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stealth2

Under the Radar Member
My parents have a spare room as well as a spare car he can use. My family holds no ill feelings toward him- they just want me and my daughter safe. He would have the whole week to spend with our daughter and the only time he would have to spend a penny would be if he decided to take her somewhere like the zoo. He would have a place to sleep, a car, and 3 hot meals a day- all free of charge.
Do not expect him to accept lodging and meals from your family. That really is not a reasonable expectation, nor do I think a judge will. He and the child deserve their own time together - not under the watch of you or your parents. Very few parents would agree to those accommodations.
 


rocknrollmommy

Junior Member
Jeebus @ both of you. In 6mos (your child is 18mos, old. Correct?), you will be paying for two tickets, each way. If you take a week off of work each time (good luck with THAT), you will be paying $700 x 6. $4200. You should add in your lost income to the expense. Otherwise, you will be paying $1400 x 6. $8400.

Dad is under NO obligation to agree to fly to OK to see his child. None. And if he DOES agree to do so? You should expect to cover his lodgings. If I were him, I'd ask that you pay for hotel (and not the fleabag down the road, although I also wouldn't go for the Hilton - but a Comfort Inn, Holiday Inn, comparable), car rental (or that you provide him with a car) and a per diem for food. He should not be out $$ based on your decision to move.

As for choices... we ALL have choices in life. Sometimes, we make choices we'd rather not make. But we do it because it's the right thing to do.
You should read the post I made a few posts up. I had already stated that we would be more than willing to provide a place for him to stay and provide him with food AND a car. I would offer a hotel however there aren't any that I personally would want to stay in within an hour's drive so I certainly wouldn't expect him to stay there. I never said he had an obligation, I simply brought it up as a suggestion and asked for input. That is all.
If you take a week off of work each time (good luck with THAT), you will be paying $700 x 6. $4200. You should add in your lost income to the expense. Otherwise, you will be paying $1400 x 6. $8400.
again, if you read my above post you will see that taking the time off would not be a problem at all. I excluded the lost income just to give the lowest possible amount, plus the income will more than likely change between now and the time I move so there is no exact figure at this moment. I am fully aware of the fact that there will be lost wages.
 

gam

Senior Member
I've already spoken to both employers and they are willing to work with the visitation schedule. I am being realistic. The contact from the State of Oklahoma job also mentioned that I might be able to use FMLA after I'm eligible so it would not hurt me (and certainly wouldn't hurt to try).

My parents have a spare room as well as a spare car he can use. My family holds no ill feelings toward him- they just want me and my daughter safe. He would have the whole week to spend with our daughter and the only time he would have to spend a penny would be if he decided to take her somewhere like the zoo. He would have a place to sleep, a car, and 3 hot meals a day- all free of charge.
I was already posting my reply before yours was posted on where he is to stay when in OK for visits.

Nice your parents have a spare room, but it makes no difference. Dad is entitled to visit his child in his home, not your parents to save you money. Again it is real simple, the court has made their decision, dad is to have visits in dads state, not yours. The court is not gonna make dad stay with your parents for his visits.
 

jekyl007

Member
Yeah - I have. And had it granted - because the other parent had moved to a different state. What you don't seem to understand is that CA is loathe to relinquish jurisdiction. And you did not tell OP that her chances were as slim as they are. Because they are between slim and none.

nor did I tell her she had "great" chances either.. all I stated to her was that she could file it.. which she can and has every right to file if she chooses too.. no matter the chances it is OP's choice and she deserves to know that she can legally file it no matter what her chances may be.. and actually I did tell her privately that she may not get it but that she still had a legal right to file it and see what the outcome to it is.. Like OP stated herself, the worse they can say is no.. and no where did I say it would change her previous order.. just that if they were to possibly grant it, that then her case would be in the jurisdiction of OK.. she was asking if she could file not what her chances are of getting it moved..
 

jekyl007

Member
Do not expect him to accept lodging and meals from your family. That really is not a reasonable expectation, nor do I think a judge will. He and the child deserve their own time together - not under the watch of you or your parents. Very few parents would agree to those accommodations.

(as much as I hate to state this) I agree with Stealth here.. I do not know of any parent who would actually stay with the grandparents, it would feel like having someone watch my every move.. however, OP, You can bring it up to your ex about it but honestly from how you make him sound, I doubt he would agree to this.. I do support you moving to another state if it is what is best for you and your child. I do not believe though that any parent would agree to stay with grandparents while trying to visit with their child..
 

mistoffolees

Senior Member
Psst Misto, the tickets are 350.00 each, its 700.00 when the child turns two and is required to have her own ticket...so its going to cost mom about 6k a year.
OP said $350 each way or $700 RT. It wasn't clear if that was for both or for each. I assumed it was for each. The cheapest RT I can find is a bit more than $350, so it may be $700 for both.

HOWEVER, that's not all the costs. Add in parking in OK ($6 per day). Add in driving expenses. Add in luggage fees. Add in a rental car in CA. Add in the lost wages since she apparently plans to stay all week. It's a LOT of money.

I did not say they could just simply take it over.. if you read my post, I stated on there that she can legally file for it to be moved, but that it did not mean she would get that.. another poster was trying to make it sound like she didnt even have the legal right to file to have it moved to another state. which was not true.. no where in my post did I mislead her, even told her myself that it did not mean she would get it.. but that she does have a right to file it if she chooses to
Your post suggested to her that she had a chance of transferring jurisdiction to OK - and that's the way she understood it. The chance of that happening is nearly zero - so your post did nothing to inform her and actually misled her into believing that something was possible when it really isn't.

All I needed to know was the IT IS POSSIBLE. Once moved, I can inquire about it and make an informed decision at that time based on information from the OK court system (and legal counsel). I simply did not want to waste time trying to pursue it if it were absolutely out of the question.
It IS out of the question. Sure, there's about a 0.01% chance that it would be granted, but federal law precludes it.

And the fact that you're even considering it, apparently as a method to get out of your court ordered transportation expenses, says a great deal about your desire to foster Dad's relationship with the child.

the job i was applying for was for a fire safety dispatcher position. the interview process was more than 6 months long and involved polygraph and background investigations. the job literally fell into my lap as a good friend worked in the same office and put in a good word for me. yes, the father DID have custodial rights. we were in a committed relationship and living together. he had just as much custodial obligation as i had at that point.
BS. You had a $50 K job and refused it. At the time, you were unmarried and Dad had apparently not filed for custody of any type (based on the fact that you admit there were no court orders covering support). As an unmarried Dad, he had no right to determine what's right for the child without a court order for joint custody.

And even if he DID have custody, he had no right to tell you to pass up a $50 K job.

if i could work at mcdonald's and provide fully for my daughter, i'd do it in a heartbeat. the reality though, is that daycare costs $350 a week and that would essentially be my entire paycheck and then some. i would be losing money if i did that- it's just not a smart move.
I call BS.

First, there are state aid programs to help with CS. Second, it's interesting that you can get a $50 K job in CA when it's convenient, but when you're looking for an excuse to leave the state, there's nothing there but working at McDonald's. And you are apparently qualified enough to get a state job in OK without even showing up. OK is having major budget problem and has cut an enormous number of state jobs in the past year.

With reasonable effort, there's no reason why you shouldn't be able to get a job in CA.

there is no ripping my daughter from her father's arms. he wanted absolutely nothing- NOT A DAMN THING- to do with my daughter until it came time to put on a show for the court. i had witnesses lined up around the block who would testify before the judge and GOD that he was never a part of my daughter's life even when we lived under the same roof.
No one cares about your ranting against Dad. The fact is that he did step up to the plate after a while and has rights. The court has told you that you have to pay transportation. End of story.

i think your math about the flights is off. what i was even suggested looked like this (based on 6 yearly visitations)

1- i pay $700 (that's $350 round trip for both me and my daughter)
2- i pay $350 (for the father)
3- i pay $700 (that's $350 round trip for both me and my daughter)
4- i pay $350 (for the father)
5- i pay $700 (that's $350 round trip for both me and my daughter)
6- i pay $350 (for the father)

that comes to roughly $3150 in travel expense vs. $4200 if we flew to CA every time.
Why in God's name should he have to give up 3 weeks of work to satisfy your selfish desire to move the child away from him? He has no obligation to do so and expecting him to is unrealistic.

You're also ignoring all the lost wages (you're going to spend 3 weeks not working if you do it with your schedule and 6 weeks not working if he has any sense). Car rentals. Lodging expense. Meals. Luggage fees. If he exercises his full 6 weeks, I'd be absolutely shocked if it's less than $10 K MINIMUM.

If it happens or not, that was not my question. my question was:


CAN. Not "will it". I get the fact that it "probably won't happen". Fine. If I choose to pursue it, that is on me. I don't care what the odds are, if there is a chance (no matter how small), I will try. The worst that could happen is they say "no". Best case scenario? It's transferred. Voila.
No, worst case scenario is that you're further damaging any relationship between your child and her father. All over a topic where your chances of getting jurisdiction transferred are slim to none.


I just wish that ONCE in this entire thread, you had given a single reason why it was better for YOUR CHILD to move - but you haven't. It's all about you and your selfish desires.
 

stealth2

Under the Radar Member
I was already posting my reply before yours was posted
Ditto.

nor did I tell her she had "great" chances either.. all I stated to her was that she could file it.. which she can and has every right to file if she chooses too.. no matter the chances it is OP's choice and she deserves to know that she can legally file it no matter what her chances may be.. and actually I did tell her privately that she may not get it but that she still had a legal right to file it and see what the outcome to it is.. Like OP stated herself, the worse they can say is no.. and no where did I say it would change her previous order.. just that if they were to possibly grant it, that then her case would be in the jurisdiction of OK.. she was asking if she could file not what her chances are of getting it moved..
Yet, a responsible poster would tell her that her chances were close to zero. You didn't. You told her that you got it done, so her assumption would likely be that she could to. You were irresponsible.
 

rocknrollmommy

Junior Member
I was already posting my reply before yours was posted on where he is to stay when in OK for visits.

Nice your parents have a spare room, but it makes no difference. Dad is entitled to visit his child in his home, not your parents to save you money. Again it is real simple, the court has made their decision, dad is to have visits in dads state, not yours. The court is not gonna make dad stay with your parents for his visits.
Just for clarification, the spare room actually has it's own private entrance and can be completely separate from the rest of the home. There is an expectation of privacy that would be respected. I never stated I would ask the court for this arrangement, just brought it up for input. I honestly do not see why my reason for moving is not justified, as you've stated. Is facing homelessness not enough justification? Having your vehicle broken into on a monthly basis not enough? Coming home to find your doors unlocked (when they were locked when you left) not enough? I'm trying to make due with what I have and the safety and well being of my child are the first priority right now.

This was only the recommendation of the evaluator, the judge will have the final say on 1/20/11.
 

mistoffolees

Senior Member
You should read the post I made a few posts up. I had already stated that we would be more than willing to provide a place for him to stay and provide him with food AND a car. I would offer a hotel however there aren't any that I personally would want to stay in within an hour's drive so I certainly wouldn't expect him to stay there. I never said he had an obligation, I simply brought it up as a suggestion and asked for input. That is all.
He'd be out of his mind to accept. First, there's no way in the world that I'd ever accept that offer to stay with my ex's family - especially when ex is selfishly stealing my child away from me.

More importantly, the entire principle is wrong. Why should he give up 3 weeks of work to make it easier for you to take the child away from him? The principle is very simple - and standard almost everywhere in the country. YOU chose to move away, so YOU are responsible for transportation. I don't care if he's retired or could work from anywhere, it is up to you to get the child back to him. He has no responsibility to travel anywhere - and especially not to give up 3 weeks of work to do it.

What you're proposing is selfish and insane.

again, if you read my above post you will see that taking the time off would not be a problem at all. I excluded the lost income just to give the lowest possible amount, plus the income will more than likely change between now and the time I move so there is no exact figure at this moment. I am fully aware of the fact that there will be lost wages.
Yet you choose to leave them out. You're doing a lot of that - fudging the numbers to try to justify your selfish move.
 

stealth2

Under the Radar Member
Just for clarification, the spare room actually has it's own private entrance and can be completely separate from the rest of the home. There is an expectation of privacy that would be respected. I never stated I would ask the court for this arrangement, just brought it up for input. I honestly do not see why my reason for moving is not justified, as you've stated. Is facing homelessness not enough justification? Having your vehicle broken into on a monthly basis not enough? Coming home to find your doors unlocked (when they were locked when you left) not enough? I'm trying to make due with what I have and the safety and well being of my child are the first priority right now.
Please - lose the drama. You already have the court's permission to move, so that is all moot.

I cannot think of many parents who would agree to stay with their former "in-laws" to exercise their visitation. The only ones I can think of are those who have been married for many years, have older children, and are on exceptionally good terms with their in-laws.
 

jekyl007

Member
Ditto.



Yet, a responsible poster would tell her that her chances were close to zero. You didn't. You told her that you got it done, so her assumption would likely be that she could to. You were irresponsible.
I stated on a few of my posts, that it might not would happen but that she had a right to file to see if it could be done.. nobody on here knows her actual chances of getting it changed.. it goes both ways.. she has a chance and she dont have a chance.. nobody can say what Judge will say with what.. only the Judge knows that.. even with a slim chance she still has a chance..
 

gam

Senior Member
Just for clarification, the spare room actually has it's own private entrance and can be completely separate from the rest of the home. There is an expectation of privacy that would be respected. I never stated I would ask the court for this arrangement, just brought it up for input. I honestly do not see why my reason for moving is not justified, as you've stated. Is facing homelessness not enough justification? Having your vehicle broken into on a monthly basis not enough? Coming home to find your doors unlocked (when they were locked when you left) not enough? I'm trying to make due with what I have and the safety and well being of my child are the first priority right now.

This was only the recommendation of the evaluator, the judge will have the final say on 1/20/11.
Any reason you have stated is justification to move. HOWEVER ANY REASON YOU STATED IS NOT JUSTIFICATION TO MOVE THE CHILD.

You can move anywhere, you can't move the child though. I didn't make the rules, don't agree with them all, but those are the rules, there are some good reasons they have these rules. They do suck when your the one wanting/needing to move.

Don't care about that spare room in your parents home. As stated by me and other posters already, dad has been given by the court visitation in his home, in his and your current state. No court is going to make him take your offer.

That offer is just trouble waiting to happen. I would not take the offer, nor would tell anyone who asked me to take that offer. Once you give 3rd party's this much involvement you get trouble.

I posted you some other suggestions of offering dad time, with cutting down on your travel costs. Go back and find that post see if any of those are workable for you.
 

mistoffolees

Senior Member
I stated on a few of my posts, that it might not would happen but that she had a right to file to see if it could be done.. nobody on here knows her actual chances of getting it changed.. it goes both ways.. she has a chance and she dont have a chance.. nobody can say what Judge will say with what.. only the Judge knows that.. even with a slim chance she still has a chance..
Yes, and I have a chance of winning the lottery. By your logic, I should cash my entire paycheck and buy lottery tickets. :rolleyes::rolleyes:

UNDER FEDERAL LAW, her chances are close enough to zero that it's not worth the attempt - and it's irresponsible to suggest that she has a real chance.
 

stealth2

Under the Radar Member
Any reason you have stated is justification to move. HOWEVER ANY REASON YOU STATED IS NOT JUSTIFICATION TO MOVE THE CHILD.

You can move anywhere, you can't move the child though.
GAM - she has the permission of the court to move the child. So YES, she CAN move the child. BUT... she is required to pay for transportation for the child to spend time with Dad - and THAT is what the question is about, not whether or not she can move the child. Try reading.
 
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