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Accused of Racism

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nativedancer12

Junior Member
What is the name of your state?What is the name of your state? We are in CA.

Our native american (tribe unrecognized) dance/cultural diffusion group was the resident dance group at a cultural center for roughly five years, since its grand opening. Our elder had even taken part in the groundbreaking ceremony for the center, in which he presented an offering, etc.

We used to hold practice dance ceremonies, which are highly regarded as sacred; as soon as we begin, we say a prayer, invoke the four directions and "close" the circle and do not open it up until we are usually done.

Often times our ceremonies would bring attention to passers-by, due to the loud drumming, which was fine. We always welcome "spectatorship," so as long as they respect the circle in the same manner as he or she would when entering a church or synagogue.

One afternoon, a white woman and her daughter came around, our circle had already closed (we usually don't talk to folks on the outside -- the circle is "closed", standard NA ceremonial protocol) when she wanted her daughter to come in and dance. The elder, trying to avoid a conversation then because of the seriousness of our ceremonies, told her briefly to wait until we were through. The woman got upset, the daughter (I believe) she began to cry, and they stormed out of the area.

She then wrote a letter to the exec director of the center (being new herself, only a few months at that time) ranting about her "experience" on the basis of racism.

This same exec director in response, desecrated a later ceremony (by walking into our closed circle), with guards standing by at three entrances, and had us leave, including the elder.

The elder had previously tried to explain himself, though since they were both of the same ethnicity, it was believed she would have understood such sacred protocol. Apparently not.

Do we have any recourse? Thanks in advance for any insight.
 


HomeGuru

Senior Member
nativedancer12 said:
What is the name of your state?What is the name of your state? We are in CA.

Our native american (tribe unrecognized) dance/cultural diffusion group was the resident dance group at a cultural center for roughly five years, since its grand opening. Our elder had even taken part in the groundbreaking ceremony for the center, in which he presented an offering, etc.

We used to hold practice dance ceremonies, which are highly regarded as sacred; as soon as we begin, we say a prayer, invoke the four directions and "close" the circle and do not open it up until we are usually done.

Often times our ceremonies would bring attention to passers-by, due to the loud drumming, which was fine. We always welcome "spectatorship," so as long as they respect the circle in the same manner as he or she would when entering a church or synagogue.

One afternoon, a white woman and her daughter came around, our circle had already closed (we usually don't talk to folks on the outside -- the circle is "closed", standard NA ceremonial protocol) when she wanted her daughter to come in and dance. The elder, trying to avoid a conversation then because of the seriousness of our ceremonies, told her briefly to wait until we were through. The woman got upset, the daughter (I believe) she began to cry, and they stormed out of the area.

She then wrote a letter to the exec director of the center (being new herself, only a few months at that time) ranting about her "experience" on the basis of racism.

This same exec director in response, desecrated a later ceremony (by walking into our closed circle), with guards standing by at three entrances, and had us leave, including the elder.

The elder had previously tried to explain himself, though since they were both of the same ethnicity, it was believed she would have understood such sacred protocol. Apparently not.

Do we have any recourse? Thanks in advance for any insight.
**A: did this occur on a public or private property?
 
What are you trying to achieve? Are you trying to prevent people from disrupting your circles in the future? Are you trying to get monetary damages? From whom? I gotta tell you, I don't see any basis for any legal action based on what I understand. I'm not seeing any basis for a libel case. It sounds like the letter was private and was an expression of her subjective feelings.

It sounds like there are some misunderstandings, bad blood, etc., that are better dealt with outside of the legal system. It sounds like the elder, the executive director, and whatever relevant parties need to sit down and agree to a solution.
 

BelizeBreeze

Senior Member
laurathelawyer said:
What are you trying to achieve? Are you trying to prevent people from disrupting your circles in the future? Are you trying to get monetary damages? From whom? I gotta tell you, I don't see any basis for any legal action based on what I understand. I'm not seeing any basis for a libel case. It sounds like the letter was private and was an expression of her subjective feelings.
Who said anything about libel?
It sounds like there are some misunderstandings, bad blood, etc., that are better dealt with outside of the legal system. It sounds like the elder, the executive director, and whatever relevant parties need to sit down and agree to a solution.
I guess you missed a real attorney's relevant question. Look hard. There is a reason it was asked.
 
BelizeBreeze said:
Who said anything about libel?
This thread is posted in the "Libel/Slander/Defamation" forum. The title of the thread is "accused of racism." That indicates that he wants to know whether the accusation of racism constituted defamation.
I guess you missed a real attorney's relevant question. Look hard. There is a reason it was asked.
What is up with the random personal attacks? Lawsuits should be used as a last resort. It is a perfectly reasonable opinion that this conflict has not reached the point where a lawsuit is necessary. Bad lawyers try to find ways to sue; good lawyers try to find ways to solve their clients' problems.
 

BelizeBreeze

Senior Member
laurathelawyer said:
This thread is posted in the "Libel/Slander/Defamation" forum. The title of the thread is "accused of racism." That indicates that he wants to know whether the accusation of racism constituted defamation.
O.K. I'll humor the quasi-attorney. No one mentioned racism except you. now, again, who mentioned racism?
What is up with the random personal attacks?
If you mean by me calling you out based on your posting history here and demanding you prove you are an attorney as you have stated although, in your own words, you don't know if you're licensed in a particular state or anything about law then yes, I'll attack your ignorance.

If you have not yet been contacted by the administrator of this forum you will be soon. And then you can either prove to them your standing in ANY bar association or be banned (or worse) from this site.
Lawsuits should be used as a last resort. It is a perfectly reasonable opinion that this conflict has not reached the point where a lawsuit is necessary. Bad lawyers try to find ways to sue; good lawyers try to find ways to solve their clients' problems.
And wannabe lawyers come on a forum such as this professing they are, in fact, attorneys without the foggiest idea of what a statute is or how to look it up.

Your time is just about over here.
 
BelizeBreeze said:
O.K. I'll humor the quasi-attorney. No one mentioned racism except you. now, again, who mentioned racism?
What thread are you posting in? (Hint: Look at the top left corner of your browser.)
Your time is just about over here.
Yeah, considering that so many of the regular posters seem to spend their time making personal attacks rather than providing any useful information, I don't have much of an interest in continuing to contribute here.
 
BelizeBreeze said:
And then you can either prove to them your standing in ANY bar association or be banned (or worse) from this site.
What does this mean? What action are you threatening against me? By the way, not all lawyers are members of bar associations.
 

Shay-Pari'e

Senior Member
laurathelawyer said:
What does this mean? What action are you threatening against me? By the way, not all lawyers are members of bar associations.
So now you are going to say that you are not member of the bar? You don't know what kind of attorney you are, and you don't know what state you are licensed in, so this is no big surprise.
 
--PARIDISE-- said:
So now you are going to say that you are not member of the bar? You don't know what kind of attorney you are, and you don't know what state you are licensed in, so this is no big surprise.
State courts regulate lawyers. Some states do this through mandatory membership in the state bar association; in others, bar associations are just like clubs that you can chose to join. Why don't you do some research before making accusations?

I guess you are expecting me to reveal my name and bar membership and will keep attacking me until I do so. I am not interested in revealing personal information on a public forum that would allow people to find me, especially when the people requesting it are openly hostile and one is making unspecified threats.
 

BelizeBreeze

Senior Member
laurathelawyer said:
What does this mean? What action are you threatening against me? By the way, not all lawyers are members of bar associations.
You have already been contacted by the administrator of this site so playing dumb (except for your postings thus far) is not going to work.

The next time you attempt to impersonate an attorney don't do it on a legal forum.
 
BelizeBreeze said:
You have already been contacted by the administrator of this site so playing dumb (except for your postings thus far) is not going to work.
What action could a moderator take that is worse than banning? That was my question. Banning is the extent of their powers, so I can't imagine what kind of action you are threatening.
 
--PARIDISE-- said:
Research what? What I said was, I was not surprised that you are now going to say you are not a member.
I never implied that I was a member of a bar association. It is your ignorance of the legal profession that caused you to assume that.
No, frankly I am not interested in who you are.
I guess it was my assumption that you wanted evidence that I was licensed to practice law. Apparently you just want to attack me and don't care about getting to the truth.
I am also not attacking you.
You don't consider following me from thread to thread to call me a liar an attack? Name-calling and accusations of unethical behavior are just normal, polite interactions for you. You have pretty low standards for civilized behavior.
I do not for one second think you are a lawyer, and lawyers on this forum are questioning it also.
I would be interested in hearing from them. Your questioning of my claim of being an attorney is based on your ignorance of the law and the legal profession, but I would expect better from an attorney. Like I said, it's pretty hard to fake being an attorney to another attorney.
 
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