smoking ban a violation of civil rights?

[emilye]

smoking ban a violation of civil rights? (seriously)

What is the name of your state? Colorado

Ok, let me apologize in advance if this sounds ridiculous. Colorado is on the verge of passing a statewide smoking ban in ALL indoor public places (only exceptions are casinos, cigar bars/shops, and smoking lounge at DIA). ALL bars and restaurants are included in this ban. I say thank God for this and I only wish it had happened sooner. When governor signs the bill, it will go into effect on July 1st of this year.

I work in a nightclub/bar/restaurant. Most of the employees smoke, and by estimate I would say 10-20% of the customers do as well.

Some of the people I work with are talking (out their a**es I think) about getting together and filing a "class action suit based on violation of their civil rights." Apparently they think they have a "civil right" to smoke inside after a statewide ban has been enacted.

Admittedly I do not really know much about what my or anyone's "civil rights" are, I have heard the term thrown around so flagrantly, it seems to mean something different to everyone.

So I guess question is this: When the ban takes effect July 1, 2006, is there a civil right being violated? If so what exactly does it say, and where could someone look it up? The ban doesn't prevent them from smoking, just from smoking inside public places.

These "civil rights activists" also think the establishment will shut down as a result (even though a statewide smoking ban seems to have been successful in California and the 17 other states its already in, and I believe the restaurants and bars have survived it quite well), and feel that would be another violation of their "civil rights" to lose their jobs if the club goes out of business as a result of the ban.

 

[ENASNI]

What is the name of your state? Colorado

Ok, let me apologize in advance if this sounds ridiculous. Colorado is on the verge of passing a statewide smoking ban in ALL indoor public places (only exceptions are casinos, cigar bars/shops, and smoking lounge at DIA). ALL bars and restaurants are included in this ban. I say thank God for this and I only wish it had happened sooner. When governor signs the bill, it will go into effect on July 1st of this year.

I work in a nightclub/bar/restaurant. Most of the employees smoke, and by estimate I would say 10-20% of the customers do as well.

Some of the people I work with are talking (out their a**es I think) about getting together and filing a "class action suit based on violation of their civil rights." Apparently they think they have a "civil right" to smoke inside after a statewide ban has been enacted.

Admittedly I do not really know much about what my or anyone's "civil rights" are, I have heard the term thrown around so flagrantly, it seems to mean something different to everyone.

So I guess question is this: When the ban takes effect July 1, 2006, is there a civil right being violated? If so what exactly does it say, and where could someone look it up? The ban doesn't prevent them from smoking, just from smoking inside public places.

Somebody should talk to Californians... Already happened here emilye. So what do you think?

 

[averad]

And in Washington (state)

Washington, 8 December 2005 banned in all workplaces, including bars, restaurants, bowling alleys, and non-tribal casinos. Also bans smoking while standing within 25 feet of a door or window that can open or a ventilation intake.

Currently it is the strictest smoking ban by state in the country.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_smoking_bans

 

[emilye]

I know...

Somebody should talk to Californians... Already happened here emilye. So what do you think?

I know about California, and quite enjoyed going out when I was there due to the state's ban. My question isn't will this work, I have no doubt it will. My question, although I wrote so much it was easy to get lost in OP, is this:

What are "civil rights"
Where can they be looked up and reviewe
And are they open to interpretetion or are they hard and fast?

People seem to always say their civil rights have been violated for everything.

 

[averad]

http://www.forces.org/articles/linda/linda1.htm

 

[emilye]

Its funny that some of my coworkers have tried to make the same arguements made in that link, or something similar. They say: First we aren't allowed to smoke, next we won't be allowed to drink, then we won't be allowed to eat red meat...etc

I guess I missed the part of the ban that says they can't smoke or that smoking itself is banned. Its not the disgusting act that is banned, it is the location.

There are many things that are not allowed in public: nudity, having sex, urinating... (spitting is even illegal in one city here, it is also unlawful to tie your horse's reins to a pole there). Doesn't mean these things are not allowed, the location to do them is simply restricted for the good of the public. And now so with smoking, restricted for the good of the public.

I only wish today was July 1st.

 

[emilye]

And in Washington (state)

Washington, 8 December 2005 banned in all workplaces, including bars, restaurants, bowling alleys, and non-tribal casinos. Also bans smoking while standing within 25 feet of a door or window that can open or a ventilation intake.

Currently it is the strictest smoking ban by state in the country.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_smoking_bans

And so I can let my worried coworkers know... all of your clubs, restaurants and bars didn't go immediately out of business, did they?

 

[emilye]

Somebody should talk to Californians... Already happened here emilye. So what do you think?

I think I wish it happened years ago. I am counting the days, feels like Christmas is coming. Christmas in July!

 

[averad]

And so I can let my worried coworkers know... all of your clubs, restaurants and bars didn't go immediately out of business, did they?

No they have not all burst into flames and declared bankruptcy, but the local bars have roughly 75% less people in them. When the ban was implemented bars were completely empty.

What bars in Washington are doing to get around the ban is charge a member fee and become a private club. So you pay a monthly member fee of $3 or something and you can drink and smoke all you want indoors (any you usually get a stupid member card).

 

[emilye]

No they have not all burst into flames and declared bankruptcy, but the local bars have roughly 75% less people in them. When the ban was implemented bars were completely empty.

What bars in Washington are doing to get around the ban is charge a member fee and become a private club. So you pay a monthly member fee of $3 or something and you can drink and smoke all you want indoors (any you usually get a stupid member card).

They have already derailed that train here. Private clubs are included in the ban already.

My guess it that the smokers will boycott for a few weeks, until the time they get tired of sitting alone in their smoke filled house while their friends are going out having a good time without them. Then they will be back, and will simply step outside to smoke.

I am no psychic, but based on what I see where I work, the smoker's make up 10-20% of the customers. So even if we lost them, I bet there would be some nonsmokers who would come now that they won't have to breathe bad air.

 

[cbg]

Unless they can find something in the US Constitution or their state's constitution granting them the guaranteed right to smoke, or they can point to a law that somehow makes smoking a protected category (such laws exist in a few states but I don't think Colorado is one of them) then a smoking ban does not constitute a violation of civil rights.

 

[emilye]

why is this so hard to find?

I googled "united states civil rights" and

http://www.historicaldocuments.com/CivilRightsAct1964.htm

This seems to be the best thing I can find so far... lots of crap, like one from 1866 that never actually listed the rights.

Any suggestions for one that is better, and/or is this accurate or timely?

I would like a complete, accurate, up to date, list of civil rights in the united states, and preferably something official. Anyone know of a link?

 

[mb94]

Here's the problem finding a set in stone definition of civil rights. They are the rights that you have just for being a citizen. Some of them are spelled out in the constitution (religion and speech) and others are there through court decisions (the right to privacy). Generally it is the things you think of when you live in a free country. But as you pointed out they aren't banning smokers from these places just saying they aren't allowed to smoke while they are there.

You won't go out of business. In Florida it's been pretty good. I know many places are doing more business now because older people and people with children are coming out more (this is of course places that serve food not flat out clubs and bars). Since it sounds like only a small percent of the people are smokers you'll be fine. The only thing to be on watch for is scammer who claim they are just going out to have a smoke when they really are trying to skip out on the bill.

 

[emilye]

thanks

Here's the problem finding a set in stone definition of civil rights. They are the rights that you have just for being a citizen. Some of them are spelled out in the constitution (religion and speech) and others are there through court decisions (the right to privacy). Generally it is the things you think of when you live in a free country. But as you pointed out they aren't banning smokers from these places just saying they aren't allowed to smoke while they are there.

The only thing to be on watch for is scammer who claim they are just going out to have a smoke when they really are trying to skip out on the bill.

Since I have started this, it has been so frustrating trying to find something that seemed it should be simple. As "civil rights" are so commonly referred to, I assumed it would be easy to find a list of them. Boy was I wrong. Are people really referring to the Bill of Rights combined with Constitution and ammendments? Sorry to sound ignorant, but apparently I am when it comes to this topic.

Side note, good advice about people trying to skip out on a bill, thankfully I am a bartender and policy is we keep credit cards for all tabs. Good point though.

 

[cbg]

Although a lot of people evidently slept through Civics class in high school and think that "Civil rights" refers to a lot more than it really does, yes, we really are talking about the constitution and the Bill of Rights here.

There are also some laws, both state and Federal, that further define protected rights. Title VII would be an example. But with very few exceptions (which are state specific) smoking is not a protected right.