Visitation Pick Ups

[Isis1]

I think the point is being missed here, but that is most likely because you don't have the full picture of what kind of person the ex actually is. I am not worried about "going out". But I will say that the ex has been a very emotionally abusive, controlling person, and continues to try to exert that control even though we are divorced. He is emotionally abusive to the kids, telling them they are fat and stupid, etc - but that has nothing to do with this topic.

I can guarantee that if I DID tell him "you forfeit your visitation" he'd say "so what?" He really doesn't care about seeing the children - he does nothing with them when he has them. He does not care about the kids, takes no interest in their lives and basically continues to see them so that he will look good to his friends (it's all about appearances with him). The actual parenting of the children is left up to me and my current husband.

So I guess the end decision is, since it's up to my discretion according to the agreement, that I can say "sorry, you aren't getting the kids tonight (friday if he's not on time). You can pick them up Saturday morning by 10a". And this would hold up in court, correct?

i'm not saying this to be rude. and believe me, i've been there. yes, i've read your thread. You having a back up plan ALWAYS takes his control. the ex i deal did alot of stupid stuff like this. you know why he stopped? because i had my back up plan. he had no contol. you wait till 5:30pm. if he doesn't show, use your back up plan. he can pick up the kids the next day. legally speaking, he would have lost his entire weekend visitation. but, allowing him to pick up the next day, makes you the gracious goddess that you strive to be.

you are entitled to a night out. that's okay. learn how to second guess him and you'll be fine. don't get into arguments with him. leave a message. my favorite was always "hey stupid (okay, i didn't say that outloud) i'm doing this or that. the kids will be there till such and such time. if this is an issue, call me back to discuss other alternatives. if i do not hear from you, it will be taken as an agreement."

i kid you not, read some marriage books. they have some good pointers on how to deflect arguements. trust me, i don't consider myself in a relationship with the ex (that thought makes me gag) but it is a relationship. a bad one, if i let it bother me.

 

[TinkerBelleLuvr]

Don't communicate thru your child. Inform you X that according to the court order, (type it out), that you only have to wait 30 minutes. At that time, he has forfeited that time. If he makes PRIOR arrangements and that prior does NOT constitute 5 pm pick up time, you can arrange for a different pickup time.

Then, stick to your guns. If he tries to communicate thru the child, the child needs to learn to say, "you need to talk to mom about this. this is not my concern."

 

[stealth2]

If he tries to communicate thru the child, the
child needs to learn to say, "you need to talk to mom about this. this is not my concern."

This is a very important point.

uummm... not that it always works.

 

[Stacey3569]

This is a very important point.

uummm... not that it always works.

Well the problem with that is my son is 15 years old - he doesn't talk about his father alot although he has some anger issues that the therapist has attributed to his father's behavior. With me he is normal 15 year old moody kid, with the ex he is an angry kid who has "secretly" cut his couch with a knife... of course, the ex blames me for that. But I get the feeling that my son has this idea that maybe someday dad will turn out to be a good guy, so HE (my son) is the one who initiates contact with him - the ex hardly ever calls, it's my son who calls him to see "what's up" kind of thing.

Now my daughter, who is 10 and was a daddy's girl, is alot more "outspoken" about her father. She will complain about how he behaves, what he does and I have to tell her as gently as possible "its none of my business and I don't want to be involved" She too sees a therapist.

Both kids are with him for this week (his week of summer vacation with them) - yesterday was my son's HS orientation and even though dad works from home, he couldn't take the boy to it. I had to leave work, drive an hour out of my way because he wouldn't meet me halfway, and take my son to his HS orientation. While there my son commented on how his sister is being a "demon" this week, yelling at dad and giving him a hard time. Now again, when she's with me, she's a normal 10 year old with girly temper tantrums, but she knows when to stop and will apologize once she cools down - she won't apologize to her father.

So I know there are emotional "issues" with the kids and their dad and I'm doing my best to help them with it (therapists, activities to redirect their energy, etc)

I don't know how any of this would affect visitation. I was told, by more then one person, that I should have the court do a mental evaluation on the ex, and they might order him to parenting classes. But I'm sure that would involve having my kids dragged into court to be questioned and I don't think that's fair to them. Guess I've got more on my hands then just a visitation pick up question, but not really sure if anything is addressable by the courts, or even what I'd ask the court for.

Thanks for the advice. What I'm going to do from now on is wait the 30 minutes, if he doesn't show I will leave him a message or text that he won't be getting them that night per our agreement and he can pick them up by 10a Saturday. It's up to him if he wants to be a father to his kids or not.

 

[stealth2]

Your situation sounds a fair bit like mine, in terms of the relationships anyway. My oldest has always been rather realistic in terms of his Dad, and at this point is just waiting things out. My youngest was always "Dad's favorite", and took the fall pretty hard. But... she is more like her Dad than even he realizes (and not all in a bad way), so they're in a stand-off. I don't fancy his odds.

Best thing you can do is stand as far back as possible. IMO, anyway.

 

[Ohiogal]

I think the point is being missed here, but that is most likely because you don't have the full picture of what kind of person the ex actually is. I am not worried about "going out". But I will say that the ex has been a very emotionally abusive, controlling person, and continues to try to exert that control even though we are divorced. He is emotionally abusive to the kids, telling them they are fat and stupid, etc - but that has nothing to do with this topic.

I can guarantee that if I DID tell him "you forfeit your visitation" he'd say "so what?" He really doesn't care about seeing the children - he does nothing with them when he has them. He does not care about the kids, takes no interest in their lives and basically continues to see them so that he will look good to his friends (it's all about appearances with him). The actual parenting of the children is left up to me and my current husband.

So I guess the end decision is, since it's up to my discretion according to the agreement, that I can say "sorry, you aren't getting the kids tonight (friday if he's not on time). You can pick them up Saturday morning by 10a". And this would hold up in court, correct?

You dont' have to allow him to pick them at 10 am. Tell him his girlfriend -- or another adult -- can either pick them up -- if he can't -- on Friday or he doesn't see his children that weekend. That would hold up in court based on what YOU have stated.