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Son wants to live with me

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LdiJ

Senior Member
Update - I have taken my son to a Counselor as suggested by some posters on this thread. Son liked the idea of being able to talk to someone. He was insistent that we not tell mom and was afraid "she would take it out on him." I told him I will schedule an appointment with the counselor but I expressed we should talk to his mom about it.

He has gone twice and my son really seems to like the counselor. I sat in on the first visit and they talked about school, his teachers, etc as he was trying to build a re pour with him. At the time he asked him to write a journal about his teachers and all the things he wanted to talk about. The following weekend we worked on it together. WORST DAY EVER. As I have mentioned the past 9 + years the ex and I have had a mutual best interest for our son and manged to get along. Certainly there are things she does I do not agree with and I am sure she has her issues with me. With that said we managed to work things out for him but the things he listed wants to talk about were heart breaking. He is in no physical danger is appears and I am not an expert on what mental harm is but there are some serious issues between him and his mom.

The second visit I wanted him to talk to the counselor alone not to be influenced with me being in the room. He said he is really glad he is going. Said he talked about the items on the list etc. I never spoke with the counselor but I am totally at a loss. If my son was in danger I am sure he would have to tell me, but even if he is not in physical danger the feelings he has is not good and could be damaging as well. Maybe since the counselor has not said anything because there is nothing to address and we should keep the visitations and orders alone. I know I need to get his feedback but in the meantime I feel I owe it to my son to get him out of that bad situation.

Very long winded I apologize...

First question - I feel like I have to let his mom know he is seeing this guy but I don't want it to cause a disturbance in my son wanting to go. Legally it says we have to notify and make medical records available and I assume this would be considered medical records.

Second Question - I am more compelled then ever before to talk to his mom about letting him stay with me during school times and she gets visitation or another plan we agree to. Would this still be filed like you would any Modification of Visitation. I am assuming if we both agree it would be easier for the court to grant the modification.

Third Question - If we don't agree and I peruse these changes and we get a GAL appointed do I give him/her his counselor information or does that remain private due to client patient rules?

My gut is telling me to be patient and wait to see what the counselor has to say but it is also telling me to let his mom know and ideally they see the counselor together to work out whatever the issues are. Other part of me is feeling like a bad parent by not getting him out of that situation right now.

Any legal or personal advice would be appreciated. I know many of you have had similar experiences or work on the family law and might have seen a similar situation.
Dad, you have joint custody. Its a really serious problem that you are hiding the counseling sessions from mom. You REALLY needed her agreement to the child being in counseling.

That can REALLY hurt you in court. Let mom know what is going on immediately and try to get her to agree to the counseling continuing.
 


stealth2

Under the Radar Member
I'm really surprised that the counselor agreed to see your son w/o Mom's knowledge or consent.
 
Update - I have taken my son to a Counselor as suggested by some posters on this thread. Son liked the idea of being able to talk to someone. He was insistent that we not tell mom and was afraid "she would take it out on him." I told him I will schedule an appointment with the counselor but I expressed we should talk to his mom about it.
Once again, a ten year old does NOT make those kind of decisions. You are hurting your son by doing this to him. It is not good parenting to 'bond' with your child by making him feel like he is able to make decisions with you against his own mother. It is YOUR JOB, as well as Mom's, to facilitate the LOVING relationship with the other parent. NOT to UNDERMINE it as you continue doing.

He has gone twice and my son really seems to like the counselor. I sat in on the first visit and they talked about school, his teachers, etc as he was trying to build a re pour with him. At the time he asked him to write a journal about his teachers and all the things he wanted to talk about. The following weekend we worked on it together. WORST DAY EVER. As I have mentioned the past 9 + years the ex and I have had a mutual best interest for our son and manged to get along. Certainly there are things she does I do not agree with and I am sure she has her issues with me. With that said we managed to work things out for him but the things he listed wants to talk about were heart breaking. He is in no physical danger is appears and I am not an expert on what mental harm is but there are some serious issues between him and his mom.
You do realize that by working on that list WITH him he's very prone to say/write what he thinks YOU want to hear, right?

The second visit I wanted him to talk to the counselor alone not to be influenced with me being in the room. He said he is really glad he is going. Said he talked about the items on the list etc. I never spoke with the counselor but I am totally at a loss. If my son was in danger I am sure he would have to tell me, but even if he is not in physical danger the feelings he has is not good and could be damaging as well.
What you are doing is damaging.

Maybe since the counselor has not said anything because there is nothing to address and we should keep the visitations and orders alone. I know I need to get his feedback but in the meantime I feel I owe it to my son to get him out of that bad situation.
You owe it to your son to stop doing these kinds of things without working with MOM. It is not your son that you parent with. If you were genuinely concerned about him you would be working WITH her, not pitting him against her. Although you may not be directly saying negative things about her, you are clearly not encouraging a good relationship by allowing things to be kept from her and talking about these issues with your son.

First question - I feel like I have to let his mom know he is seeing this guy but I don't want it to cause a disturbance in my son wanting to go. Legally it says we have to notify and make medical records available and I assume this would be considered medical records.
The decision is not your son's to make. The decision is yours AND Mom's. You better tell her, yesterday. You also better hope she takes it better than any other parent I know. You were legally obligated to tell her before you took son to the first visit. If I were her, I'd have your ass in court on a silver platter for pulling this kind of crap. It is not healthy. It is not in your son's best interest.

For a moment, humor me, and imagine this same scenario reversed. Mom is taking kiddo to a counselor to talk about YOU based on information from a ten year old (which we all know is very unreliable and often is what the child thinks the other parent wants to hear). Mom does not inform you or ask for your input AT ALL about this decision. Mom is also thinking about going back to court to ask that your time be reduced based on what kiddo is saying.

You see how things can spiral out of control with very little basis very quickly? A child of divorce knows their parents don't love each other. They know that one parent doesn't want to hear great, fantastic, amazing things about the other parent. So, when you ask questions they will almost always tell you what they think you want to hear. Anything negative. To gain your approval.

It's a very selfish thing to do. So stop. Be Dad.

[edit: I was typing this as you replied saying you would want to know. Do you know that LEGALLY you are sooooooooooo out of line it is not funny. It will very likely HURT you badly if you go to court or if Mom pursues it.]
 
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stealth2

Under the Radar Member
Yeah, what she said.

Thing is, OP, you are abrogating your responsibility to inform Mom of your decision to have the kiddo see a counselor by telling said counselor "well, if you have to tell her, here's her contact info." Said counselor is NOT bound by your joint custody order. YOU are. Mom's lawyer would chew you to bits if she decided to take you to court.

If you truly care about your son's welfare and best interests, you work WITH Mom. Not behind her back. Because all you are showing is that you would not be a good custodial parent - because you are already showing that you will not encourage an open relationship between her and kiddo.

And no, it is not your place to "help" him with the journal the counselor asked him to write. And intake interview is one thing. Helping him on his "counseling homework"? Is quite another.
 
Again, your stance takes no compasion or understanding with the child. He was asking for the help, needed the help but would not have gone without her. I will choose helping my son everyday of the week. What if god forbid she was physically hurting him or worse? I did not know. What I did know is he was reachng out for help. Your other points are valid and as I have addressed we have maintained a great relationship in regards to our son for 9 years.
Excuse me? Either you are being intentionally obtuse or you are unable to be objective. My response/stance ONLY considers the best interest of the child. Not you. Not Mom. ONLY the child. Perhaps you need to re-read.

He asked for help, he needs help? Fine. I agree that if he didn't before, he certainly will need counseling now.

He wouldn't have gone if Mom knew? You have got to be kidding me. Does he own a gun? Does he abuse you? Has he suddenly turned 18? Sure he would have gone. Because you AND Mom said so. He DOES NOT get to decide that. Once again.:rolleyes:

It goes like this: You and Mom say he's going. He gets in the car and goes. It really IS that simple. Why do you give him so much power?

You keep saying that you and Mom have maintained a great relationship for 9 years. I'm not saying you haven't, but I have to seriously question if you believe that to be true now. You certainly aren't doing a very good job of maintaining that.

Are there some things she is doing that are very harmful, yes but I do believe she loves him.
At the same time, you are doing some harmful things, even though I believe that you love your son.

It really doesn't matter what led you to make these decisions. If you feared for his safety, you would have/should have called CPS. You did not. You went behind Mom's back, illegally, discussed these things with your child, and have proven, at least currently, that you would NOT, as stealth said, make a good custodial parent because not only are you not coparenting with Mom, but you are not facilitating the relationship either.

You posted here asking for opinions and/or advice. You got them. If you choose to ignore/argue them because they're not what you wanted to hear, so be it. It's not MY mess to clean up.
 

gr8rn

Senior Member
Perhabs the court will not care that he was afraid to tell his mom because of potential reprocussions. QUOTE]

Of course the court will not care that he was afraid to tell his mom...again, it was not his "job" to do that, it was yours, and you didn't do that.

Let me reiterate what stealth said because it is pretty important. The counseler is not bound by the court to follow YOUR court orders, YOU are!!

There is no way you are going to smooth this over now. You have set this up for Mom to be angry and resentful because you have taken your son TWICE to see a counseler and have not cleared it with Mom. And truthfully, if you did not hear your son say anything that would compell you to call CYS, then you should have gotten on the phone IMMEDIATELY and told Mom about the counseling.

Another thing, you should NOT have been involved in the journaling at all. Because as another poster said, your son will be putting things in that will please you, and quite frankly, if he has any problems at YOUR home, he would be reluctant to include that in his journal. I take my son to counseling and I want to get 100% of my moneys worth. I want him to work on issues with his father AND with me. And even though his father and I don't get along AT ALL, we are both committed to our son having counseling as long as he needs it.

I wanted to go back to one of your posts on the first page, you said, Mom would not like changing custody because she did not want to lose the child support, It could also be turned around on you and suggested that perhaps, maybe you are looking to change custody so you don't have to pay. Just saying...
 

stealth2

Under the Radar Member
Another thing, you should NOT have been involved in the journaling at all. Because as another poster said, your son will be putting things in that will please you, and quite frankly, if he has any problems at YOUR home, he would be reluctant to include that in his journal. I take my son to counseling and I want to get 100% of my moneys worth. I want him to work on issues with his father AND with me. And even though his father and I don't get along AT ALL, we are both committed to our son having counseling as long as he needs it.
Because, realistically speaking? There isn't a perfect parent/child relationship in the world. There are always things that can be fixed. (And yes, I have kids. Two of them. Both older teens. Who are pretty darned good kids. We have our issues.) So yeah - you should have questioned the counselor's suggestion at your involvement, and you should have stepped back. A simple explanation to your son would have been "Hey, kiddo.... I know you said this is about your relationship with Mom. I think it's good that you have a place to work on that stuff. But I'm figuring there are also things about you and me that you might want to change, but aren't sure how to. So this is a great time to talk to Dr. XYZ about them, too."

As for addressing Mom needing to know? Yes, I would tell the boy. Pretty much like I told mine: "If Mom doesn't know there's a problem, she can't help fix it."
 

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