two children: one f/t, one f/t for 10 wks and p/t for the remainder of the year. How should that work? I think that even though I paid almost $13k in childcare expenses last year my credit was only for $5k, it's doesn't seem correct that even though her (the child in question) expenses are the lower, that he actually receive credit for it...
 

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