Custodial parent leaving for a month or longer leaving us with kids...

[Ohiogal]

I wasnt the one who called CPS, btw, it was before I was even in the picture. So yes, CPS has been called on Mom before... so, obviously there is someone who questions Mom's parenting and it wasnt me. Wanna throw another one out?

I dont appreciate that you all assume I have it out for the Mom. As a matter of fact, it comes across more as judging me because of your own bad experiences with a stepmom. Would this conversation be different if I was, say, a concerned grandparent? A neighbor? Aunt? Uncle? Psychiatrist?????

Definitely if it was a psychiatrist who is a third party unrelated to anyone as they are mandated reporters.

 

[Hisbabygirl77]

I wasnt the one who called CPS, btw, it was before I was even in the picture. So yes, CPS has been called on Mom before... so, obviously there is someone who questions Mom's parenting and it wasnt me. Wanna throw another one out?

I dont appreciate that you all assume I have it out for the Mom. As a matter of fact, it comes across more as judging me because of your own bad experiences with a stepmom. Would this conversation be different if I was, say, a concerned grandparent? A neighbor? Aunt? Uncle? Psychiatrist?????

A neighbor, Aunt, Uncle would have gotten the exact same response. A psychaitrist would have lost there license for breaking dr/patient confindentiality.

 

[AL_Madi]

Would I condemn Dad for realizing better parenting skills if he was taught by a professional? No. Yet you are "teaching" him and you are not a professional, so not a fair comparison.... If your husband cared RIGHT NOW, after all your teachings, he would be asking the questions, not you.

as I said. "Dad is working on the parenting and I am a support system but follow the suggestions/boundaries of the counselor's action plan." Yes, I realize that in a previous post I may have indicated that I was the one teaching, but to clarify, it is more of how he observes my relationship with my children and also the action plan from the counselor on how he will parent his children.

I am not ignorant on the past mistakes I have made. One was to take on the primary parenting role since Dad did not. But I also saw where this was driving a wedge between us and the children. There was chaos, plain and simple. It didnt take me long to realize what was going on, I was enabling Dad. Heck, there were times I was enabling Mom and I took the brunt of being the bad guy. I'm not completely stupid though and I got help on how to handle it as well as the Dad.

 

[Proserpina]

I wasnt the one who called CPS, btw, it was before I was even in the picture. So yes, CPS has been called on Mom before... so, obviously there is someone who questions Mom's parenting and it wasnt me. Wanna throw another one out?

I dont appreciate that you all assume I have it out for the Mom. As a matter of fact, it comes across more as judging me because of your own bad experiences with a stepmom. Would this conversation be different if I was, say, a concerned grandparent? A neighbor? Aunt? Uncle? Psychiatrist?????

Nah.

It's very possibly our own experiences BEING a step-parent influencing some of our answers here.

Did it occur to you that some folk might have actually been that over-stepping step-parent and would prefer to help someone else avoid those pitfalls before it actually becomes a problem?

(to answer your question, "yes" and "nope". Yes, the conversation might be different if you were a psychiatrist who was involved in the diagnosis, therapy and/or other issues pertaining to the involved parties. But other than that? Nope. Aunty, Uncle, neighbor, whatever - it'd be the same)

 

[LdiJ]

LDiJ, thank you for your post. It was very clear and straightforward without leaning to the snarky side. Is there any reading (for more common folk) that you would recommend in regards to learning the law when it comes to divorce/custody issues? Is there I 'Child Custody laws for Dummies'?

One thing that I think is incredibly helpful is to take a day off work, and spend it observing family law hearings. Pay attention and see what matters to the judge, and what does not matter to the judge.

Paying attention to what is being said on these forums is also a great way to get some real insight into the law and how it works. Read some of the older posts.

 

[AL_Madi]

Dogmatique, yes it has occured to me and if the matter of presentation is a respectable one than I am more inclined to see the bigger picture. When my character or intelligence (or my husbands) is insulted by making snarky and unjustified remarks, then I tend to get annoyed.

If Dad was posting questions and got answers like these, I would not be surprised if he would retreat and stick his head in the sand. Baby steps.

So, now a question that I would appreciate some guidance in:

Mom may get an assignement away for 3 months. She already asked if she could take the kids with her and Dad said No. If she accepts and leaves the kids for that timeframe - is it suggested to get a temporary (NOT PERM.) change in custody? Or because there is joint custody, this is not necessary?

Maybe a better question would be - What exactly is the difference between NCP and CP?

 

[Nevergrowup]

Would this conversation be different if I was, say, a concerned grandparent? A neighbor? Aunt? Uncle? Psychiatrist?????

Nope, it would really be the same. If it was a psychiatrist, they wouldn't be on a public board asking, they would be doing their duty by reporting it to the proper authorities if children were being neglected/abused. If it was a grandparent, aunt, uncle, neighbor, hairdresser, dog walker, ect, we would tell them NUNYA, as in none of your business, as well. Stepmoms aren't the only ones that know better than parents, others try to interfere as well, but stepmoms are the largest bunch.

Look. I know you mean well. I know that all of the neighbors mean well too. You care about these kids, we all realize that. But it isn't up to you to solve all the problems you have uncovered. It isn't up to you to "teach" your husband ANYTHING in regards to his children unless they are children you biologically share with him, then you can have at it.

There are a lot of kids I know that have parents I consider crappy. Do I interfere? No. Do I try to guide them in the parenting ways I consider appropriate? No. Do I try to TEACH them, as you are doing, how to parent? NO! And yes, I realize I am not married to them, however, my husband isn't perfect and I don't try to teach him how to be. It isn't my job to train an adult, or mold him into what I think he should be.


I've asked you before, and you haven't answered. Why is it up to you to try and solve all these issues? They functioned before you came along, even if it isn't in the way you would personally have functioned. So why is it up to you to point out how they are doing it wrong?

 

[AL_Madi]

I've asked you before, and you haven't answered. Why is it up to you to try and solve all these issues? They functioned before you came along, even if it isn't in the way you would personally have functioned. So why is it up to you to point out how they are doing it wrong?

Functioning is such a loose term and it is a question on whether or not the functioning is healthy or not. I am not pointing out how they are doing things wrong or right. The counselor is educating the Dad on parenting techniques.
It isnt up to me to solve all issues. Or any issues that deal with his children. The only thing I have asked from Dad is that he do what he's doing (continue the counseling).

It wasnt this bad at the beginning - the kids would repeat some of the things Mom was saying about me, but I never took it to heart knowing that kids can manipulate situations for a reaction. It wasnt until a certain series of events happened that things got really ugly.

Seems I am not the only one who avoids answering questions though - seems to me there was one about the Dad not having the right to stand up for himself when Mom was threatening to keep the kids from him when he went in hand with a copy of the standard visitation to say enough, "if we can't agree, then we'll go standard but you will not use the children in this manner". How is that 'threatening'? Or, how could this have been handled better - not confront Mom and try to work things out (there was a 3rd party there too, her spouse, btw) by being adults or bypassing this and filing contempt? But then we get back to "reasonable". If there is a history established in the past of every other week, then switched to every weekend that was to be temporary while she was working weekends but was extended to perm because Mom decided so - well, what rights does Dad have? Just because it states 'reasonable', does this mean Mom can cut back visitation to once a month without just cause?


Part of the reason that I am asking these questions is because I am currently taking college courses but I am undecided what field I want to make my career - the human mind intrigues me and I have a solid interest in psych, but I also have a strong sense of right and wrong (my downfall) and maybe legal field - but honestly I dont think I could hack it.

 

[Isis1]

One thing that I think is incredibly helpful is to take a day off work, and spend it observing family law hearings. Pay attention and see what matters to the judge, and what does not matter to the judge.

Paying attention to what is being said on these forums is also a great way to get some real insight into the law and how it works. Read some of the older posts.

i love this advice. when i first started hanging out in courtrooms, i was amazed at the judges' demeanors. they all were different, some OG-like, some more LD-like, but the results were always the same. going before my last judge, was like reading responses of this forum. i actually "gasped" out loud by accident.

 

[CJane]

Seems I am not the only one who avoids answering questions though - seems to me there was one about the Dad not having the right to stand up for himself when Mom was threatening to keep the kids from him when he went in hand with a copy of the standard visitation to say enough, "if we can't agree, then we'll go standard but you will not use the children in this manner". How is that 'threatening'? Or, how could this have been handled better - not confront Mom and try to work things out (there was a 3rd party there too, her spouse, btw) by being adults or bypassing this and filing contempt?

The question was answered. Dad could NOT demand to "go standard" if the order says "reasonable visitation". That wording gives Mom the exclusive right to determine when Dad gets his visitation.

But then we get back to "reasonable". If there is a history established in the past of every other week, then switched to every weekend that was to be temporary while she was working weekends but was extended to perm because Mom decided so - well, what rights does Dad have?

He has the right to "reasonable visitation", which is again up to interpretation.

Just because it states 'reasonable', does this mean Mom can cut back visitation to once a month without just cause?

Yes. It means exactly that.

Look, there can be no contempt if there's no WILLFUL and MALICIOUS VIOLATION of the order. If the order says "reasonable visitation" it's virtually impossible to "get" someone on contempt with that wording.

Now what Dad COULD do is file for a modification based on status quo. But the chances of him becoming primary parent or getting a 50/50 schedule in such a contentious environment are slim to none.

 

[AL_Madi]

He has the right to "reasonable visitation", which is again up to interpretation. Now what Dad COULD do is file for a modification based on status quo. But the chances of him becoming primary parent or getting a 50/50 schedule in such a contentious environment are slim to none.

Thank you for painting a clearer picture, I was not understanding how Dad was in the wrong since he did seek the advice of an attorney and was told that if the parent's couldnt agree on a schedule then it would fall back to the state standard. The attorney did not state anything about having to revise the order. Dad sought the advice of the attorney at the time because this was not the first incident of having his children withheld. I was with him at the appt. and I am glad he went because it was the attorney who was hard on him and told him everything he was doing wrong. Well, ok maybe not everything but some important things as simple as talking with the kids teachers and doctors.

So, reasonable can only be defined by Mom? And now I am confused as to how joint custody falls in place. I'm ignorant on this - I thought joint custody was pretty much 50/50 and when I got divorced 'reasonable' was merely the allowance of giving the father more days than the standard (divorce was in another state, though). Heck, when I moved out of state we worked the visitation without having to go back to court and I even reimbursed my ex the child support for the time he had them in the summer so I knew the kids were being fed.

 

[AL_Madi]

Look, there can be no contempt if there's no WILLFUL and MALICIOUS VIOLATION of the order.

Ok, so it has been determined that because of the 'reasonable' wording as far as visitation goes and there is no contempt if Mom withholds the children.

Reviewing the decree it has been determined that there has been willful and malicious violations of the order - starting with speaking bad about the other parent in front/to the children. Almost every single guideline in the decree has been violated. Dad's error was trying to be reasonable with Mom and not filing contempt. But then again - wouldnt it work in his favor to show that he attempted to be reasonable without having to waste the courts time? But from what I am understanding, in order for Dad to protect what rights he does have he really has 2 options - live by Mom's rules and put up with it, or run to the court every time she violates the decree and file contempt. So when does a contempt need to be filed - or rather, what is the timeframe for one to be filed? A day, week, month?
What exactly does filing a contempt accomplish?

Gads, the legal system is extremely complicated!

 

[MichaCA]

I can't answer your bigger question, but I do think its good to show the court anytime a parent attempts to negotiate any agreement with the other parent...when there is a dispute. Dad should attempt to make efforts out of good will around agreements...and point those attempts out when he goes to court. I think dad needs to keep trying to get a firm visitation schedule if there is one that he believes would be reasonable for everyone, and in the best interests of the children. I think when requesting something of the court, it is good to make some concrete proposals, in the court ordered mediation stage (if there is one), and for sure in his motion.

 

[AL_Madi]

I did forget to mention previously that I stand corrected on the wording of the decree - it DOES state that if parents cannot agree on 'reasonable' visitation, it shall revert back to the state standard. So, Dad bringing this to the attention of Mom was in fact his right and he did not do anything out of line - right? And he is entitled to the minimum of what the standard sets and if Mom does not agree, he CAN file contempt if Mom withholds visitation.

Anyways, I do want to take the time to thank everyone for reminding me to take a few steps back and take the opportunity to learn. I like the idea of visiting a courtroom to learn more.

 

[Ohiogal]

I did forget to mention previously that I stand corrected on the wording of the decree - it DOES state that if parents cannot agree on 'reasonable' visitation, it shall revert back to the state standard. So, Dad bringing this to the attention of Mom was in fact his right and he did not do anything out of line - right? And he is entitled to the minimum of what the standard sets and if Mom does not agree, he CAN file contempt if Mom withholds visitation.

Anyways, I do want to take the time to thank everyone for reminding me to take a few steps back and take the opportunity to learn. I like the idea of visiting a courtroom to learn more.

He should follow the standard visitation. If mom denies based on standard visitation then he should file contempt.