Discipline of a child

[Rochelle]

Thank you all for the rather rambling replies I received. My husband was planning on taking her into the teachers' lounge, away from prying eyes. But nevertheless, I just wanted to know if that was legally abuse, since it is just a disciplinary action. I did not realize that the fact the
he and her mother choose to spank her would create such a
commotion. I was expecting a short answer. I appreciate all the time given to my question, and while I don't believe that spanking a child is teaching it to hurt other people, I believe that it has a place in society.

 

[JAR]

spanking or no spanking is a case by case choice and at times works well and others does nothing but make your hand hurt. embarassing on the other hand...i have to tell you that no matter what any social worker says seems to do the trick quite well. when i was 8 years old i got in trouble at school for using a curse word and my father was called he came to the school and infront of all my friends made me apologize to everyone of them individually. he stood over me and wouldn't leave untill i was finished, but before he left he stood infront of my class and apologized as well saying how he thought he had raised a better daughter then how i acted that day. i was so embarassed, i hated my dad for at least a week after that. but i tell you what you never caught me doing anything that was out of line again, there was no way i was going through that again. it was harsh but it did the trick.

 

[HumorMe!]

LOOK GLP! You were right!

Aren't you glad I'm around to prove you right?

Slippery Soap, I do not BEAT my children (my children are well aware of this, hence their sticking their tongues out at me when I say I'm gonna beat me a child! lol), nor do I purposefully set out to humiliate them in public. I do inform them that they will not get to skip the consequences of their actions just because we are out in public. If they don't wish to be embarrassed, then they will not misbehave. So far, so good.

And no, I don't think we should close a thread just because the subject is controversial. Otherwise, we are all just making small talk and not helping anyone!

hm

Have a laugh, it's good for you!


ENGINE TROUBLE
submitted by T. Goldberg


Fifteen minutes into flight, the pilot announced: "Ladies and gentlemen, one of our engines has failed. There is nothing to worry about. Our flight will take an hour longer than scheduled, but we still have three engines left."

Thirty minutes later the pilot announced: "One more engine has failed and the flight will take an additional two hours. But don't worry, we can fly just fine on two engines." An hour later the pilot announced: "One more engine has failed and our arrival will be delayed another three hours. But don't worry, we still have one engine left."

The blonde in seat 17A turned to the man next to her and said, "If we lose one more engine, we'll be up here all day!"

 

[digger65]

I pity those who don't find it extremely important to teach your children that there are consequences to their actions and they MUST make a wrong right! That in itself is humiliating. Teach them while they are young and prevent hardships when they leave the protection of home. Your serman had nothing to do with teaching humility--WHICH IS IN THE BIBLE!!! If you would like to preach, please go to the appropriate forum!

[Edited by digger65 on 03-21-2001 at 10:29 PM]

 

[SLIPPERYSOAP]

someone should have taught you the differance between humility and humiliation.

 

[HumorMe!]

someone should have taught you the differance between humility and humiliation.

And someone should have taught a great many of us that making a point while tearing into someone only leaves them mad. They aren't thinking of your point at all!

Someone who does not learn to be disciplined and humbleness now, will only be humiliated later. Unless, of course, their last name is Clinton.

hm

ETERNAL BLOATING

A dietitian was once addressing a large audience in Chicago.

"The material we put into our stomachs is enough to have killed most
of us sitting here, years ago. Red meat is awful. Soft drinks erode
your stomach lining. Chinese food is loaded with MSG. Vegetables can
be disastrous, and none of us realizes the long-term harm caused by
the germs in our drinking water. But there is one thing that is the
most dangerous of all and we all have, or will, eat it. Can anyone
here tell me what food it is that causes the most grief and suffering
for years after eating it?"

A 75-year-old man in the front row stood up and said, "Wedding cake."

 

[digger65]

And...one learns humility through the process of humiliation. This is the difference, not to be confused with your "differance"! When a child acts in a manor not conducive with family or societal rules, a little dose of humiliation will teach them not to be so assertive (or to be more humble--or have humility) in their behavior the next time.

On that note, slipperysoap, I will not waste any more of my time arguing a point with someone lacking the intellectual capacity to debate or contribute to a topic of discussion.

I apologize to the rest of you for this diversion from the original topic.

Rochelle, please go to this link for a list of organizations and web sights that may be of great assistance. There are even organizations aimed at assisting non-custodial dads.

http://www.therightvoice.org/links/default.htm
http://www.childprotectionreform.org/index.htm

[Edited by digger65 on 03-22-2001 at 02:13 PM]

 

[glp9986]

Hey, HumorMe, I was at a local diner having lunch today and this woman came in with her 2 kids. Right away she began to berate them loudly, never laying a hand on them, and of course it got the attention of all of us eating there. The kids wouldn't even look around. She left them at the table right beside mine to go to the bathroom and while she was gone, the smallest one, a boy, spilled his drink all over his lap, the table and his sister. Naturally they began to mop up the mess, but they were almost frantic about it, and I got up and helped them, noticing that they kept looking towards the bathroom and they actually seemed frightened. We got the mess cleaned up just as she came to the table. She never said a word to me. She grabbed the boy and marched him towards the door, saying "Well, now I have to go change your damn clothes!" She was pushing this small boy, being loud and hateful, and everyone was watching. Finally, I couldn't take it anymore and I went outside and there she was, holding the boy by HIS CHIN and shaking him.
He was crying and trying to get away. I asked her, very politely, if I could do anything to help to which she repied I could go f*** myself, that this was her kid and she could do as she d*** well pleased. I told her there was no reason for her to be speaking to me that way, that I had not said anything of that nature to her but I was offering to help since she seemed so upset. Well, she became even more upset, and apparently some one in the diner had called the cops because the next thing I know a patrol car shows up and the officer starts asking us what's going on. And then a lady from the diner comes out and it's a big mess. I gave the officer my name and number, paid for my lunch and left. I am not sure what happened, but no one called. Anyway, I just wanted to share this with you. I was scared silly I'd have to take this woman on physically, but all I could see was that little boy's terrified face. Isn't this sad? So many people out there who have the responsiblity of rearing children who shouldn't even be trusted with a dog.

 

[MySonsMom]

GLP: This is the same as if you choose to spank as a form of discipline....There are limits. You cross the line and you go into a very different territory....and it seems as though this Mother you are talking about has surpassed that line.

We all have limits, and it is a parents obligation to not cross them. But as we all know, it happens.

If my folks hadn't taught me consequences to every negative action, or gave me a handful of humiliation at times when needed it; I wouldn't be the woman and Mother I am today. And I thank God each day that I had the upbringing that I had. I was spanked when it needed to be done, and was embarrassed and humiliated at times in my life. THATS LIFE! Even as adults, we get embarrassed and humiliated....you learn how to deal with it and accept is as a part of life.

I'm sorry, but these shootings in our school system and the things that happen now in this world is getting the best of me! Let's look back at when we were children...can anyone recall a school shooting? Or as many teen pregnancies? Etc Etc.... I bet you can't, and if you can; it's scarce.

I know the reasons for the way it is today consists of alot of things, but most importantly society has taken away so many rights of parents. Children are not controlled and raised like they used to be. And some may argue my choice of word there "controlled", but that is exactly what they need. A child is learning, and without having boundaries they can turn into a loose cannon. It's just very sad. I wish things were like they used to be. *Most* of us can recall our childhood and wholeheartedly say, "My parent's raised me pretty well". The ones who say that will probably recognize the fact that their parents were strict, and probably got their arse whipped when you misbehaved, and first and foremost you RESPECTED your parents. The respect has been lost. If I misbehaved, my only concern was facing my parents with what I did....Not facing a lifetime in prison.

 

[glp9986]

You are exactly right! And yet, if my son goes out and let's say for instance, keys someone's car....guess who pays for the damage to be repaired? And what will people say? Didn't you teach this boy some discipline? Or, can't you control your child? I read somewhere that most children misbehave as a cry for attention. And it's difficult, in this day and age when both parents usually HAVE to work. I know, personally, some evenings I just feel overwhelmed with guilt that I didn't listen to my son read or maybe my other son had something he needed to talk about and I didn't get the hint. And when they're with their dad, I worry that HE isn't paying enough attention either. It's a vicious circle.

 

[digger65]

What does an obviously pshycotic animal have to do with legitimately disciplining your child? If a child does something to another individual, you make them apoligize to that person or perform tasks to make up for it (ie-broke the neighbor's window, send them to the neighbor to apoligize and have them rake leaves or water the neighbor's garden for a week). This is teaching humility. If a child is acting out, you remove them from the current environment (ie-take them home, to a restroom, to the car, etc...) and discipline in a manor appropriate for the behavior. Spilling a glass of milk would normally not involve discipline unless the child had been told repeatedly to settle down or stop doing something which resulted in the spilled milk (and perhaps sitting in the wet milk for a little while may help him remember the next time). Then, in private, you discipline the child. Children will have respect for their parents, others and themselves if they are taught discipline. But, not doing so is just part of this era of mom and dad being too concerned about mom and dad and not taking the necessary time for their children! No, this woman should not be allowed to raise a dog!! And no, both parent never HAVE to work. Make some personal sacrifices, get rid of the second car and the house with more bedrooms and bathrooms than you really need. Don't participate in the selfish act of divorce (unless abuse is involved, or your spouse left with nothing you could do about it). Children who misbehave as a way of life, probably are looking for attention (often, but not always, as a result of parental neglect), but all children (even the best) will do things requiring atleast mild discipline or a good talking to. They are not born knowing what to do and the best "roll-modelling" isn't usually enough. They learn bad things elsewhere.

[Edited by digger65 on 03-24-2001 at 09:21 AM]

 

[SLIPPERYSOAP]

My point in all of my posts was this.
When your child needs guildence you give it to them in an appropriate manner. Humility is a trate that we all need, you will not make in this world without it. I don't think Screaming at your children, hitting your children, or making them sit in the milk they just spilled will teach them the type of humility they need. It is one thing to take your child to a neighbor after braking their window and making them apoligize, and work off the debt of replacing the window, and Screaming at them in front of your neighbor, or spanking them in front of your neighbor or their friends. The problems that I see with those types of punishment are
1. They will resent you for it, and will do something worse just to push your buttons.
2. Low self esteam. This is a major problem with kids today. If you look at the recent school shootings and try to find charecteristic's you see that they were picked on. They couldn't take it anymore. ( the lastest school schooting that was near Santee the 18 year old was upset with his school vice principal for not allowing him to graduate, and he couldn't figure out any other way of handeling it)
3. With hitting your child they learn that is the way you correct bad behaior is to hit someone. A child in school is upset that another child has just stolen his toy, and what has he learned to do? A brother is upset with his sister so what does he do?
4. He doesn't learn how to handle dificult situations in an adult manner. He has no idea how to handle it when someone has hurt, or upset him. There is no diologe to straighten the situation, they think you either yell at the other person or hit them.
5. you need to get to the core of the problem and stop dealing with the symtoms of the problem. Hitting your child, or yelling at them will get their attention. Talking to your child will tell you what is wrong, and you will see better how to handle it.

I agree with the poster that said, that both parents don't need to work, at least to a point. There are situations were you don't need two people working. In those situations get rid of you extra car, down size on your house. For those who NEED to work (2) jobs you should set special time aside for your kids. ie.. they can't go outside on Saturday morning until you have spent 30 minutes talking about what has been going on. ( OR here's a novel idea..take your kids to church. They learn right from wrong there too.)
Put yourself in your kids shoes. For very little kids think about what they see when you hit them. With older kids what have they learned about dealing with someone who has hurt or upset them. Think long and hard from every point of view point before you act on your feelings.

 

[digger65]

Lost cause!!! You should never hit your child or scream at them. There is a BIG difference between spanking (which significant studies have shown does not instill violent behavior) and hitting or beating. Spend some time in the public schools and you will very quickly learn that you have no idea what is wrong with todays children. The problem is; NO DISCIPLINE, divorced parents, lack of adequate sleep, lack of adequate nurishment (too much SUGAR!!!!---breakfast cereals, fruit drinks, candy, soda, etc...), lack of adequate physical activity (too much T.V. and video games), lack of parental involvement (too wrapped up in their own lives and their new lovers), no religious affiliation, no sence of family belonging (because after all, mom is with the new stud and screw you if she needs her time with him--or dad), etc..etc...etc... Slipperysoap, you really should analyze what you read before you respond with mindless babble. This is what I mean by lacking the intellect to participate in a discussion!!!

 

[JAR]

Dear God, why didn't you save the children in Littleton, Colorado?Sincerley concerned student.Dear concerned student,I am not allowed in schoold sincerley god.Let's see someone said you better not reeaad the bible in school, the bible that says "thou shall not kill, thou shall not steal" and "love thy neighbor as yourself" and we said ok Dr Spock saaid we shouldn't spank our kids when they misbehave because it may warp their little personalities and we said ok then someone said let's let our daughters have abortions if they want,and we won't make them tell their parents and we said thats a grand idea and some wise school board member said since boys will be boys anyway let's give our sons all the condoms they want so they can have all the fun they desire and we won't tell parents they got them at school and we said that's another great idea. Then the entertainment industry said let's make tv shows and movies that promote profanity, violence and illicit sex and lets record music that encourages rape,drugs,murder,suicide,and satanic themes and we said it's just entertainment and it has no adverse effect and nobody takes it seriously anyway, so go right ahead. Now we're asking ourselves why our children have no conscience, why they don't know right from wrong,and why it doesn't bother them to kill strangers,classmates, or even themselves. Undoubtedly,if we thought about it long and hard enough, we could figure it out. I'm sure it has a great deal to do with....we reap what we sow!
There is so much out there that we as parents have no control over that if the boundries and the dicipline don't start young, how ever you see fit (outside of abuse), it is like a snow ball effect it just keeps getting worse and worse until you get to the point that no matter how good of a parent you are or if you have the "best" type of dicipline we will no longer have any say in our childrens lives.

 

[digger65]

Finally..a voice of reason!!! All part of parents being to involved in their own lives to do what's right and best for their child. These are the reasons why my children now attend private school (reguardless of cost) they only go to friend's houses if their parents beliefs align with ours, and there are very few television shows I allow them to watch!!! And no, this still isn't enough. Please, JAR, share this with everyone you encounter. If they don't want to hear it, say it louder!!!

The First Ammendment to the Constitution says nothing about a separation of church and state. It says that the government will not establish a religion!! It also says the government will not prohibit the free expression of religion or abridge our freedom of speech. We need to end the election and appointment of judges who refuse the see the First Ammendment for what it really is. If you believe in God, it doesn't apply to you. I guess we still have judgement day on our sides.

[Edited by digger65 on 03-26-2001 at 08:24 AM]