Teacher needs to know legal procedure on government claim related issue in Calif.

[Humusluvr]

That sounds like a "reasonable" rationalization of the situation, but that is not what is going on.

The providers like "Sylvan" hire people without college degrees -- I know, because I looked into it. They don't hire people with college degrees because they only pay their tutors -- let's say, very little. And why should they pay more? Indeed, the NCLB specifies that there is NO requirement that such a tutoring provider hire "highly qualified" teachers to serve as tutors.

Also, think of this; the federal government has already established what makes a person "highly qualified" to teach a subject. Indeed, not just "qualified," but "highly" qualified.

And think of this; the "reasonable criteria" that state educational agencies are let establish and which I must "meet" to be "approved" to be on the state list of tutoring providers and be able to talk to parents about "choosing" me as a tutor for their kids (where the school must then hire me, having no choice in the matter) ARE QUALIFYING CRITERIA.

What? A "highly qualified" teacher of a subject is not "qualified" as a tutor because the state says so in spite of federal statutes to the contrary?

I think one of my attacks would be under the federal "absurdity doctrine."

You can't double dip. That's what CA is saying. They are saying "If you had done your job right the first time, then the kids would not need tutoring, so you don't get to be the person who tutors."

I totally get that you are intelligent and articulate, but you might be a totally incompetent buffoon in the classroom. Someone else gets a shot at bringing these kids up to par, and that person doesn't get to be you.

 

[JGRAHAM2010]

I mean, imagine this conversation -

Parent "Hello, I would like to have my child tutored so he doesn't fail math again."

School "OK, here's the list of tutors. Oh look, little Johnny has Mr. X for math, and he's available to tutor for math!"

Parent "WTF? Mr. X couldn't help little Johnny pass the first time, but if he tutors Johnny, Johnny will pass? What kind of scheme is this? Mr X gets paid TWICE for a job he should have done right the first time? I'm suing...."

So, it can't be you who tutors...

Actually, if Mr. X went to work for Sylvan, he might be Johnny's tutor.

But not likely, it would probably be some 1st year college student.

Also, Mr. X, if he was "highly qualified" as a teacher, probably couldn't teach Johnny because Johnny has ADD or ADHD or just needs one-on-one help that Mr. X couldn't give him in class, because Mr. X has 40 other students that need to learn at the same time. Mr. X probably also told Johnny's parents at a PTA meeting that Johnny is eligible for NCLB free tutoring because the school is not doing so well academically, and that they should take advantage of that, so Johnny can get the one-on-one help he really needs.

 

[Humusluvr]

Actually, if Mr. X went to work for Sylvan, he might be Johnny's tutor.

But not likely, it would probably be some 1st year college student.

Also, Mr. X, if he was "highly qualified" as a teacher, probably couldn't teach Johnny because Johnny has ADD or ADHD or just needs one-on-one help that Mr. X couldn't give him in class, because Mr. X has 40 other students that need to learn at the same time. Mr. X probably also told Johnny's parents at a PTA meeting that Johnny is eligible for NCLB free tutoring because the school is not doing so well academically, and that they should take advantage of that, so Johnny can get the one-on-one help he really needs.

So, why don't you go work for Sylvan? Problem solved!

 

[Humusluvr]

Also, Mr. X, if he was "highly qualified" as a teacher, probably couldn't teach Johnny

So, you already admit that you would be a terrible tutor, so, don't be a tutor! Problem solved again! I'm on a roll! Yay for me

 

[JGRAHAM2010]

You can't double dip. That's what CA is saying. They are saying "If you had done your job right the first time, then the kids would not need tutoring, so you don't get to be the person who tutors."

I totally get that you are intelligent and articulate, but you might be a totally incompetent buffoon in the classroom. Someone else gets a shot at bringing these kids up to par, and that person doesn't get to be you.

Your answer is quite harsh, and without basis.

The school district I work for has NO schools which are failing and must provide NCLB tutoring. All the teachers are quite good, I dare say, myself included.

Your argument might hold some water IF I was a teacher working for a failing school or school district.

I might add, there have been studies about the effectiveness of this tutoring, and it is not terribly effective, and that is because these tutoring businesses don't hire very well qualified tutors -- why should they? Federal regulations forbid schools or school districts or the state from establishing any minimum requirements as to who may actually deliver the tutoring services.

Think of this, what if instead of teaching 40 kids at once a highly qualified teacher would be let teach just one kid at at time for his or her same salary. The teacher would only get to teach about 3 kids a day, instead of about 200 or more kids per day, but they would get one-on-one help -- do you think that this would make a difference in the ability of the teacher to get through to the kids in question? Obviously, yes. So why make an apples and oranges comparison here as you do? Don't. Be fair.

Also, I might add that the state is required to constantly monitor the providers of such NCLB mandated tutoring, so it isn't like a bad tutor will just run wild. If the tutor succeeds in improving students academic proficiency once on the state list, they stay on the list, otherwise they are taken off the list and can't even reapply for 2 years.

 

[Humusluvr]

Also, I might add that the state is required to constantly monitor the providers of such NCLB mandated tutoring, so it isn't like a bad tutor will just run wild. If the tutor succeeds in improving students academic proficiency once on the state list, they stay on the list, otherwise they are taken off the list and can't even reapply for 2 years.

What just like a bad TEACHER couldn't possibly continue teaching? HA HA HA HA HA HA HA. We ALL know of bad teachers who keep their jobs for years. So, I would make the conclusion that bad tutors might run rampant for a while.

Kids do better with one-on-one instruction? Who'd have thunk it???

My answer was NOT harsh, nor without basis. I have been in public education for 15 years. I have seen it all. And, I would say I am quite smart. And I can read between the lines. If you run your classroom anything like you've run your posts, you REFUSE to have your questions answered unless YOU wrote the response. So, answer your own questions, or waste your time an energy suing everyone. You can't use your intellect to help students? You want to suck the money out of CA? Have fun. You are being RIDICULOUS in that you can't understand the theory behind the tutoring situation, and can't see how it's double dipping. Save your energy for your students.

 

[JGRAHAM2010]

So, you already admit that you would be a terrible tutor, so, don't be a tutor! Problem solved again! I'm on a roll! Yay for me

I'm a math and science teacher, but I believe you mean "yea," not "yay," which is not a word.

 

[JGRAHAM2010]

What just like a bad TEACHER couldn't possibly continue teaching? HA HA HA HA HA HA HA. We ALL know of bad teachers who keep their jobs for years. So, I would make the conclusion that bad tutors might run rampant for a while.

Kids do better with one-on-one instruction? Who'd have thunk it???

My answer was NOT harsh, nor without basis. I have been in public education for 15 years. I have seen it all. And, I would say I am quite smart. And I can read between the lines. If you run your classroom anything like you've run your posts, you REFUSE to have your questions answered unless YOU wrote the response. So, answer your own questions, or waste your time an energy suing everyone. You can't use your intellect to help students? You want to suck the money out of CA? Have fun. You are being RIDICULOUS in that you can't understand the theory behind the tutoring situation, and can't see how it's double dipping. Save your energy for your students.

Not "double dipping" for me because I don't teach in a school district where students are failing, which was the premise of your argument, eh?

 

[cbg]

I have read, or at least skimmed, both this person's posts, and all I can say is that he is the current winner of the "biggest entitlement mentality" award. Which on this board really means something.

Won't be reading any more of his posts. I don't have that much time to waste on such complete non-issues from someone with that big, and unwarranted, an ego.

 

[Perky]

Title I - Improving The Academic Achievement Of The Disadvantaged

SEC. 1116. ACADEMIC ASSESSMENT AND LOCAL EDUCATIONAL AGENCY AND SCHOOL IMPROVEMENT.
(e) SUPPLEMENTAL EDUCATIONAL SERVICES-
(1) SUPPLEMENTAL EDUCATIONAL SERVICES– In the case of any school described in paragraph (5), (7), or (8) of subsection (b), the local educational agency serving such school shall, subject to this subsection, arrange for the provision of supplemental educational services to eligible children in the school from a provider with a demonstrated record of effectiveness, that is selected by the parents and approved for that purpose by the State educational agency in accordance with reasonable criteria, consistent with paragraph (5), that the State educational agency shall adopt.
....
(4) STATE EDUCATIONAL AGENCY RESPONSIBILITIES– A State educational agency shall--
(A) in consultation with local educational agencies, parents, teachers, and other interested members of the public, promote maximum participation by providers to ensure, to the extent practicable, that parents have as many choices as possible;
(B) develop and apply objective criteria, consistent with paragraph (5), to potential providers that are based on a demonstrated record of effectiveness in increasing the academic proficiency of students in subjects relevant to meeting the State academic content and student achievement standards adopted under section 1111(b)(1);

This is from the federal guidelines. As a substitute teacher, are you able to satisfy the bolded requirement, or do you plan to challenge the US Dept of Education too? Just sayin'.....