Visitation

[Schwippsy]

What is the name of your state (only U.S. law)? IL

We just established a new child support order today and I was able to leave the court room before all was brought in front of the judge as I had concerns about my ex acting out, since he did not get the expected reduction.
His lawyer told me that he would ask for visitation.
The kids are over 8 years old now and do not know their father exists. He has shown no interest in them since we seperated.
I am not against them knowing their father, if he was a good father. However he is a deadbeat, many many thousands behind in child support and has a pattern with his other kids that he sees them twice a year or less. So he is just doing this to irritate me, not because he truly wants to get to know his children.
I do not want my kids to suffer, because he now decided he can pop in and out of their lives as he pleases.
He told me in the past he hates our second child and he has threatened me before. I am not at all comfortable leaving the kids with him, even for a minute.
What are my rights? I have sole custody. And how do I go about getting a supervised visitation. I have no means to pay a lawyer and the state's attorney is handling the child support case.
Thanks for your insight.

 

[Proserpina]

What is the name of your state (only U.S. law)? IL

We just established a new child support order today and I was able to leave the court room before all was brought in front of the judge as I had concerns about my ex acting out, since he did not get the expected reduction.
His lawyer told me that he would ask for visitation.
The kids are over 8 years old now and do not know their father exists. He has shown no interest in them since we seperated.
I am not against them knowing their father, if he was a good father. However he is a deadbeat, many many thousands behind in child support and has a pattern with his other kids that he sees them twice a year or less. So he is just doing this to irritate me, not because he truly wants to get to know his children.
I do not want my kids to suffer, because he now decided he can pop in and out of their lives as he pleases.
He told me in the past he hates our second child and he has threatened me before. I am not at all comfortable leaving the kids with him, even for a minute.
What are my rights? I have sole custody. And how do I go about getting a supervised visitation. I have no means to pay a lawyer and the state's attorney is handling the child support case.
Thanks for your insight.

If Dad files, he's going to get visitation. It may be supervised at first, but after a reintroduction period he'll probably be awarded the standard plan including overnights, weekends and longer periods during school holidays.

You would have to prove why prolonged supervision is necessary.

 

[Schwippsy]

I have no concerns about supervised visitations to end as he will not make the effort to really come and see them again and again.
Once I receive a copy of the request for visitation how do I go about it? Do I need to get back in front of a judge? Does family services handle this? Or how do I make sure that the initial visit is supervised?
Thank you!

 

[Proserpina]

I have no concerns about supervised visitations to end as he will not make the effort to really come and see them again and again.
Once I receive a copy of the request for visitation how do I go about it? Do I need to get back in front of a judge? Does family services handle this? Or how do I make sure that the initial visit is supervised?
Thank you!

You might be in for a surprise - when NCPs don't get a requested modification in CS, they often pursue and are consistent with visitation.

(Commonly held theory that "Well if I have to pay, I'm going to make damn sure I see the kid/s I'm paying for").

Once you're served, you'll have to file a response unless you want Dad to get whatever he is asking for right from the get go.

In that response you can request that since the kids really don't know Dad that there is an reintroduction period where they can all get to know each other again.

You might suggest supervised short visits at your home (or a neutral place if you're uncomfortable). Then, once X number of visits have have been completed, it can perhaps go to one weekend day unsupervised. Then after X number of weekend visits have been completed you can move to overnights, then to a full weekend, and finally to a regular parenting plan according to local guidelines.

There are literally hundreds of parenting plans out there - start doing your research now (google is your friend!) so you won't be hit with a sledgehammer.

 

[mistoffolees]

Once you're served, you'll have to file a response unless you want Dad to get whatever he is asking for right from the get go.

Which would probably be a bad thing - it's not unheard of for NCP to ask for a custody change after CS is ordered. It's unlikely if the judge actually rules, but if you don't respond, Dad could get it by default.

 

[Proserpina]

Which would probably be a bad thing - it's not unheard of for NCP to ask for a custody change after CS is ordered. It's unlikely if the judge actually rules, but if you don't respond, Dad could get it by default.

Absolutely!

And since Dad has an attorney and Mom doesn't...I'd be a little more than wary.

 

[Schwippsy]

I will definetely respond. I am not trying to be a pain, because he is useless as a father. I am just trying to protect my children from more confusion and sadness. I know legal matter might see that in a different light.
He will not ask for custody. He really does not have an interest in them. He likes to live his life freely. That's not a concern at all.
I will not agree to visits that are not supervised. I believe I have valid reasons by him threatening me more than once, being abusive in the past, him rejecting the last born, and being basically non-existant in the last 8 years.
By the time all this is processed he will have quit his job again (since now CS will come out of his paycheck) and not be supporting his kids anyway.
So maybe with time this will solve itself.
I just wanted to understand what I need to do.
I will wait for the paperwork to reach me and respond with my request of supervision and then we take it from there. Now last question, does a State's Attorney's office deal with visitation like they did with the child support order or is CS all they handle?

I very much appreciate your time and input.

 

[Proserpina]

I will definetely respond. I am not trying to be a pain, because he is useless as a father. I am just trying to protect my children from more confusion and sadness. I know legal matter might see that in a different light.
He will not ask for custody. He really does not have an interest in them. He likes to live his life freely. That's not a concern at all.
I will not agree to visits that are not supervised. I believe I have valid reasons by him threatening me more than once, being abusive in the past, him rejecting the last born, and being basically non-existant in the last 8 years.
By the time all this is processed he will have quit his job again (since now CS will come out of his paycheck) and not be supporting his kids anyway.
So maybe with time this will solve itself.
I just wanted to understand what I need to do.
I will wait for the paperwork to reach me and respond with my request of supervision and then we take it from there. Now last question, does a State's Attorney's office deal with visitation like they did with the child support order or is CS all they handle?

I very much appreciate your time and input.

...what you need to understand is that this is NOT your decision to make.

This is the court's decision. Not yours. You won't be "allowing" or "disallowing" anything. It will be entirely up to the court.

Please also don't be under the impression that not paying child support somehow makes him ineligible for visitation.

 

[Schwippsy]

That did not answer my question Proserpina, but thanks for your time.
I will not agree for him to come, if I do not feel we are safe with him.
I accept visitation, but not unsupervised.
If the court ( which has done jack for the kids the last years while the deadbeat played the system) decides to jail me for protecting my children then I am fine with that too. We try to stay very peaceful here.
Sometimes people need to look at the concerns of the well being of the children and not what some folks put down in the law. That is why spouses and children get killed these days and once it is too late everybody goes: "Oh!" but that is whole different story.

 

[mistoffolees]

That did not answer my question Proserpina, but thanks for your time.
I will not agree for him to come, if I do not feel we are safe with him.
I accept visitation, but not unsupervised.
If the court ( which has done jack for the kids the last years while the deadbeat played the system) decides to jail me for protecting my children then I am fine with that too. We try to stay very peaceful here.
Sometimes people need to look at the concerns of the well being of the children and not what some folks put down in the law. That is why spouses and children get killed these days and once it is too late everybody goes: "Oh!" but that is whole different story.

That's all well and good, but your complaints have nothing to do with the safety of the kids.

You complain that he doesn't pay CS regularly. That is not grounds to eliminate visitation.

You state that he doesn't visit regularly and rarely sees the kids. That's too bad - and doesn't give you the right to keep him from seeing them when he IS around.

And in case no one has explained it to you, if you go through with what you're suggesting here, he may well get full custody - is that good for the kids??????

 

[Proserpina]

That did not answer my question Proserpina, but thanks for your time.
I will not agree for him to come, if I do not feel we are safe with him.
I accept visitation, but not unsupervised.
If the court ( which has done jack for the kids the last years while the deadbeat played the system) decides to jail me for protecting my children then I am fine with that too. We try to stay very peaceful here.
Sometimes people need to look at the concerns of the well being of the children and not what some folks put down in the law. That is why spouses and children get killed these days and once it is too late everybody goes: "Oh!" but that is whole different story.

Do you want him to get custody?

Is that really what you want?

 

[milspecgirl]

the people that handled your child support will not handle visitation. You will need an atty for that.

You need to understand that what a judge says will go. If you fail to comply with the judge's order, they could very easily give the children to dad full time. Talk about screwing yourself. Visitation will most likely not be supervised by you and that is good. A supervised center, trusted friend, or counselor is the best bet. So, you won't have to worry about your safety and I don't see where dad has ever been violent with the children.

If he requests visitation, respond with a graduated plan that begins with supervised visitation and works up to normal unsupervised after a period of time where he proves he is going to be consistent. Also, ask for counseling (at his expense) for him and the children to make the transition into having a dad easier for them.

Dad not paying child support= not a reason to stop visitation.
dad not wanting the younger child in the beginning= not a reason to stop visitation
abuse towards you (unless reported to police and affecting the children)= not a reason to stop visitation

and a final bit of advice- DO NOT badmouth him to the children. Be upbeat and positive about his visits and do not take your feelings out on them (grilling them about visits, badmouthing him, etc). Those children KNOW they are 1/2 of him. Hearing you degrade him means you are degrading 1/2 of them. That will screw your kids up way worse than an absent parent.

 

[Proserpina]

and a final bit of advice- DO NOT badmouth him to the children. Be upbeat and positive about his visits and do not take your feelings out on them (grilling them about visits, badmouthing him, etc). Those children KNOW they are 1/2 of him. Hearing you degrade him means you are degrading 1/2 of them. That will screw your kids up way worse than an absent parent.

Perfectly put.

 

[Schwippsy]

He has not seen the kids since he left 8 years ago. The kids have never seen him since the oldest was 6 months old. NEVER!
And that was not due to me not allowing it, on the contrary. I tried to be a part of it. He has not asked to see them until today, 8 years later.
I have never explained that story as they haven't asked yet.
Does anybody understand here how it crushes a kids world to be confronted with a 'Dad' that never existed? How it affects a child to all over sudden have a "Dad' that will not be in their live as he has moved out of state and will not be around on regular basis?
He stated before he hates the second child, so how is that not a concern?
I had to be escorted by security out of the court room while had to stay in court. If trying to hurt me and not being able to get to me, but then have access to the kids that he has no relationship with, which is right now his only way to get at me, is not a concern for the kids safety then I do not know no more.

Thanks for your time.
Case closed...

 

[CJane]

You might be in for a surprise - when NCPs don't get a requested modification in CS, they often pursue and are consistent with visitation.

(Commonly held theory that "Well if I have to pay, I'm going to make damn sure I see the kid/s I'm paying for").

I wonder though, if that's more common in states where time with the kids matters to the calculation - it doesn't in IL.

Also, there apparently already IS an order for child support and that didn't prompt Dad to attempt to develop a relationship with the children over the past 8 years...

OP - my advice to you is to just chill out unless/until you're served with paperwork/court filings, and THEN come back for advice. We really can't give you any accurate advice without knowing exactly what Dad is asking for. And right now he's not asking for anything.