Tow Company says I owe them $28,000.00 !!!

[Rich (my name)]

They claim to still have my truck , but I doubt they do. What can I do if they sold it without a court order? They refuse to give me a detailed invoice of charges and wont show me any paperwork regarding tow authorization.... (California)

 

[LdiJ]

They claim to still have my truck , but I doubt they do. What can I do if they sold it without a court order? They refuse to give me a detailed invoice of charges and wont show me any paperwork regarding tow authorization.... (California)

How long do they claim to have held said truck?

 

[CdwJava]

They claim to still have my truck , but I doubt they do. What can I do if they sold it without a court order? They refuse to give me a detailed invoice of charges and wont show me any paperwork regarding tow authorization.... (California)

WHY would they have your vehicle? Since they can sell the car at a lien sale after 30 days, it makes no sense at all that they would have it long enough to rack up $28,000 in fees. That would tend to mean that they had the vehicle for about a year or more ... makes no sense.

As for selling it, they would not need a court order. The law requires them to send notice of a pending sale to the registered and legal owners as they are indicated by the DMV. When those notices must be mailed depends upon the value of the vehicle. If you did not receive a notice it is likely because your current address was not listed in DMV paperwork.

Why did the tow company have your vehicle in the first place?

 

[adjusterjack]

What was the date of the tow?

 

[Rich (my name)]

WHY would they have your vehicle? Since they can sell the car at a lien sale after 30 days, it makes no sense at all that they would have it long enough to rack up $28,000 in fees. That would tend to mean that they had the vehicle for about a year or more ... makes no sense.

As for selling it, they would not need a court order. The law requires them to send notice of a pending sale to the registered and legal owners as they are indicated by the DMV. When those notices must be mailed depends upon the value of the vehicle. If you did not receive a notice it is likely because your current address was not listed in DMV paperwork.

Why did the tow company have your vehicle in the first place?

Thank You for responding.
It was illegally impounded by police who REFUSED to review the paperwork i had under my seat, which made the vehicle lawful and street legal. The two armed officers were both shining flashlights at me from different sides of my truck but wouldn't let me reach under my seat out of "concern for their safety." I think they would have understandably been concerned about their safety if they saw me reaching under my seat as I was getting pulled over, .... so I waited and asked. , If I knew it was going be an issue I would've chanced it and had the paperwork ready for them.... The paperwork however was readily available and it included:
a) a valid vehicle moving moving permit issued and date stamped by DMV b) a DMV print-out that clearly showed that I had paid all processing fees for the incomplete registration
c) a valid insurance card
The police told me they were impounding it because the registration had been expired for more than 6 months. I was not given a citation, receipt, or anything documenting the traffic stop or impound. All I was given at the time of incident was a report number scribbled on a piece of paper.
I requested a tow hearing, at which I asked the administrative law judge where I could find the rules that govern the process and he directed me to the ca vehicle code 22852. There is nothing in the vehicle code regarding rules that govern the tow hearing process. To my surprise he found the tow to be legal.
He would not allow me to inspect the copy that he had of the police report, which had a different number and had a different officer name and badge number than the one I had gotten at police station. He would not allow me to see the dispatch transcript which would have shown that the time the officer called in tow was not consistent with time stated on the report that I was given at police station. The ALJ informed me that could only see the evidence if I appealed his decision, which turns out to be a violation of my rights.
So I filed a writ of mandamus by myself thinking I would be able to represent myself. I was granted a hearing but I found that I had no clue about what I needed to do in court. Judge was obviously annoyed with me for trying to handle things by myself and just so rude that I gave up. I figured it was nearly impossible to learn all the stuff on my own that I needed to know to even have a chance of an appeal.
This all happened starting last November until around May, that is why tow company had it to begin with. I prolly over-explained situation.
Anyways as far as the tow company goes, In December 2017 they sent me a notice of a pending lien sale of my truck. I sent declaration of opposition form to DMV. The DMV told me that the tow company had 30 days to file a claim in court and win the case to get a court order allowing them to sell my truck. Tow company did not file anything according to DMV.
I sent the Police, the tow company, and the DMV a letter demanding the return of my truck. The only response came from DMV, saying they couldn't do anything. I heard nothing back from police or tow company. I have registered letter receipts showing it was received by both of them.
According to CVC The tow company is required to give me an itemized invoice and a copy of the tow authorization form upon my request and they refused to do so.
I just recently contacted tow company and again requested invoice and tow authorization and they refused again.
I also recently contacted DMV lien sale unit and they informed that the title is still in my name.
I have also been trying to find out what governmental agency is supposed to regulate and enforce laws that the tow companies are required to obey .... but I cant seem to find anyone that knows.
Any help, insight, or advice would be greatly appreciated.
Thank You again.

 

[Rich (my name)]

What was the date of the tow?

november 2017

 

[Rich (my name)]

How long do they claim to have held said truck?

almost a year

 

[TigerD]

Thank You for responding.
The police told me they were impounding it because the registration had been expired for more than 6 months. ... I requested a tow hearing, at which I asked the administrative law judge where I could find the rules that govern the process and he directed me to the ca vehicle code 22852. ... To my surprise he found the tow to be legal.

The problem is that you don't know what you are doing. You needed an attorney and screwed up by the numbers. You should probably talk to an attorney and see if anything can be done to correct your errors.

He would not allow me to inspect the copy that he had of the police report, which had a different number and had a different officer name and badge number than the one I had gotten at police station. He would not allow me to see the dispatch transcript which would have shown that the time the officer called in tow was not consistent with time stated on the report that I was given at police station. The ALJ informed me that could only see the evidence if I appealed his decision, which turns out to be a violation of my rights.

Typically, you do discovery before a hearing - not after.

So I filed a writ of mandamus by myself thinking I would be able to represent myself. I was granted a hearing but I found that I had no clue about what I needed to do in court. Judge was obviously annoyed with me for trying to handle things by myself and just so rude that I gave up. I figured it was nearly impossible to learn all the stuff on my own that I needed to know to even have a chance of an appeal.

There is a reason why lawyers go to seven years of higher education and spend years honing their craft.

This all happened starting last November until around May .... I sent the Police, the tow company, and the DMV a letter demanding the return of my truck. ... According to CVC The tow company is required to give me an itemized invoice and a copy of the tow authorization form upon my request and they refused to do so .... I have also been trying to find out what governmental agency is supposed to regulate and enforce laws that the tow companies are required to obey .... but I cant seem to find anyone that knows.

Please don't take this personally or negatively. You need an attorney. You cannot handle this yourself.

TD

 

[NeilTheCop]

If the officer gave you a report number did you go to the PD records and get a copy?

 

[CdwJava]

Thank You for responding.
It was illegally impounded by police who REFUSED to review the paperwork i had under my seat, which made the vehicle lawful and street legal.
The two armed officers were both shining flashlights at me from different sides of my truck but wouldn't let me reach under my seat out of "concern for their safety." I think they would have understandably been concerned about their safety if they saw me reaching under my seat as I was getting pulled over, .... so I waited and asked. , If I knew it was going be an issue I would've chanced it and had the paperwork ready for them.... The paperwork however was readily available and it included:
a) a valid vehicle moving moving permit issued and date stamped by DMV b) a DMV print-out that clearly showed that I had paid all processing fees for the incomplete registration
c) a valid insurance card

Did you later inform them that the paperwork was beneath the driver's seat?

Understand that paying fees is not the same as valid registration.

What was the date on the moving permit? Was it valid at the time you were moving it? These are good for only one day ... was that the day?

The police told me they were impounding it because the registration had been expired for more than 6 months. I was not given a citation, receipt, or anything documenting the traffic stop or impound. All I was given at the time of incident was a report number scribbled on a piece of paper.

The law requires notification by mail. A copy of your portion of the CHP-180 should have been sent via first class mail to the registered and legal owners. They CAN (and generally should) provide that copy to you at the scene, but they do not have to. And, yes, having registration expired more than 6 months makes it impoundable pursuant to VC 22651(o).

I requested a tow hearing, at which I asked the administrative law judge where I could find the rules that govern the process and he directed me to the ca vehicle code 22852. There is nothing in the vehicle code regarding rules that govern the tow hearing process. To my surprise he found the tow to be legal.

When did you see an Administrative Law Judge? The impound hearing per VC 22852 is conducted by a hearing officer appointed or assigned by the agency. I conducted those hearings for my agency for the better part of 14 years and I am no judge.

And, why wouldn't he uphold the tow? Absent a smoking gun on the moving permit to be for the day of the impound, it would appear that your car was outside the 6 months window for registration.

He would not allow me to inspect the copy that he had of the police report, which had a different number and had a different officer name and badge number than the one I had gotten at police station.

Not knowing what it was you received, I can't speak as to the difference of the numbers. One might have been a CAD number, the other a case number. The CHP-180 (usually the ONLY document necessary for an impound) is a one page document with little writing necessary.

Have you gone to the agency and asked for a copy of the report since then?

He would not allow me to see the dispatch transcript which would have shown that the time the officer called in tow was not consistent with time stated on the report that I was given at police station. The ALJ informed me that could only see the evidence if I appealed his decision, which turns out to be a violation of my rights.

Still not sure how an ALJ was involved ...

Times are often inconsistent since an officer in the field may use a wristwatch and CAD uses a computer generated time. Time doesn't change the fact that your car appears to have been expired for more than 6 months.

So I filed a writ of mandamus by myself thinking I would be able to represent myself. I was granted a hearing but I found that I had no clue about what I needed to do in court. Judge was obviously annoyed with me for trying to handle things by myself and just so rude that I gave up. I figured it was nearly impossible to learn all the stuff on my own that I needed to know to even have a chance of an appeal.

Ouch. That's why we need attorneys.

This all happened starting last November until around May, that is why tow company had it to begin with. I prolly over-explained situation.
Anyways as far as the tow company goes, In December 2017 they sent me a notice of a pending lien sale of my truck. I sent declaration of opposition form to DMV. The DMV told me that the tow company had 30 days to file a claim in court and win the case to get a court order allowing them to sell my truck. Tow company did not file anything according to DMV.
I sent the Police, the tow company, and the DMV a letter demanding the return of my truck. The only response came from DMV, saying they couldn't do anything. I heard nothing back from police or tow company. I have registered letter receipts showing it was received by both of them.
According to CVC The tow company is required to give me an itemized invoice and a copy of the tow authorization form upon my request and they refused to do so.
I just recently contacted tow company and again requested invoice and tow authorization and they refused again.
I also recently contacted DMV lien sale unit and they informed that the title is still in my name.

The DMV and the police don't have your car. The issue now is between you and the tow company. If they have failed to provide you with documents as required by law, you may have to sue them. It may be that the court date is waaaay out and you are being assessed storage fees for all the time the vehicle has been held in their care as a result of your actions.

I have also been trying to find out what governmental agency is supposed to regulate and enforce laws that the tow companies are required to obey .... but I cant seem to find anyone that knows.
Any help, insight, or advice would be greatly appreciated.
Thank You again.

There is no specific agency that oversees tow companies in general. Your recourse is through the court. You might also complain to any agencies that utilize the tow company as part of a rotational tow program and see if they might consider removing the company from their rotation if they have failed to comply with the law.

 

[Rich (my name)]

Did you later inform them that the paperwork was beneath the driver's seat?

Understand that paying fees is not the same as valid registration.

What was the date on the moving permit? Was it valid at the time you were moving it? These are good for only one day ... was that the day?


The law requires notification by mail. A copy of your portion of the CHP-180 should have been sent via first class mail to the registered and legal owners. They CAN (and generally should) provide that copy to you at the scene, but they do not have to. And, yes, having registration expired more than 6 months makes it impoundable pursuant to VC 22651(o).


When did you see an Administrative Law Judge? The impound hearing per VC 22852 is conducted by a hearing officer appointed or assigned by the agency. I conducted those hearings for my agency for the better part of 14 years and I am no judge.

And, why wouldn't he uphold the tow? Absent a smoking gun on the moving permit to be for the day of the impound, it would appear that your car was outside the 6 months window for registration.


Not knowing what it was you received, I can't speak as to the difference of the numbers. One might have been a CAD number, the other a case number. The CHP-180 (usually the ONLY document necessary for an impound) is a one page document with little writing necessary.

Have you gone to the agency and asked for a copy of the report since then?


Still not sure how an ALJ was involved ...

Times are often inconsistent since an officer in the field may use a wristwatch and CAD uses a computer generated time. Time doesn't change the fact that your car appears to have been expired for more than 6 months.


Ouch. That's why we need attorneys.


The DMV and the police don't have your car. The issue now is between you and the tow company. If they have failed to provide you with documents as required by law, you may have to sue them. It may be that the court date is waaaay out and you are being assessed storage fees for all the time the vehicle has been held in their care as a result of your actions.


There is no specific agency that oversees tow companies in general. Your recourse is through the court. You might also complain to any agencies that utilize the tow company as part of a rotational tow program and see if they might consider removing the company from their rotation if they have failed to comply with the law.

 

[Rich (my name)]

Yes I informed the police officers during the encounter. They would not let me reach under my seat, nor would get it for me. I went to tow yard and retrieved my paperwork before tow hearing. I informed the tow hearing officer (ALJ?) of all of the above. He said that he assumed I didn't get the moving permit until AFTER my truck was taken, disregarding both my testimony and the fact that the moving permit was clearly dated for the day it was towed. When he read the date on the moving permit out loud he seemed totally oblivious to the fact it had the correct date.
It is my understanding that the moving permit is not valid unless all the registration fees have been paid, which they were. It is also my understanding that it needs to be dated before moving the vehicle, in the vehicle, and readily available for inspection, which it was.
I had all of the required documents to legally move my truck at the time I was moving it, and I brought it all to the tow hearing.

 

[Rich (my name)]

Did you later inform them that the paperwork was beneath the driver's seat?

Understand that paying fees is not the same as valid registration.

What was the date on the moving permit? Was it valid at the time you were moving it? These are good for only one day ... was that the day?


The law requires notification by mail. A copy of your portion of the CHP-180 should have been sent via first class mail to the registered and legal owners. They CAN (and generally should) provide that copy to you at the scene, but they do not have to. And, yes, having registration expired more than 6 months makes it impoundable pursuant to VC 22651(o).


When did you see an Administrative Law Judge? The impound hearing per VC 22852 is conducted by a hearing officer appointed or assigned by the agency. I conducted those hearings for my agency for the better part of 14 years and I am no judge.

And, why wouldn't he uphold the tow? Absent a smoking gun on the moving permit to be for the day of the impound, it would appear that your car was outside the 6 months window for registration.


Not knowing what it was you received, I can't speak as to the difference of the numbers. One might have been a CAD number, the other a case number. The CHP-180 (usually the ONLY document necessary for an impound) is a one page document with little writing necessary.

Have you gone to the agency and asked for a copy of the report since then?


Still not sure how an ALJ was involved ...

Times are often inconsistent since an officer in the field may use a wristwatch and CAD uses a computer generated time. Time doesn't change the fact that your car appears to have been expired for more than 6 months.


Ouch. That's why we need attorneys.


The DMV and the police don't have your car. The issue now is between you and the tow company. If they have failed to provide you with documents as required by law, you may have to sue them. It may be that the court date is waaaay out and you are being assessed storage fees for all the time the vehicle has been held in their care as a result of your actions.


There is no specific agency that oversees tow companies in general. Your recourse is through the court. You might also complain to any agencies that utilize the tow company as part of a rotational tow program and see if they might consider removing the company from their rotation if they have failed to comply with the law.

So I went to tow yard on Friday to ask for a detailed invoice, a copy of tow authorization, and to see with my own eyes that they still have my truck and they told me I need a property release form from police before they can provide anything or even show me my truck. The city ordinance says that I need a property release form to get my personal property out of the truck, but nothing about needing one to get invoice and authorization form. If they do still have it should a lawyer be able to get my truck released while this matter is being litigated, or is the tow company allowed to hold it for ransome and keep racking up fees without a court order?

 

[CdwJava]

A lawyer might be able to help ... but, he might not.

If the tow company is still holding it, it could be that is because you filed the declaration opposing the lien sale. If your actions forced them to hold onto the vehicle even longer, then you may very well be liable for fees. I suspect that IF the matter is litigated, the fees may be capped at whatever the fair market value of the vehicle might be ... or allow the vehicle to be surrendered in lieu of the fees. Whether you stand a chance of successfully litigating the matter, that is hard to say. *IF* you had the appropriate documents at the time of the seizure and you presented them at the post-storage hearing but they were dismissed as irrelevant when they clearly were, then you might have a claim against the storing agency. I cannot say whether any claim against the tow company will be a separate action or if they can be combined into the same one. It may depend on the damages you seek and whether they will toss the matter from Small Claims to Superior Court. Others here may be more well versed in the civil process.

 

[Rich (my name)]

How long do they claim to have held said truck?

Thanks for responding , it has been almost a year. I sent in declaration of opposition to lien sale and they have not contacted me since. They also ignored the certified letter i sent them informing them it was towed illegally. DMV says title is still in my name.
On Friday I went to tow yard to get an itemized invoice and copy of tow authorization form and they told me that I need a property release form from the police first. I dont see anything in city charter about a property release form being needed to give me an invoice and copy of tow authorization.