Speeding Ticket but I'm positive Officer is in Error

[redgrave]

Thank You

Now we are getting somewhere. So I do this at the court house then? Subpoena the records from the officer that is?

 

[seniorjudge]

Now we are getting somewhere. So I do this at the court house then? Subpoena the records from the officer that is?

You plead not guilty.

Then a trial is set.

As part of your discovery, you may subpoena whatever records you think are relevant to your case.

If you subpoena and get the records on the radar, it will show that it was tested shortly before he got you and shortly after he got you. And the records will further show that the gun was in perfect working order on both tests.

 

[poppakeith]

That's just the point I'm making and why I'm asking for some advice. The big thing here in such a situation would be honesty. And if he says something different than what actually happened that is called perjury. It's a sad thing that the only deciding factor here is the officer who is supposed to uphold the law will be believed over the accused even though the officer would be lying. Sounds like a legal system with honesty and integrity to me! So again I readmit my statement that innocent until proven guilty is rubbish. I have to prove that I wasn't travelling at the stated speed and that circumstances permit for a level of error in the reading obtained by the officer. But being that I don't have video cameras mounted on my vehicle my word is the only evidence of this, my word (The puny citizen) vs the word of the officer (upstanding community member) who's to be believed!

Everything you say is a normal and correct response to the reality of the traffic law enforcement business. But, the business is not actually based on the ideals of justice, and eeks along as a practical necessity, cranking out a semblance of justice most of the time, and injustice the rest of the time. Presuming the truth of all you have said, justice would be in a lower fine. Once you move into the presuming, however, envision a judge who is faced with two different stories and no really sound, scientific, irrefutable evidence to show him which of you guys is mistaken in your testimony. You want to save some money (and not feel so rotten about the system) and the cop just don't want to look incompetent or short on good judgement. If you can't make a deal with the cop or show that the radar device mislead the poor fellow, the mercy of the court is all you've got. Lawyers are supposed to know all the tricks of the trade, which makes that route always advisable, but as a private citizen, appealing to the man for mercy, it's always a toss up.

 

[sukharev]

As far as I'm aware an officer can't pull you over and give you a speeding ticket that would hold up in court by saying well sir I estimate you were traveling 82MPH so here's your ticket on my guesstimation? LMAO this place is a joke. That has to be the most absurd statement I have ever heard. Anybody know who I contact about the calibration records for the radar gun? Who holds the records regarding the surveying completed to assign the posted speed limit?

Well, you will eventually find out on your own then. I just told you what would happen. Just FYI, officers are trained to estimate speed, and in fact any experienced driver will tell the difference between 55 and 80 mph.

As to calibration, go google discovery requests, and how they are done. kevinblackwell read too much on the web, and has no clue. Discovery is submitted to DA, not the officer. This is a formal process spelled out in rules of criminal/civil procedure.

And last, drop the attitude. I am fine with you not believing me, but you did come this close to turning down good advice. Same goes to the whole process with court. If you will be cavalier in your approach, and not respectful, you will loose regardless. So, slow down and understand what you are dealing with.

 

[sukharev]

You have to subpoena the radar gun records from the officer. He is supposed to calibrate this and must show this in court if requested. Ask for other records before the court appearance as well; such as other recorded tickets (were there others clocked at 82mph?) prior to yours, etc.

Officer is supposed to TEST, not CALIBRATE. Calibration is done at the certified place once per year. Test is done every time radar is used, before and after the shift. This is mandated by caselaw.

 

[redgrave]

Calibration

Officer is supposed to TEST, not CALIBRATE. Calibration is done at the certified place once per year. Test is done every time radar is used, before and after the shift. This is mandated by caselaw.

To my understanding both of these can come under pressure. Number one the officer must test his gun before and after his shift and also the law requires that the gun be calibrated at certain intervals. I do not plan on going into the court with an attitude as you say. But I do plan on going into court with as much evidence and caselaw as I can to fight my cause because I am not guilty of the violation I was accused of. The problem with the justice system is far too many people just take the advice of oh well it's too much work i'll just plea when they should be fighting for what is right (The Truth). That's why you get your day in court. I'm a little concerned that you consider it an attitude to want to fight against a false accusation. As I said in my original post I have recieved speeding tickets in the past and I have never objected to them because I was speeding but this time I am absolutely positive I was not so I am objecting. I plan on researching at the library this weekend and I will let it be known what happens after I have my day in court wether justice happens or not.

 

[loulblades]

Here's some of the case law you may want to look at:

Ohio v Wall
Ohio v Bonar
Ohio v Colby
Ohio v Freeman
Ohio v Saphire

If you can't find these on the Ohio website I think you can still get temporary access to lawclerk.com.

Good luck and may the shwartz be with you.

 

[redgrave]

Signature?

I was reading No Side Burns post and one of the responses he got refered to the fact that

"Importantly you shold contemplate that the guy accused signs the citation (If he won't do that, the cop can haul him in)."

I was never asked to sign my citation does that have any bearing on my case? Just curious.

 

[sukharev]

To my understanding both of these can come under pressure. Number one the officer must test his gun before and after his shift and also the law requires that the gun be calibrated at certain intervals. I do not plan on going into the court with an attitude as you say. But I do plan on going into court with as much evidence and caselaw as I can to fight my cause because I am not guilty of the violation I was accused of. The problem with the justice system is far too many people just take the advice of oh well it's too much work i'll just plea when they should be fighting for what is right (The Truth). That's why you get your day in court. I'm a little concerned that you consider it an attitude to want to fight against a false accusation. As I said in my original post I have recieved speeding tickets in the past and I have never objected to them because I was speeding but this time I am absolutely positive I was not so I am objecting. I plan on researching at the library this weekend and I will let it be known what happens after I have my day in court wether justice happens or not.

I was referring to this (as attitude):

LMAO this place is a joke. That has to be the most absurd statement I have ever heard.

You choose to ignore the fact that you have a hopeless case. Anything greater than 20 mph over speed limit is practically hopeless, unless you hire an attorney who can work majic with DA. On your own, you will likely wind up arguing with DA about falseness of his accusations, he will tell you to go see the judge, who will be amused by your lame attempts at questioning the obvious, and find you guilty as charged. This is sad truth. Go ahead, I would be happy to hear I am wrong. Maybe you even get lucky and officer does not show, or the judge would be is such a good mood he will let you off with probation...

 

[sukharev]

I was reading No Side Burns post and one of the responses he got refered to the fact that

"Importantly you shold contemplate that the guy accused signs the citation (If he won't do that, the cop can haul him in)."

I was never asked to sign my citation does that have any bearing on my case? Just curious.

Sure, throw that in. Convince the judge police does not follow the required procedure

Seriously, think about it: why would they be required to have you sign the citation?

 

[redgrave]

Signing

I just examined the ticket and there is nowhere on mine that has a place for me to sign except the spot to sign saying i'm guilty.

 

[sukharev]

I just examined the ticket and there is nowhere on mine that has a place for me to sign except the spot to sign saying i'm guilty.

Now you are getting somewhere...

Since your court date is coming up, you don't have a choice but to negotiate with DA. Choose your poison (which is how low does the charge needs to go to get minimum impact on insurance), and if you do not get it, or DA does not negotiate at all, go ahead and plead not guilty. Read up some sample trial transcripts tipmra website has published, they have a good coverage of possible scenarios (like what to do if officer does not show, but trial proceeds, or if DA is not present and the judge wants to try the case himself). Try independent recollection technique to convince the judge that officer does not remember details, such as traffic conditions, therefore that it's possible he got the wrong car. That's your only shot. Hope you learn to listen one day...

 

[redgrave]

I was referring to this (as attitude):

You choose to ignore the fact that you have a hopeless case. Anything greater than 20 mph over speed limit is practically hopeless, unless you hire an attorney who can work majic with DA. On your own, you will likely wind up arguing with DA about falseness of his accusations, he will tell you to go see the judge, who will be amused by your lame attempts at questioning the obvious, and find you guilty as charged. This is sad truth. Go ahead, I would be happy to hear I am wrong. Maybe you even get lucky and officer does not show, or the judge would be is such a good mood he will let you off with probation...

Let me off with probation? What is the matter with you man? Wake Up! This is traffic court we are talking about here! I wasn't accused of going 100MPH!

And tell me this. Do you agree that it is a worthless system if what you find to be a hopeless case is a case of an officer making an error and an idividual having to pay for this error? The things you choose to ignore are the fact that I wasn't travelling even close to a speed 20MPH over the limit, you are looking at this as if I am just blowing hot air out a wind pipe. When in actuality I have told everything just as it had happened.

Let's apply your opinion to a different situation.

You are walking through the park when you come upon a man wearing gloves and a woman arguing. Right at the time you are walking past them the man pulls out a knife and stabs the woman resulting in her death. When the woman was stabbed blood splashed onto you because you were right there when it happened. The man immediately drops the knife after stabbing the woman and runs off. At that moment a police officer comes around the corner pulls his weapon and says get on the ground, places you under arrest and carts you off to jail for murder.

Hopeless story huh?

 

[redgrave]

Da?

Now you are getting somewhere...

Since your court date is coming up, you don't have a choice but to negotiate with DA.

Once again this is traffic court......What DA?

 

[sukharev]

Boy, you are really clueless

Do you think anybody would answer your questions at this point? You do not listen, and you continue to show your attitude. What's the matter with me? I am just trying to help...

1) DA (AKA Government Prosecutor) is the one who will demolish your attempts to defend yourself. You do get to talk to him/her before trial, or the officer, whatever the court rules are. That's your chance to plea bargain (not really a bargain, they offer you a deal, you can take it or not)

2) Probation (AKA PBJ, prayer in judgement, etc.) is offered in certain traffic courts, as a way to give you a break, show mercy or just benefit of a doubt if the judge likes you. You are found guilty, but the ticket is not entered into your record and insurance does not go up. If after 1 year (or other timeframe) you stay clean, no tickets or violations, your ticket is permanently gone. Just FYI, it is NEVER offered to anybody with 100 mph violation. You are toast if you do that.

OK, enough at this point. If you are going to behave like this in court, you will get full fine and no mercy. More power to you.