Police Conduct

[CdwJava]

You know, saying this one hundred times does not make it so. The fascist system certainly encourages pseudo-quotas when the feds give the state $$ for issuing out traffic tickets, even in your state.

Piss poor I agree; not a way of generating $$, disagree. 95% of people just pay.

What "fascist" system are you talking about?

And, again, it does nothing to aid in the deficit of the cities and counties involved, or even the state. The revenues are earmarked and not discretionary. If we wrote a million tickets virtually none of it would go to schools, public safety, social services, or any of the host of other things that are adding to our state and local deficits.

If 1 in 20 drivers takes a citation to court, the local government tends to lose the money it makes on a moving violation. And fixit tickets gain them nothing. The exception to these are red light tickets which have low overhead.

If it were truly only about money, the "fascist" state would issue parking tickets. Local parking regulations would be all the rage! After all, a parking cite that costs you $27 would make almost four times more money for the city - general fund revenue, ta boot - than a mover that might cost you $311.

But, continue to rail against the machine ... knock yourself out.

 

[CdwJava]

The police are never going to look good when facing non-violent protests, isn't that the ENTIRE point of a non-violent protest, to force the other side into hurting you and then you turn it into a PR campaign? I guess in these cases the police are portrayed as enforcers for the 1%. I would think the best thing these states could do is just absolutely and completely ignore the protestors, give them zero ammunition - but contrary they seem to be taking the bait...

But, when you try to ignore them then they interrupt the lives of others. Classes get disrupted, business gets disrupted - even destroyed, traffic gets disrupted, etc. That's far more impact on the other 99% than the so-called 1% who likely don't have to pass by any of these gatherings.

The police nationwide have been reined in a great deal. Very often you read stories of them just sitting back and watching as businesses get destroyed and people are harassed. These protests are being given exceptions that other political groups and protests have not been. In fact, the one things this may have done is pretty much render moot most any future demands by cities for groups to have to pay fees or obtain permits to march or protest because these guys are being given a pass because there is now a precedent that they will have to live with.

One of the problems about such permissiveness is that the parks and open areas that were originally designed to be enjoyed by all become unable to be attended by any. When I worked in southern California we had several very nice city parks. Unfortunately, the homeless moved in and as long as they were not pitching tents or "camping" they could essentially live in the parks all the time. They effectively ran off the residents and the tourists and turned the parks into garbage heaps and toilets for the transient community. The answer was camping and after hours cites, but those took a long time to go to warrant, and when it did they were back in days. Now THAT was a 1% that effected the lives of the other 99%.

 

[cbg]

One of those non-violent protests is taking place directly across the street from where I work. It isn't affecting me personally - yet - not until the next time I have to go to the library. But even then, the only effect it will have on me personally is that I'll have to show my school ID in order to be allowed to enter what was once a semi-public place.

It is having a major affect on those people who do not work or attend the school, however, and as a result are currently denied access. The school has always made these grounds available to the public, and it's a very convenient way to get across town. Because of this protest, on school property, no one without an ID will be permitted there, which is a definite inconvenience to those who live locally and even those who have the school ID but work on the grounds in question.

The 1% is not affected in the slightest. The 99%, however, are.

 

[startedone]

The police nationwide have been reined in a great deal.
.

Police Pepper Spray Peaceful UC Davis Students - YouTube

Really???

 

[davew128]

Pepper-Spray Brutality at UC Davis - James Fallows - National - The Atlantic

I think they probably smelled better afterwards.

 

[davew128]

When I worked in southern California we had several very nice city parks. Unfortunately, the homeless moved in and as long as they were not pitching tents or "camping" they could essentially live in the parks all the time. They effectively ran off the residents and the tourists and turned the parks into garbage heaps and toilets for the transient community. The answer was camping and after hours cites, but those took a long time to go to warrant, and when it did they were back in days. Now THAT was a 1% that effected the lives of the other 99%.

It's still a problem here. It's worse then in other areas because the climate doesn't force people to seek shelter. Recently SDPD took down a transient camp on the SD River (which was on a business's property), and the people outraged about tended to be of the same mindset as the "gal" in another thread here who calls me a bigot for wanting immigration laws enforced. There were two types of people in those camps: illegal aliens and then people with substance/alcohol problems who don't want help.

 

[Banned_Princess]

But, when you try to ignore them then they interrupt the lives of others. Classes get disrupted, business gets disrupted - even destroyed, traffic gets disrupted, etc. That's far more impact on the other 99% than the so-called 1% who likely don't have to pass by any of these gatherings.

The police nationwide have been reined in a great deal. Very often you read stories of them just sitting back and watching as businesses get destroyed and people are harassed. These protests are being given exceptions that other political groups and protests have not been. In fact, the one things this may have done is pretty much render moot most any future demands by cities for groups to have to pay fees or obtain permits to march or protest because these guys are being given a pass because there is now a precedent that they will have to live with.

One of the problems about such permissiveness is that the parks and open areas that were originally designed to be enjoyed by all become unable to be attended by any. When I worked in southern California we had several very nice city parks. Unfortunately, the homeless moved in and as long as they were not pitching tents or "camping" they could essentially live in the parks all the time. They effectively ran off the residents and the tourists and turned the parks into garbage heaps and toilets for the transient community. The answer was camping and after hours cites, but those took a long time to go to warrant, and when it did they were back in days. Now THAT was a 1% that effected the lives of the other 99%.

I agree. there has been alot less police shootings, and pepperspray and tazers aren't lethal.

 

[netfocus]

But, when you try to ignore them then they interrupt the lives of others. Classes get disrupted, business gets disrupted - even destroyed, traffic gets disrupted, etc. That's far more impact on the other 99% than the so-called 1% who likely don't have to pass by any of these gatherings.

Thats a good point; although I think these protests are just the start. You have an entire generation of narcissistic spoiled brats indoctrinated by vietnam era communist professors who provided them with useless liberal arts degrees and a Prima donna work ethic who are "too good" to do the work of the 10 million odd illegal immigrants in this country - so they remain unemployed. The next step will be london style riots in the streets by these people.

One of the problems about such permissiveness is that the parks and open areas that were originally designed to be enjoyed by all become unable to be attended by any. When I worked in southern California we had several very nice city parks. Unfortunately, the homeless moved in and as long as they were not pitching tents or "camping" they could essentially live in the parks all the time. They effectively ran off the residents and the tourists and turned the parks into garbage heaps and toilets for the transient community. The answer was camping and after hours cites, but those took a long time to go to warrant, and when it did they were back in days. Now THAT was a 1% that effected the lives of the other 99%.

I think much of this attitude such as in California about this issue is a symptom of having money and a great economy; once that all goes away and the city realizes such and such high rise developer will not build next to a park infested by homeless the cities will start cleaning these areas up to keep the businesses; that, or the businesses will move to cities that will which seems to be whats happening in California, but the Californians will get the hint eventually and that exodus will stop.

 

[CdwJava]

Thats a good point; although I think these protests are just the start. You have an entire generation of narcissistic spoiled brats indoctrinated by vietnam era communist professors who provided them with useless liberal arts degrees and a pre-madonna work ethic who are "too good" to do the work of the 10 million odd illegal immigrants in this country - so they remain unemployed. The next step will be london style riots in the streets by these people.

And, in short order they will turn the general public against them. We've already seen that with the Occupy groups ... there was some sympathy - or at least tolerance - for their antics at first. But, as they drag on and the excesses of their prolonged occupations wear on public resources and good will, tolerance for these protests wains.

I think much of this attitude such as in California about this issue is a symptom of having money and a great economy; once that all goes away and the city realizes such and such high rise developer will not build next to a park infested by homeless the cities will start cleaning these areas up to keep the businesses; that, or the businesses will move to cities that will which seems to be whats happening in California, but the Californians will get the hint eventually and that exodus will stop.

Unfortunately, we have not learned that to attract business we need to CUT taxes and regulation. The answers coming out of Sacramento continue to include additional regulation and higher taxes. So long as business is given a DISincentive to grow, they will leave.

In way of illustration, my cousin currently employs 40-45 people in good, skilled blue collar wage obs in his business. he has been seeking to expand his business and add 30 or so positions, but has been stymied by the regulation and uncertain costs of the expansion. So, 30 odd jobs that pay good wages cannot be added to the economy and the tax roles because the present system discourages this expansion by rendering any potential for profit tentative due to extraneous regulation.

I don't think CA will get a clue on this until the economy sinks even further. Just one reason I am trying to hold out for another couple of years then retire and change careers ... possibly out of state if I can.

 

[sKiTzo]

If this is just going to be a thread on dumping on cops, I suggest you guys take it to a board that exists for that purpose there are plenty of them that cater to anarchy and disorder and despise authority. This is not one of them, nor is there a legal question pending here.

I don't think the intent is to dump on cops. I'm saying if you open your eyes and ears to what goes on around here you might see that there are ALOT of crooked cops whose actions can devastate lives. I have a friend who was pulled over and had to sit there for an hour while they searched and searched and failed to find anything illegal. He then said that a motorcycle cop appeared who had not been there after which suddenly they found an ounce of MDMA (ecstacy) in the back of the truckbed. Look up the Kelly Thomas murder where they beat and tasered the man to death for no reason or better yet look up the photo of his mangled disfigured face. All I am saying is that from the moment they have to wear these cams all of their interactions will be recorded. This would protect them and us (or the OP as you say) from any misjustice. A good cop is a GREAT cop - bad cops are the reason I'm pursuing this because I see it getting much much worse. I'm still unclear as to how to go about it through the proper channels. Can I start a petition myself or do I have to implore the ACLU to do it?

 

[cbg]

Can I ask a question?

Who gets to decide what conduct is acceptable in what situations?

 

[sKiTzo]

Can I ask a question?

Who gets to decide what conduct is acceptable in what situations?

If rights of a citizen are violated and an arrest is made at least there will be documented evidence of it. I believe the cops' "word" should no longer be golden. It's not fair anymore to assume that. A judge would obviously be the one who deems the conduct acceptable and the rights of the citizen were not violated and will have the video to prove or disprove that. This would be monumental protection for all parties involved.

 

[ecmst12]

When you offer to personally finance it or figure out how to pay for it, then you have an actual chance of getting something like this implemented.

 

[cbg]

So the taxpayers will put out the enormous cost of buying, maintaining, and enforcing the wearing of these headcams, but the decision of what is valid conduct or not will rest with an arbitrary judge? Of course, it will be agreed upon ahead of time that all judges are impartial? Tell me, what happens if some day you disagree with the judge's decision?

 

[Isis1]

So the taxpayers will put out the enormous cost of buying, maintaining, and enforcing the wearing of these headcams, but the decision of what is valid conduct or not will rest with an arbitrary judge? Of course, it will be agreed upon ahead of time that all judges are impartial? Tell me, what happens if some day you disagree with the judge's decision?

then we move for a webcam on the judge's head.