child support questions...quoting paperwork

[soon2bstep]

What is the name of your state? child is in duval co, fl

we were having alot of issues with my stepsons mom.....and as you all got annoyed with me, i thought i'd hover and try to find relative posts and wait till i had papers for quotations lol.....also please remember i am the one who posted about the ex-wife filing a totally new divorce in florida a year after the original divorce(and the decree was finally domesticated in florida)

below is what has been requested of my fiance....i will post each question next to quote...if this is long i'm sorry but thought 1 long post better than several ones

"former wife requests stepped up visitation..."---what does that mean?
[
B]"former wife requests alife insurance be taken out at an amount which former husband can afford, which will cover all owed expenses in the event of former husbands demise"---[/B] they were married 2 1/2 years, and his court order for his dgtr does not mention this, and if we change his life insurance to benefit only her, that leaves no monies to his daughter(who is firstborn), nor to the child we're about to have(yes i know this baby doesnt count it's only a question)

"former wife requests that former husband pays all of former wife's current and future lawyer fees as she does not have the income nor the resources to continue to pay her legal fees and care for the minor child"--- she started this battle by going to a lawyer, stating she needed a divorce, AFTER their original divorce was finalized in december of 2006


i know this is alot, but he actually feels (and his lawyer has even mentioned) going to small claims court for HIS attorney fees as she is the one who fraudulently opened the case...the original court dates were terminated due to the letter we wrote that included the original divorce papers...and now florida is apparently forcing her and her atty to back track and petition CALIFORNIA to relinquish their hold over child support, since at the time there were no custody proceedings/cases, and their divorce papers actually have "state of california, county of san diego, retains all rights to establishing child support unless they are petiitioned from child's home state of a true and factual custody case"...question for the last sentence is, since california has been made aware (they recieved the same letter that florida did about the divorce and illegally obtained divorce from florida), can they decide to hold out over this matter? (we are hoping not, which is why i ask).....we more than have the money to pay support for 2 children and raise our own.....but we were made aware just the other day, that apparently our lawyer replied to the above "requests" with a "former husband, respondent, *denies* life insurance *denies* lawyer fees, *agrees* to stepped up visitation"....but then the lawyer put that my fiance DENIES that his wife is the one who should support my stepson....we NEVER told our lawyer that!!! so now it appears our lawyer has opened an all out custody battle.....and i'm guessing that since he makes enough money and we have a stable home (she's moved 4 times in 3 years), and that we have a better school district more stability and a solid family (she's been engaged 3 times since they split in jan 2005), and such that there's probably no chance they'd give him an option to "take" custody so to say,they'll just up the child support won't they? they don't really care who can take better care? or has the best chance of promoting visits?(our last convo with her where we talked to my stepson, she told my fiance when we were done that he'd see his son over her dead body and that since he is with me and didnt "want" to find a job/home in florida rather than texas(hey there's oil in them there waters! and money behind it!, he is *choosing* not to "have a son")

ok sry so long go ahead and complain it'd be the best adult convo i've had in over a week

 

[Gracie3787]

What is the name of your state? child is in duval co, fl

we were having alot of issues with my stepsons mom.....and as you all got annoyed with me, i thought i'd hover and try to find relative posts and wait till i had papers for quotations lol.....also please remember i am the one who posted about the ex-wife filing a totally new divorce in florida a year after the original divorce(and the decree was finally domesticated in florida)

below is what has been requested of my fiance....i will post each question next to quote...if this is long i'm sorry but thought 1 long post better than several ones

"former wife requests stepped up visitation..."---what does that mean?
[
B]"former wife requests alife insurance be taken out at an amount which former husband can afford, which will cover all owed expenses in the event of former husbands demise"---[/B] they were married 2 1/2 years, and his court order for his dgtr does not mention this, and if we change his life insurance to benefit only her, that leaves no monies to his daughter(who is firstborn), nor to the child we're about to have(yes i know this baby doesnt count it's only a question)

"former wife requests that former husband pays all of former wife's current and future lawyer fees as she does not have the income nor the resources to continue to pay her legal fees and care for the minor child"--- she started this battle by going to a lawyer, stating she needed a divorce, AFTER their original divorce was finalized in december of 2006


i know this is alot, but he actually feels (and his lawyer has even mentioned) going to small claims court for HIS attorney fees as she is the one who fraudulently opened the case...the original court dates were terminated due to the letter we wrote that included the original divorce papers...and now florida is apparently forcing her and her atty to back track and petition CALIFORNIA to relinquish their hold over child support, since at the time there were no custody proceedings/cases, and their divorce papers actually have "state of california, county of san diego, retains all rights to establishing child support unless they are petiitioned from child's home state of a true and factual custody case"...question for the last sentence is, since california has been made aware (they recieved the same letter that florida did about the divorce and illegally obtained divorce from florida), can they decide to hold out over this matter? (we are hoping not, which is why i ask).....we more than have the money to pay support for 2 children and raise our own.....but we were made aware just the other day, that apparently our lawyer replied to the above "requests" with a "former husband, respondent, *denies* life insurance *denies* lawyer fees, *agrees* to stepped up visitation"....but then the lawyer put that my fiance DENIES that his wife is the one who should support my stepson....we NEVER told our lawyer that!!! so now it appears our lawyer has opened an all out custody battle.....and i'm guessing that since he makes enough money and we have a stable home (she's moved 4 times in 3 years), and that we have a better school district more stability and a solid family (she's been engaged 3 times since they split in jan 2005), and such that there's probably no chance they'd give him an option to "take" custody so to say,they'll just up the child support won't they? they don't really care who can take better care? or has the best chance of promoting visits?(our last convo with her where we talked to my stepson, she told my fiance when we were done that he'd see his son over her dead body and that since he is with me and didnt "want" to find a job/home in florida rather than texas(hey there's oil in them there waters! and money behind it!, he is *choosing* not to "have a son")

ok sry so long go ahead and complain it'd be the best adult convo i've had in over a week

It appears to be that she is asking for more visitation time.

Is the order/petition in FL? If so, FL law allows for the court to order parents to carry life insurance for childrens' benefit.

All partyies to a case have the right to request that the aother pay thier legal fees. It does not mean that it will be ordered though, the judge will decide that.

 

[soon2bstep]

to gracie

yes it is in florida...

we arent oo worried about the insurance policy, we have 2, 1 for each of us...his is for 175k total, and she is asking that that policy be made payable to her, and that would leave another child(i'm not counting the 1 we have together), who would have no "benefits"...my life insurance is only for 50k, and it is for *MY* child(so that there are no issues of stupidity i cant explain it), and since i am having a problematic pregnancy, it's actually written in an affidavit that my insurance goes ONLY towards whoever would take care of my child, and i have appointed a guardian to ensure the money is spent on housing and baby costs(i had some help lol).....

as for the legal fess, that is really the only thing we're upset about b/c NO ONE would have legal fees if she hadn't fraudulently started a case in the first place(the original case was just the divorce and then after she miraculously found us, she added an addendum to include child support to include retroactive support and such)

one thing i mentioned, is she's also asking for ALL out of pocket expenses to be paid in half, yet the amount of cs we're *initially* agreeing to is $600, because he is in preschool, is potty trained and such...thats twice what we pay for his daughter...after she first agreed to the amount, she decided then that she wants ALL legal fees paid, the life insurance, as well as the half costs, which apparently includes just about anything(we thought cs was supposed to cover *some* of those things?)

again i am soooo sry this is so long, but i thank you and anyone else who replies!

 

[Zigner]

Life insurance to cover his expenses? How much would you expect that to be?
Think about changing the beneficiary designations to a %...90% to 1 person and 10% in trust for the child in question. He won't pay any more for the policy, and it covers what is asked.

 

[soon2bstep]

zigner

it's a company sponsored policy and when he inquired they said they'd have to check.....i did just find the paper where we can re-up his sgli from the navy, and it'd give him the full 400k, but wow, the price listing says he'd eventually end up paying like 1800 a month for it by the time he was 50 something.....

you know, i was wondering the same thing about *how much* and here's what i got
600/mo x 12 mo x 14 years=$100800.00
and is this policy supposed to cover any college expenses, or this half and half oop exp thing she wants? it doesnt specify exactly, just cs and all costs.....
here's what we'd need for just his 2 children (amt incl both children)
we would need 180000k just for child support, not including any other expenses.....and then when you throw in the other baby(non cs of course), that would help me cover burial expenses, and our home, and his car, we'd need another 250k
so in all yea we need a total of $430k in life ins(if he died tomorrow!), but his 1st wife(daughters mom), has pretty much said as long as *I* or his *mom* helps after he passes, then she doesnt need anything.....his sons mom is saying she just wants to support him.....well if he died and didnt have life insurance, what would she do? after her 255 from ssi, come after me??? cos then she'd have to pay for my stepson 100% oop!

 

[katkat75]

FS 61.13
7(c) : To the extent necessary to protect an award of child support, the court may order the obligor to purchase or maintain a life insurance policy or a bond, or to otherwise secure the child support award with any other assets which may be suitable for that purpose.

The following is anecdotal...not a law - From what I've seen a $100,000.00 life insurance policy payable to child is a pretty standard requirement for both parents (as NCP becomes the CP in the event of the CP dying)

 

[soon2bstep]

dual policies?

i pay $60 a month for each $50k i have.....if she's wanting half of her out of pocket expenses(for my stepson), a life insurance policy and an amount of $600 a month, how the crap would she afford it?

oh and i was reading her financial affidavit, and noticed that she already shows she has nothing left over, but that she has car insurance and gas, but no car? we know she just bought a brand new car, so we were curious, if she lies on the affidavit, and blows up her expenses can those be brought to light? we ask because she has stated she lives alone, yet all of her utilities are in her boyfriends name, she lives out of her means by being in a 3/2 townhome, has a brand new car(when we just paid last year or so to fix the old one which was a 2002), and she's listed that her ulitlities are like 300, rent is 685, her food bills are 250 and she spends 100 a month on clothing(but the generic form doesnt show wether clothing for herself or child).....her gas/ins comes to like 400 and we know her car pymt has got to be around 300+ b/c she has so many repos broken leases etc, and even with a co-signer it wouldnt be lower than that.....sorry we are just trying to figure all this out.....she tells us she works 2 jobs, but only put 1 income down.....her statement says it's just her and my ss in the home, yet the utilities are in someone elses name....and we can prove that....

 

[Isis1]

could boyfriend possibly be a new sugar daddy? prove that's not the case either. a person doesn't have to live there to have their name on the utilities.

 

[soon2bstep]

haha sugar daddy

yeah he possibly could.....but if she's getting income from outside sources that are covering her living expenses, wouldnt that help her in her case? showing someone else besides my fiance has been allegedly taking care of her and my stepson?

actually we know someone who lives where she does, and works on the property, and has mentioned in passing that they both live there and when they went on vacation this person was responsible for caring for pets and mail.....the guy recieves mail there, and apparently has his things there.....

maybe we're making a big deal out of nothing.....my fiance would like to go for custody, b/c it would seem more likely a judge would take moms constantly moving, quitting jobs, rotating *partners*, into mind.....as until he got this job he was in the military for nearly 9 years, only moved when the military told him to(except our move to here of course), has only had me, and would be able to better care for the child in the financial aspects, emotional etc, as even though she gets on our nerves, we don't exactly go around running our mouths about her, and we've seen where she's emailed friends and family(of mine!), talking about how he refuses to support his son, and she wishes he'd sign his rights over, that her boyfriend(s) are nicer to him etc.....at one point she wrote my aunt claiming she had an old police report claiming he had beaten her senseless and when he asked her about it, said she never wrote that.....this has just been one disaster after another, and in fact my stepson has no idea he'll have a sibling in october...we arent saying a new child affects his responsibilites to the other 2 in any way, and i make enough to support my child alone, but seeing as she would say this has some bad bearing on her son, we've hit it from everyone including our lawyer(as he's in florida it's easy to do)......

 

[soon2bstep]

i am calling our lawyer today, as for some reason they love to charge $21.00 for me to just leave a message, however we haven't heard anything from fiance's lawyer or ex-wife's lawyer.....

hopefully something has come about wether bad or good, but hopefully something!!!

 

[CJane]

Have Dad purchase a 15 year term policy for $150K. He can likely get one for $50/month or less. It expires in 15 years, assuming he's still alive. He's out the money in premiums, but nothing else. If he dies, his obligation to the child is covered.

Easy peasy.

 

[Zephyr]

Have Dad purchase a 15 year term policy for $150K. He can likely get one for $50/month or less. It expires in 15 years, assuming he's still alive. He's out the money in premiums, but nothing else. If he dies, his obligation to the child is covered.

Easy peasy.

and there are some term policies where he would actually get some of his money back....

 

[penelope10]

Have Dad purchase a 15 year term policy for $150K. He can likely get one for $50/month or less. It expires in 15 years, assuming he's still alive. He's out the money in premiums, but nothing else. If he dies, his obligation to the child is covered.

Easy peasy.

Now once again I'm coming in at the 11th hour. So nobody yell at me cause I didn't read all the posts. (Feeling a little lazy today). Anyway if life insurance is bought there are several things besides covering the amount of CS that could be owed at the time of the obligator's death to be considered... Was the obligator ordered to pay health insurance etc. in the order? (If so these obligations may not end at the time of death depending on the state you live in) So these figures should also be thrown into the mix when trying to figure out how much insurance to take out. Also there needs to be some thought as to who the beneficiary is. Lots of folks think making the kiddos the beneficiary will solve the problem of an ex going after the estate. In reality it may not. Depends on state statute.Often the beneficiary should be the person the CS would have been paid to had the ex not died. So if life insurance is paid directly to kiddos the estate may not be protected. The money wasn't ordered to be paid directly to the kiddos in the first place. It was paid to ex spouse or whomever for the BENEFIT of the kids. (If that makes sense).

Just my two cents. If anyone else presented this already, my apologies.

 

[soon2bstep]

update

well, stepsons mom is still trying to domesticate the divorce from california....apparently the judge is not exactly thrilled, and has apparently made it quite obvious he is unhappy about what has happened....after fiance's lawyer sent his response and answer to the petition of life ins, and all the other stuff, the ex's atty has not made any further contact...i thought about a term life policy...and now i am under the assumption our atty is about to drop the bomb that mom has refused visitation(hehe, i have no idea how, but we were able to dig through fiance's voice mail and found the 5 messages about him not seeing him until he paid, and that he needed to just sign his rights b/c her bf(the last bf not this bf), is better with their son, and that she "isn't going to quit arguing or going to court until he pays the 1k that she KNOWS he HAS to pay", along with the statement that as long as she is alive he will never see his son unless he stays AT HER HOUSE).....

anyways.....we also have emails from her work email that had stated over a year ago how she'd gone to CSE and they had ordered 800/mo....well, there's more things as well, but now atty is planning on dropping the bomb that although a FULL bond has not been formed, that the "father is more apt at providing a better situation, without having governmental assistance or child support from the mother, as well as better to provide ample visitation as father has family in the area where the child currently resides which shows child would be in the area even when mother's visits are not scheduled at such time, and that mother is apparently going after only monetary means as she refuses to set up a visitation schedule at this time, and refuses to do so until after child support is set. also that child's emotional stability is being stretched from being moved around so much, and with being moved around from day care to day care even when father was paying a substancial amount in support in past times"**************...so fiance's atty has taken this a step further, and is going for an all out custody battle.....

will fiance's ability to raise this child without anyone's assistance have a bearing on custody? also, we have the papers from the *3* daycares he was kicked out of from mom being short $30-$70 on payments, and rather than just call and ask for the money, she'd take him out for 2 weeks, and then put him back into another daycare.....at the time he was being whisked from caregiver to caregiver, fiance was sending her 800/mo, that not only paid 100% of daycare, but according to an email that came from her work account, it paid for groceries as well, and part of her car insurance...i guess her thing was that she knew if she asked about more money at that time, he'd give it to her, but not before a looooooong lecture on the fact he was doubling her income, yet she still couldnt afford to live.....

we are trying to get a court date for late june or early july, and are staying with family of mine...his atty has asked ex's atty for visitation during that time, and her atty said she'd have to think about it.....her atty isn't even worried that her client isn't allowing visits, and almost seems like she is promoting this behaviour.....

oh and yes health insurance has been requested, after our REPEATED attempts at trying to get the child on insurance, as it is free for fiance and up to 6 children! yet she refuses to give us the info that we need(fiance's insurance company REQURES, photocopy of ss card, and a CERTIFIED copy of birth certificate,NOT a photocopy.....)

 

[fairisfair]

well, stepsons mom is still trying to domesticate the divorce from california....apparently the judge is not exactly thrilled, and has apparently made it quite obvious he is unhappy about what has happened....after fiance's lawyer sent his response and answer to the petition of life ins, and all the other stuff, the ex's atty has not made any further contact...i thought about a term life policy...and now i am under the assumption our atty is about to drop the bomb that mom has refused visitation(hehe, i have no idea how, but we were able to dig through fiance's voice mail and found the 5 messages about him not seeing him until he paid, and that he needed to just sign his rights b/c her bf(the last bf not this bf), is better with their son, and that she "isn't going to quit arguing or going to court until he pays the 1k that she KNOWS he HAS to pay", along with the statement that as long as she is alive he will never see his son unless he stays AT HER HOUSE).....

anyways.....we also have emails from her work email that had stated over a year ago how she'd gone to CSE and they had ordered 800/mo....well, there's more things as well, but now atty is planning on dropping the bomb that although a FULL bond has not been formed, that the "father is more apt at providing a better situation, without having governmental assistance or child support from the mother, as well as better to provide ample visitation as father has family in the area where the child currently resides which shows child would be in the area even when mother's visits are not scheduled at such time, and that mother is apparently going after only monetary means as she refuses to set up a visitation schedule at this time, and refuses to do so until after child support is set. also that child's emotional stability is being stretched from being moved around so much, and with being moved around from day care to day care even when father was paying a substancial amount in support in past times"**************...so fiance's atty has taken this a step further, and is going for an all out custody battle.....

will fiance's ability to raise this child without anyone's assistance have a bearing on custody? also, we have the papers from the *3* daycares he was kicked out of from mom being short $30-$70 on payments, and rather than just call and ask for the money, she'd take him out for 2 weeks, and then put him back into another daycare.....at the time he was being whisked from caregiver to caregiver, fiance was sending her 800/mo, that not only paid 100% of daycare, but according to an email that came from her work account, it paid for groceries as well, and part of her car insurance...i guess her thing was that she knew if she asked about more money at that time, he'd give it to her, but not before a looooooong lecture on the fact he was doubling her income, yet she still couldnt afford to live.....

we are trying to get a court date for late june or early july, and are staying with family of mine...his atty has asked ex's atty for visitation during that time, and her atty said she'd have to think about it.....her atty isn't even worried that her client isn't allowing visits, and almost seems like she is promoting this behaviour.....

oh and yes health insurance has been requested, after our REPEATED attempts at trying to get the child on insurance, as it is free for fiance and up to 6 children! yet she refuses to give us the info that we need(fiance's insurance company REQURES, photocopy of ss card, and a CERTIFIED copy of birth certificate,NOT a photocopy.....)

you haven't gotten ANY better at all. You haven't learned a thing.

your little "hehe" comment is totally irritating, and disgusting.

and the short answer to your question is NO